Fyffes Line

Andyroo
23rd September 2005, 16:35
Any one from the 'M' boats before being sold on in the 80's

R58484956
23rd September 2005, 16:41
Go into forums and put in Elders, there are quite a few E & F sailors on that thread.

John Rogers
23rd September 2005, 19:44
Never on a "M' boat but sailed on the "A", "B" and "C"
ARIGUANI, BAYANO,CORRALES,and the CAVINA . Oh!! Happy days.
John

KevinR
16th January 2006, 16:12
I was C/Engr. on the Manzanares and Musa for a while. All the banana ports were a good run ashore, especially Golfito!

Basil
4th February 2006, 18:33
Seem to recollect Puerto Cortes being an amusing little place - at any time of the day or night (*))

Jim S
22nd February 2006, 22:58
Seem to recollect Puerto Cortes being an amusing little place - at any time of the day or night (*))

An occupational hazard when sailing on Bayano and Barranca (the wee container ships) - there every week !!

Jim S
22nd February 2006, 23:04
Hi Guys,
Anyone fancy submitting names of those BOT aquaintances that we sailed with in Fyffes as has been done by the Brocklebank boys ? (of which I once was before Fyffes)

terence
22nd February 2006, 23:28
its still sad to see ships u have been on gone to the breakers chirripo chicanoa changuinola chuscal chuscal only ten years old thats o .p ,e , c. for u ?

Andyroo
23rd February 2006, 01:01
Hi Jim S
Been back to Cortes since Barranca & Bayano as surveyor ,unfortunately social diseases have taken their toll of the usual watering holes. Getting a lot more civilised unfortunately.

trevorw3740
23rd February 2006, 20:16
Never on a "M' boat but sailed on the "A", "B" and "C"
ARIGUANI, BAYANO,CORRALES,and the CAVINA . Oh!! Happy days.
John
Did my first trip to sea on "Ariguani" in March, 1955 - I was 2nd R/O

Regards

Trevor

John Rogers
23rd February 2006, 22:06
That was a couple of years after me Trevor,we gave her and her sisters the name of "The Sea Going Coalmines" 24 fires back to back.
John

Jim S
23rd February 2006, 22:19
I attach a list of postings on Fyffes Line ships early 1974.

In order to make the print clearer I have divided the page into three sections
Part 1. Barranca, Bayano, Darien, Davao, Magdalena, Manistee
Part 2. Manzanares, MAtina, Mazatec, Morant, Motagua, Musa
Part 3. Patuca, Rio Cobre, Roatan, Ronde, Tucurinca, Turrialba

Doug H
24th February 2006, 02:20
Jim S: No Radio Officers??

trotterdotpom
24th February 2006, 07:56
Jim S: No Radio Officers??

Fyffes ROs were from Radio Companies (Marconi I think) so probably not known to whoever printed the lists. I sailed on Morant in the '70s as a 'Freelance' and wasn't on the list, I did however, have a fine time

John T.

Jim S
24th February 2006, 19:20
Jim S: No Radio Officers??

This was a Fyffes circular and omitted R/Os as they were not direct employees of Fyffes.

As an aside, a good many years ago, and I cannot now remember the ship.
But I recall a newspaper report that a Fyffes ship had sailed up the US East Coast without an R/O. I believe they had left a sick R/O at a previous port.
Possibly the thinking had been that they would be in VHF contact on passage up the coast but this cut no ice with US authorities and were fined for the breach.

trotterdotpom
24th February 2006, 23:44
This was a Fyffes circular and omitted R/Os as they were not direct employees of Fyffes.

As an aside, a good many years ago, and I cannot now remember the ship.
But I recall a newspaper report that a Fyffes ship had sailed up the US East Coast without an R/O. I believe they had left a sick R/O at a previous port.
Possibly the thinking had been that they would be in VHF contact on passage up the coast but this cut no ice with US authorities and were fined for the breach.

Could this have been Morant? I joined her in dodgy circumstances in Genoa (story already posted elsewhere on site). She had previously been trading up the US west coast and RO had got into trouble with white powdery substances purchased in Central America.

John T.

Jim S
25th February 2006, 17:12
Could this have been Morant? I joined her in dodgy circumstances in Genoa (story already posted elsewhere on site). She had previously been trading up the US west coast and RO had got into trouble with white powdery substances purchased in Central America.

John T.

Could well have been - I was not with Fyffes by then and it was just one of these things that caught the eye in a newspaper - the passing years have clouded the detail.

