C - Class differences

excadet
6th July 2009, 00:48
Cretic, Carnatic , Cedric ,Canopic,Cymric, all more or less identical,
how were they externally differant, what detales identified each ship apart from its name,
As I am planning a model and would like to build the right ship.

John.H.Clark
6th July 2009, 10:17
Hi fellow ex-cadet.
I was only on Coptic, Illyric and Athenic ( relieved in London on DM ) so cannot give any direct experience. I am trying to build Coptic and have collected several photographs but miss most of the detail from the open decks. NMM Greenwich have no plans. I have found photos on ebay and have also purchased from a professional photographer in NZ. Let me know if you want details. Are you in touch with the Shaw Savill Society ? Do any of the C appear in the Snowbow films ? I put the only on-board picture that I have of Cymric on this site. I have put my Coptic pictures into the hands of a professional model maker, who will use these to prepare plans for me.
all the best
John
PS Were you at a sea school before joining Shaw Savill ?

gadgee
6th July 2009, 20:33
excadet

Richard P. De Kerbrech in his book The Shaw Savill Line states that Canopic being one of the last of the C class to be built(1954) has "just a hint of streamlining". Canopic and Carnatic(1957) were the last two completed. I think there is a discussion somewhere in Gallery about the differences within the class. I would suggest that you take the time to search Gallery for pictures of all five and read the comments beneath. That may take a while however!!

excadet
6th July 2009, 23:05
I'd better start rumaging , and fish out the book,
From asking the Shaw Savill Society, I believe they may have a plan of one of the 1928 ish built sisters of which coptic was one.

Ben

John.H.Clark
8th July 2009, 17:05
Ben

thanks for the suggestion . I have posted a very slightly different view of Cymric

John

saintfield
10th July 2009, 09:02
I sailed in Carnatic, Drina(Cretic),Durango (Cymric) and stood by Cedric, I cant remember any significant external differences, internally I seem to think there was some difference in accommodation layout/designation. I think Carnatic had more refridgerated lockers in the tween decks than her older sisters? did they all have deep tanks in 6LH? im not sure??
Rgds
Saintfield

Stephen J. Card
10th July 2009, 10:29
Cretic, Carnatic , Cedric ,Canopic,Cymric, all more or less identical,
how were they externally differant, what detales identified each ship apart from its name,
As I am planning a model and would like to build the right ship.


I can't say the following are the only differences but perhaps the most visual differences...

Look at the forward end of the saloon deck with the plated in bulwarks. The last pair of ships differs very slightly from the first pair in the style of the openings above the bulwark. As Richard de Kerbrech describes it... 'streamlining'.

Likewise, the I class each had differences in this area... in addition to differences to main deck bulwarks, masting, number of boats, anchors etc.

The Cs and Is I consider to be some of the most attractive cargo ships ever built. Simple, sturdy lines. No nonsense and very handsome. The only thing that the design couldn't handle was poor paint schemes. They definitely needed the white hull stripe and looked best in the early Savill's livery with all buff masts. The Furness all grey livery on the Is was dreadful.

Carnatic as Darro in Royal Mail livery looked great, but Drina didn't because she lost the white hull stripe. I think the worst combination was Desado with all grey hull and upperwwork with a Royal Mail funnel.

I wonder who put forward sugestions to alter company paint schems? An accountant trying to save a few dollars or some disgruntled Chief Officer who thought he could save some of his time but not having to make up a paint list every month! I've always felt that paint is paint and the only extra cost is for the time involved in cutting in different ccolours. At the end of the day it probably made zero differeence to the 'bottom line'.

Stephen

Terry Willcox
8th August 2009, 15:46
Another C Ship was the Ceramic. I did a voyage on her on 20th June - 11th Sept, 1967 as Veg Cook, I had a great time on her, the few things that I remember is, the Rum issue ( don't drink spirits so I exchanged mine for cans of beer ). I was the crews barber, and cut the hair to supplement my beer issue. Take care........ Terry Willcox.(H)

gadgee
8th August 2009, 18:13
Hi Terry
Regret Ceramic was not one of the C class mentioned in this thread. Shaw Savill C class has always been regarded as Cretic, Carnatic, Cedric, Canopic, Cymric - all sisters.

Steeping
10th August 2009, 15:02
I seem to remember that Ceramic and her sisters were know as " The Bic IC's "

GWB
10th August 2009, 16:00
Also the big IC's where steam ships and had another three ships along same lines,Persic, Suvic, Runic, these three had no passenger accommodation built along same lines.

GWB

EMJAYESS
29th March 2012, 17:41
Also the big IC's where steam ships and had another three ships along same lines,Persic, Suvic, Runic, these three had no passenger accommodation built along same lines.

GWB

You may wish to revise that quote when the British and Irish Lions wipe you next year ..... yes in your own backyard!

alaric
11th January 2015, 18:29
I sailed in Carnatic, Drina(Cretic),Durango (Cymric) and stood by Cedric, I cant remember any significant external differences, internally I seem to think there was some difference in accommodation layout/designation. I think Carnatic had more refridgerated lockers in the tween decks than her older sisters? did they all have deep tanks in 6LH? im not sure??
Rgds
Saintfield

Have just been trawling through old SS&A threads and came across your query regarding deep tanks. I believe none of the "C" class were built with tallow deep tanks in #6 hold, but I was on Canopic when they were fitted by Smith's Dock in North Shields in June/July 1964. I believe that at least two of the other "C"s were also modified, but am not sure which. I did a coastal on Cretic in 1968, but can't now remember if she had deep tanks.
Incidentally, the biggest difference between the "C"s was that Cretic was Doxford powered, the other 4 were fitted with H&W-B&W engines, but this was not apparent from outward appearance.

saintfield
12th January 2015, 06:59
Carnatic also had the deep tanks with heating coils for carriage of tallow fitted in #6 hold.

waiwera
12th January 2015, 09:43
I can confirm that Cretic had deep tanks for carrying cargo such as tallow. I can remember a very long Sunday in Port ( Melbourne I think) where I had been tasked , as a cadet, to spend the whole day monitoring and recording temperatures in the deep tanks. Cannot remember if this was a requirement prior to discharge but can just remember it as being a very long cargo watch with everyone else ashore enjoying themselves! Amazing the trivia we can still remember after fifty years but cannot remember some things that happened last week!

duncan montgomery
12th January 2015, 09:55
I sailed in The Cymric and the Carnatic the crews accommodation was different between th two plus on deck if I remember rightly the carnatic at some hatches she had rechit gear for some of her derricks instead of the cymrics lower by bitts on the deck so there was a difference in the topping lifts between the two ships . cheers Duncan

greg sorich
24th January 2015, 11:33
Mate good to see you are still kicking , you were AB on Carnatic when she was on Crusader run NZ-Japan I was the Kiwi deck boy, would love to catch up !

BobGrif
24th January 2015, 21:46
.............. They definitely needed the white hull stripe and looked best in the early Savill's livery with all buff masts. ....................

I wonder who put forward sugestions to alter company paint schems? An accountant trying to save a few dollars or some disgruntled Chief Officer who thought he could save some of his time but not having to make up a paint list every month! I've always felt that paint is paint and the only extra cost is for the time involved in cutting in different colours. At the end of the day it probably made zero difference to the 'bottom line'.

Stephen

Well, I have only got to this after a few years since it was posted :)

Hint .... the latter conclusion concerning your final 'wonderings' about responsibility for the initial demise of the white line is pretty near the mark, but not quite on point.

There is also further history to it; it was one of the first visible indication of the massive upheavals that were to come in the Furness Group, its eventual demise, and that of the 'old' ways of British shipping and shipping companies.