Information on Clan Urquhart 1890

daveaustin44
1st March 2009, 02:37
Divers off the dutch coast have found a ships bell for Clan Urquhart 1890 has anyone any information on this vessel.

eriskay
1st March 2009, 03:02
The Mirimar website has the following information :

In August 2008 a turret ship wreck was discovered just N of Schiermonnikoog Is & divers recovered the ship's bell of CLAN URQUHART. It is probable that the ship was resold from Stettin and foundered on her way to a Dutch or Belgian scrapyard in late 1933

The thing that doesn't add up, however, is the date '1890'. The first Clan Urquhart was built in 1899 and went for breaking at the end of her life, rather than having sunk.

Could the date '1890' be a typo and should actually read '1899' ? If so, then it would certainly seem it was the first Clan Urquhart's bell.

Was it just the bell that they found on that dive ?

eriskay
1st March 2009, 10:15
Have now checked the excellent publication by V. McClymont & W. J. Harvey, "From Clans To Kings & Castles" - the Cayzer, Irvine history - and this informs there were three 'Clan Urquharts', 1899 / 1911 / 1944, and confirms the first of these was of turret construction. Thus, it would seem like this is your ship?

macca57
1st March 2009, 21:34
Clan Urquhart 1 was demolished in 1933 at Stettiner Odenwerke A.G., Stettin.

macca57
1st March 2009, 22:00
O.N. 111219. 5,855g. 3,757n. 440.0 x 51.6 x 28.9 feet.
T.3-Cyl. (27", 45"& 75"x 60") engine made by the shipbuilder. 435 NHP.
22.8.1899: Launched by Wm. Doxford & Sons Ltd., Sunderland (Yard No. 272), for The Clan Line
Steamers Ltd., (Cayzer, Irvine & Company, managers). 9.1899: Completed. 1899: Sold to Sir
Charles W Cayzer, David Rennie and James MacKenzie, (same managers). 1.7.1907: Managers
restyled as Cayzer, Irvine & Company Ltd. 1913: Sold to The Clan Line Steamers Ltd, (same
managers). 4.11.1915 until 30.6.1917: Expeditionary Force Transport No. G.81, moving
Canadian stores. 1.7.1917 until 31.8.1917: Wheat for the Royal Commission. 1.9.1917 until
17.10.1917: Collier Transport No. 1740. 18.10.1917 until 5.3.1918: Commercial Branch, on
military service transporting nitrates from Chile. 6.3.1918 until 13.4.1918: Expeditionary Force
Transport No. G.81, moving forage from Marseilles to Salonika. 14.4.1918 until 2.8.1918: Rice
from Burma. 3.8.1918 until 26.7.1919: Liner Requisition Scheme. 1929: Sold to Emil R.
Retzlaff, Germany, and renamed GENERALDIREKTOR SONNENSCHEIN. 1931: Sold to W.
Kuntsmann, Germany. 1933: Sold to Stettiner Odenwerke A. G., Stettin for demolition.

Banni
3rd March 2009, 21:21
In addition to the info given by Macca, the Clan Urquhart was sold by the british government to Emil R Retzlaff for 12,000. There is a photo of her in the Manchester Ship Canal in the book Clan Line Illustrated Fleet History.

BillH
4th March 2009, 18:01
An erroneous statement.
It was The Clan Liner Steamers Ltd that sold her for 12,000 and NOT the British Government.

Additionally she is reported as having demolition undertaken in 3rd Quarter of 1933.

That being the case what sunk vessel was the bell of the CLAN URQUHART on?

Moreso was it a genuine original bell or a replica?

Too many loose end to say for certainty methinks

Bill

eriskay
5th March 2009, 09:46
As you say, too many loose ends for any certainty. The image of the bronze bell certainly appears genuine enough. Could be that the reported demolition in 1933 is accurate enough, just not complete, i.e. there was a subsequent development that may not have been reported/recorded, e.g. sold on by the Stettin breaker to another breaker and she foundered on her way there? Not an impossible theory and would fit the fact the divers discovered a 'turret-construction wreck' and retrieved a bell marked 'Clan Urquhart - 1899'. As is well known, Sunderland (Doxford) and Clan Line were synonomous with turret construction at the turn of the century.

Clearly, Dave Austin has quoted the incorrect date of 1890 in his original enquiry and somewhat surprisingly he has not revisited the thread since he started it, it would be good to hear from him again as perhaps he has other information that would throw more light on the matter and explain the mystery

Personally I have little doubt in my own mind that the vessel wreck that they discovered was indeed the 1890 Sunderland-built 'Clan Urquhart', I guess the proof positive can only be with reference and evidence from the diving outfit that claim to have found her.

Just love another of life's great marine mysteries !

Banni
5th March 2009, 20:55
Bill

Read the text wrong, sorry.

Also it states it was sold to a company from Stettin for breaking up and the books I have looked at only state when it was broken up and not where, I can only assume Stettin, which is a long way from Holland!

daveaustin44
5th March 2009, 21:38
Sorry guys my questions were from a point of ignorance and not knowledge, The question was asked of me from aman who is a friend of Doxford Engines, he in turn was asked for information by the guy who found the bell.

daveaustin44
6th March 2009, 23:51
I have been informed today that the diver was going to dive the wreck again this year and will let us know what he finds.