Surprised at the "white powdery substances " - in my day ganja was the halucinate of choise. I suppose that is "progress" . On Camito we would often get a passenger or two from Jamaica with one way ticket to Bermuda - little did they know, or perhaps did not care, that they were under suspicion. They were clever operators though and would engage some assistance from the galley staff and just off Bermuda a choreographed dumping of galley slops would take place at the same time as the packages of ganja was dumped to be picked up by waiting boats. The galley refuse being intended to distract the patrolling police launches.

Andyroo
26th February 2006, 13:40
This was a Fyffes circular and omitted R/Os as they were not direct employees of Fyffes.

As an aside, a good many years ago, and I cannot now remember the ship.
But I recall a newspaper report that a Fyffes ship had sailed up the US East Coast without an R/O. I believe they had left a sick R/O at a previous port.
Possibly the thinking had been that they would be in VHF contact on passage up the coast but this cut no ice with US authorities and were fined for the breach.

can coinfirm as on vessel @ time as 2/0. charterers paid up as cargo urgent. passage was from Golfito to Albany via canal. Illness was not drug related.

trotterdotpom
26th February 2006, 14:02
can coinfirm as on vessel @ time as 2/0. charterers paid up as cargo urgent. passage was from Golfito to Albany via canal. Illness was not drug related.

Thanks Andy, obviously a different episode.

John t.

dondoncarp
2nd March 2006, 20:24
Any one from the 'M' boats before being sold on in the 80's
I was on Mazatec late 83 Golly,Tela,ETC.........Happy Days,Now where did i put that pure coconut oil,suns coming out!

Jim S
12th March 2006, 19:34
I have listed the names of Fyffes Line staff that I remember during my time with the company from late 1967 until mid 1974 to see if it awakens any memories, good or bad. I apologise in advance that the names I remember are predominately engineering.
Eng Supts;- Frank Parsons, Bob Thomson, Tommy Chambers, Derek Griffiths.
Chief Engs;- "Sam" Greedy, John Smith, "Silias" Hall, Pat Stockbridge, Frank Meredith, Andy Beveridge, Brian? Clarricoates, ? De Rozario. Pat "Snecky" Inverarity.
2nd Engs;- Pat Carey
Elects;- Eric Taylor, George Briggs, Ken Carlisle, Hugh King, Mike Ryan, ? Williams, "Spider" Webb, Ernie Stanhope.
Refrig Engs;- Jimmy Leatherbarrow, Trevor Owen, Kevin Murphy or might have been Murray, Benny Banks, his brother Bobby Banks.
Captains;- Chubb, Hamilton, Thomson, the one from Arran, there was another "Aberdeen" Thomson, Hill, Dole, Young, Morris, Booth, Hodges, and Evans.
Gilbert who was Mate became Master before I left.
Pat Carey became Chief Eng on Rio Cobre.
Marcus Bowden who was 3rd Eng on Camito became Chief Eng on Barranca and when I last heard was with the Dutch based " "White Ships" Ship Management Co.
"Sam" Greedy became Supt and then Operations Manager before the demise of Fyffes.
I heard from Marcus Bowden a couple of years ago that some of the above have passed away. Tommy Chambers, Frank Meredith, Eric Taylor, Hugh King,
Jimmy Leatherbarrow and in tragic circumstances while still serving Bobby Banks.

Torrin
2nd April 2006, 18:03
Jim

I sailed on three M boats in the late seventies early eighties the first was the Magdelana John Smith was the chief engineer if i remember he was from Liverpool and very much into boxing . He liked to practice with anyone who would take him on. My last trip with Fyffes was on the Barranca and Marcus Bowden was the chief in 1982

Regards Alan

Jim S
2nd April 2006, 21:27
Alan,
I sailed with John Smith C/Eng on Chicanoa in 1968. He never got anyone to take him on at boxing then. He and the 3rd Eng played deck tennis every morning. John Smith's policy was to intimidate his opponent by aiming the quoit at his face. He always liked to win. Liked to be seen as a bully but it was all an act. One day the Electrician locked himself in his cabin and would not come out until C/Eng apologised.
Marcus Bowden was 3rd Eng on Camito - I was very pleased to hear many years after I had left Fyffes that Marcus had got his Chief's ticket.

Three trips on an M-class ship you were a glutton for punishment.

Jim S

ps I have added an incident that I had with CPP on Motagua to my picture of Motagua in Gallery

Torrin
3rd April 2006, 15:26
Jim

It could have been worse when I first joined Fyffes they asked me to join the Darien in Japan. Fortunately or unfortunately suppose which way you look at it she had a major engineroom fire of the coast of Japan. No one hurt I think but she was towed to a Japanese port for repair, on joining the Magdelana in Genoa everyone on board said I was very lucky to have missed the Darien.

Jim you might be able to answer this, one of the M boats hit an uncharted reef in the carribean sea and she had to be towed to Savanha for dry dock and repairs. The old man was highly thought of by crew on the Motagua. I think his first name was Emyln ?
Apparantly there is a statue on this reef dedicated to three scotsmen who lost there lives there.

Cheers Alan

Jim S
3rd April 2006, 20:05
Jim

It could have been worse when I first joined Fyffes they asked me to join the Darien in Japan. Fortunately or unfortunately suppose which way you look at it she had a major engineroom fire of the coast of Japan. No one hurt I think but she was towed to a Japanese port for repair, on joining the Magdelana in Genoa everyone on board said I was very lucky to have missed the Darien.

Jim you might be able to answer this, one of the M boats hit an uncharted reef in the carribean sea and she had to be towed to Savanha for dry dock and repairs. The old man was highly thought of by crew on the Motagua. I think his first name was Emyln ?
Apparantly there is a statue on this reef dedicated to three scotsmen who lost there lives there.

Cheers Alan
Yes you were lucky Darien and sister Davao were fine looking ships but engine wise they were dogs. The previous German owners were glad to get rid of them.
About the M-Class grounding and Master's name - I don't know but I know a man who might. Will let you know.
Jim S

Andyroo
4th April 2006, 15:46
The old mans name was Emlyn Jones from Congleton,( good skin) & before he was dismissed from the ship , praise was bestowed on him for the valiant way that he got the ship off the reef sustaining only minimal damage.
The funniest thing of that but was nearly tragic was that when the relief master, superintendent & Co wer flying to the stricken vessel, their light aircraft had to ditch into the water & all concerned arrived looking like "man fridays". The only concern from the super before sacking Emlyn or the well being of his co-travellers was that he had to get to a phone to cancel the company credit cards that were currently being probably digested by a "nobby" as he spoke.

Scottseng
20th April 2006, 00:20
I sailed with Fyffes on the following ships Chicanoa sept.61 to jan.62 Telde feb.62 to aug.62 Tetela oct.62 to apr.63 Tucurinca sept.63 to jan64 Tenadores jul.64 to feb.65 Changuinola sept.65 to jan66 Chicanoa feb66 to may66 Changuinola feb67 to oct67 Turrialba dec67 to june68 Camito aug68 todec68.
Captains sailed with Morris,Howell,Nicholson,Chubb,Cruickshank,Hamilton ,Hodges,Wallis and Arran Thomson.
C/Eng sailed with
Pashley,Peach,Balls,Inverarity,Stockbridge,Purdon and Greedy.
2/Eng I can remember
Mason,Fairgreives. There was one from Renfrew Alastair who was drowned along with his father and brother on the old Lochinvar.
Also a leckie Ken Harper
The supers were Parsons,Thomson,Tommie Chambers and Reggie Raines
Jimmy Leatherbarrow was on one the T boats as third and Camito as C/Frig.

Jim S
20th April 2006, 21:10
I sailed with Fyffes on the following ships Chicanoa sept.61 to jan.62 Telde feb.62 to aug.62 Tetela oct.62 to apr.63 Tucurinca sept.63 to jan64 Tenadores jul.64 to feb.65 Changuinola sept.65 to jan66 Chicanoa feb66 to may66 Changuinola feb67 to oct67 Turrialba dec67 to june68 Camito aug68 todec68.
Captains sailed with Morris,Howell,Nicholson,Chubb,Cruickshank,Hamilton ,Hodges,Wallis and Arran Thomson.
C/Eng sailed with
Pashley,Peach,Balls,Inverarity,Stockbridge,Purdon and Greedy.
2/Eng I can remember
Mason,Fairgreives. There was one from Renfrew Alastair who was drowned along with his father and brother on the old Lochinvar.
Also a leckie Ken Harper
The supers were Parsons,Thomson,Tommie Chambers and Reggie Raines
Jimmy Leatherbarrow was on one the T boats as third and Camito as C/Frig.
I must have sailed with you on Camito - I joined her in late October 1968 for eight consecutive trips until end June 1969 as 2nd Eng. After study leave I rejoined her in December 1969 until end March 1970, End Sept 1970 until end Feb 1971 and April 1971 until Sept 1971. In total 22 trips as 2nd Eng.
In March/April 1972 On gaining Chief's ticket I did a trip as C/Eng on Camito before joining new container ship Bayano for motorship time.
I sailed with C/Engs Sam Greedy and Pat Stockbridge and with Jimmy Leatherbarrow on Camito - I heard a couple of years ago that Jimmy was dead.
He was a great lad - with a bit of encouragement Jimmy and Elaine one of the two stewardesses would put on an excellent display of the Zorba the Greek Dance.

Scottseng
21st April 2006, 11:56
The 2/eng. I was with was Welsh, and he was volunteer on one of the narrow gauge railways in Wales which is now fully preserved.
When I left the Camito, she was in for refit and the engineers were lodged in the Eastleigh Hotel.

Jim S
21st April 2006, 19:04
The 2/eng. I was with was Welsh, and he was volunteer on one of the narrow gauge railways in Wales which is now fully preserved.
When I left the Camito, she was in for refit and the engineers were lodged in the Eastleigh Hotel.
Hi
With all due respect I think you must have your dates wrong. I have my Discharge Book in front of me which shows me as signing on 31st Oct 1968 and thereafter at monthly intervals until 29th June 1969 for the first eight consecutive voyages. Camito was drydocked in November to early December 1971 on the Tyne.

Regards

Jim S

Scottseng
21st April 2006, 23:22
Hello Jim S
I also have my discharge book in front of me and I signed on 31st Oct. 1968 and off 26th nov. 1968. I was 3/rd eng.
I was contact in Kingston for Appleton Estate and we used to crack open a bottle every night at 1800hrs. in Sam Greedys cabin. The company included C/frig,C/steward and Leckie.
I was there when John Taylor, Director at the time had his daughters 21st birthday party onboard. Sam threataned me with instant dismissal if the power failed. It was my night aboard.

Jim S
22nd April 2006, 17:27
Hello Jim S
I also have my discharge book in front of me and I signed on 31st Oct. 1968 and off 26th nov. 1968. I was 3/rd eng.
I was contact in Kingston for Appleton Estate and we used to crack open a bottle every night at 1800hrs. in Sam Greedys cabin. The company included C/frig,C/steward and Leckie.
I was there when John Taylor, Director at the time had his daughters 21st birthday party onboard. Sam threataned me with instant dismissal if the power failed. It was my night aboard.

Hi again,
It certainly was a long time ago but we must have sailed together on Camito.
That was my first trip as 2nd Eng on Camito having joined her from similar position on Chicanoa. I would imagine that the CRE that you mention would pobably have been Trevor Owen, the Electrician - Eric Taylor. The C/steward would likely have been the Purser I cannot recall his name but Sam and he went back a long way. Looking again at my dates there is a gap from signing off 26th November until signing on again 18th December. - You are correct about Camito being in for refit although I cannot remember living ashore.- I think it was for survey which included pressure testing of main steam pipework to the turbines. I cannot remember if that was the time when the port hp turbine rotor was removed for inspection/repair. During my time on her we certainly did one voyage without a port hp turbine. It was always a problem part of the ship and had to be nursed during manouevring. A tally on one of the drain valves was kept deliberately loose and it was used as a vibration indicator during this period.
Once full away and slowly worked up to speed there would be no further problems. - This problem was never solved.
I do not remember all the engineers that I sailed with - Marcus Bowden was the longest term 3/Eng on Camito in my time. Jimmy Leatherbarrow was CRE for a time as was one of the Banks brothers - Benny I think, (the other was
Bobby)

Regards
Jim Souter

Scottseng
23rd April 2006, 00:48
Hi Jim,
The names Trevor Owen C/frig and Eric Taylor certainly ring a bell. The C/steward was a scouser whose brother I believe was a C/steward with Harrisons Liverpool. He was also the agent for Vat 19 from Trinidad.
If memory serves me correctly the problem on that trip was alack of feed water. There was a knackered forced draught fan.
You mentioned the Banks brothers. I sailed with Benny on the Tucarinca and with Bobby on either the Chicanoa or Changuinola where the 2/eng was Lewis {Two feet yard}. During that trip he got his feet badly scalded when a junior opened the 1st stage evap. open while still half full of rather hot water. Someone previous hadnt cut the centre out the inspection door.
Thanks for the reminiscences.

wa002f0328
23rd April 2006, 15:54
Did anyone sail on the Turrialba in 1965, what a trip , what a ship ?

Scottseng
24th April 2006, 22:44
Hi Jim
Thanks for the info on Bobby, very sad. I read on one of the other postings that he had died, but not the circumstances.

Rory
29th April 2006, 07:59
Hi All;

The attached was up on Ebay UK, She was listed as Golfito-1952. I find only a solitary Golfito-1949 for Fyffes and/or United Fruit and subsidiaries.

The ship in question is a much older vessel. There is a strong resemblance to Corrales-1930, and perhaps she might be of similar vintage.

Any help will be appreciated.

Cheers,
Ror

Jim S
29th April 2006, 19:54
She certainly looks like one of the 19 "B -Class" vessels built between 1920 and 1930 - 13 of which did not survive the WW 2.
Such a large class by different builders obviously had some detail differences.
That said i don't think it is CORRALES of the class - she had a row of portholes at tween deck level. I believe she might be TETELA built by Cammel Laird in 1926. Survived an attack by German E-boats off the UK East Coast on 17th Sept 1941. Was the second Elders & Fyffes ship to be released for peacetime service in 1945. Broken up in Belgium in 1959 The similar TILAPA by the same builder in 1928 has a slightly different spacing to the main deck portholes. - TILAPA brought the first cargo of bananas for 5 years into Avonmouth in December 1945 -Estimated at 10 million of them!

Rory
30th April 2006, 05:09
Thanks Jim;
That certainly makes muh more sense than the original caption had suggested. Some of those UFCo/Fyffes boats are also a bit close in years to call accurately too, especially around the war years. I have a good scan of Choluteca either 1921 or 1945. The ship looks very modern in some respects, but has a counter-stern. Was such a beast fashionable back in 1945?
Cheers,
Rory

Jim S
30th April 2006, 21:13
Hi Rory,
As late as 1948 the counter stern was still favoured for a class of nine single screw turbine steamer built in 1947 and 1948 for United Fruit Company-
TIVIVES, YAQUE, HIBUERAS, SIXAOLA were transferred to Fyffes in 1969/70 and renamed PACUARE, PATIA, PECOS and PATUCA only PATUCA lasted more than 2 or 3 years - she was scrapped in 1978.
The ships retained by United Fruit or transferred to other subsidiaries were CIBAO, MORAZAN, QUISQUEYA, SANTO CERRO, and ULOA.
American Export-Isbrandtsen Line were another who favoured the counter stern late on - the two 23,000 gross ton twin screw liners INDEPENDENCE of 1950 and CONSTITUTION of 1951 also had counter sterns.
The Newburgh Shipyard of New York built a CHOLUTECA in 1921 for United Fruit Company - she was transferred to the Honduran subsidiary in 1942.
I don't know if there was another vessel of same name.

Rory
1st May 2006, 10:45
Hi Jim;
That is a wealth of information you present here, and is appreciated very much. I did not know the counter stern was popular that late. You show the group of UFCo vessels, and the two big liners with them up into the early 1950s. The "Choluteca" I have the scan of has to be the 1945/47 vessel. She has a modern raked bow rather than the straight stem of a 1920s ship.

I have a database for ships of UFCo/Fyffes Lines. Most of the credit for this information should go to The Ships List, and I add whatever else I find to it from time to time. I do not have the builder information for most of the 423 ships involved. This list shows the use of the name “Choluteca” three times.

UFC Choluteca[1] 1921 Cuyamel Fruit Co, 1929 acquired by UFC in merger, Honduras flag, 1935 US flag, 1942 Honduras flag, 1946 sold to Wallem & Co, Hong Kong renamed Tai Ping. 2493Tons

UFC Choluteca[2] 1945 ex- Bight Knot, 1947 purchased by UFC renamed Choluteca, Honduras flag, 1965 sold to Greece renamed Apostolakis T. 3805Tons

UFC Cibao[2] 1947 US flag, 1970 transferred to Dutch flag renamed Choluteca[3], 1975 scrapped. 5075Tons

Do you know of a site or other where one might find more information for the roster of these companies ships? Builder info, specs....that sort of thing? Would like to know, Jim.
Cheers.
Rory

Hamish Mackintosh
1st May 2006, 15:38
I never see any mention of the "Zent" a banana boat ,a German prize I believe,I was aboard her in Avonmouth in 1950 to visit a friend, an AB by the name of Fred Kelly,who was a" company " man having sailed on several Elders boats

Rory
1st May 2006, 18:47
Hello Hamish;

This is what is says of the Zent.

Fyffes Zent[3] 1938 ex- Viator, Sorensen, 1938 sold to H. Schuldt & Co., Flensburg renamed Angelburg, 1945 acquired as war prize and renamed Empire Wharfe, 1946 purchased by E & F renamed Zent, 1962 scrapped. 3072Tons
Cheers,
Rory

Jim S
1st May 2006, 18:59
Hello Hamish;

This is what is says of the Zent.

Fyffes Zent[3] 1938 ex- Viator, Sorensen, 1938 sold to H. Schuldt & Co., Flensburg renamed Angelburg, 1945 acquired as war prize and renamed Empire Wharfe, 1946 purchased by E & F renamed Zent, 1962 scrapped. 3072Tons
Cheers,
Rory

Between 1940 and 1945 she was based at Keil and used as a target vessel for the training of U-boat crews in the Baltic. Another war prize that was aquired by E & F was Reventazon. She also served part of WW 2 as a U -boat target vessel in the Baltic.

R58484956
1st May 2006, 19:15
Zent 3242 tons built 1938 by Oresunds-varvet Aktiebolag, Landskrona.319.0 x 45.7 x 24.1. 9 cyl diesel by Burmeister & Wain. DF. ESD Owned by E&F british flag registered London. Ex names as above.

Jim S
1st May 2006, 20:39
Hi Jim;
That is a wealth of information you present here, and is appreciated very much. I did not know the counter stern was popular that late. You show the group of UFCo vessels, and the two big liners with them up into the early 1950s. The "Choluteca" I have the scan of has to be the 1945/47 vessel. She has a modern raked bow rather than the straight stem of a 1920s ship.

I have a database for ships of UFCo/Fyffes Lines. Most of the credit for this information should go to The Ships List, and I add whatever else I find to it from time to time. I do not have the builder information for most of the 423 ships involved. This list shows the use of the name “Choluteca” three times.

UFC Choluteca[1] 1921 Cuyamel Fruit Co, 1929 acquired by UFC in merger, Honduras flag, 1935 US flag, 1942 Honduras flag, 1946 sold to Wallem & Co, Hong Kong renamed Tai Ping. 2493Tons

UFC Choluteca[2] 1945 ex- Bight Knot, 1947 purchased by UFC renamed Choluteca, Honduras flag, 1965 sold to Greece renamed Apostolakis T. 3805Tons

UFC Cibao[2] 1947 US flag, 1970 transferred to Dutch flag renamed Choluteca[3], 1975 scrapped. 5075Tons

Do you know of a site or other where one might find more information for the roster of these companies ships? Builder info, specs....that sort of thing? Would like to know, Jim.
Cheers.
Rory
There is a site -type in United Fruit Co or Great White Fleet that shows some advertising posters for UFCo sailings and names of ships (but no details) up to about 1938. The only reference books I have are "The White Ships" by RM Parsons by City of Bristol Museum, and Elders & Fyffes and Geest by Duncan Haws- part of a series of Merchant Fleets.
I seem to recall an American book "The Great White Fleet" that told the story of banana transportation. - not to be confused with the same name that was adopted by Teddy Roosevelt's US Navy in the early 1900's
Jim S

Hamish Mackintosh
2nd May 2006, 00:43
Thanks for the info guy's !!!

Jim S
2nd May 2006, 18:43
Thanks for the info guy's !!!

A correction to my previous thought that there was an American book called "The Great White Fleet" - there may be such a book but I have found the reference to the book that I was thinking of it is "Going Bananas" author is Goldberg and tells of American lines to the Caribbean. I saw it advertised in 1995 so it may no longer be available.

Jim S

Rory
2nd May 2006, 18:51
Hi Jim and R58484956;

As always thanks for the input;

Have tried just about ‘all’ the “Old Nugget” could come up with on looking for material on the United Fruit ships on this side of the pond. Some were in service with the “Stores Dept, USN”, and decent information on their site. Also, the ships that went “Dutch” are also well recorder, and images of them available.

I have come to the point to see an image of Antigua-1932 of The Great White Fleet one would need a time machine. The same can be said of her sisters and near sisters. Some of them do appear as later sold to other companies.

There is an interesting item up on the web regarding the Zent. It should look familiar to you R58484956, but when I follow the link there seems to be nothing there. Is[was] this something you did quite awhile ago, and it since has been removed from the site? Or was there a ‘crash’ on this site, and the info lost. Sure seemed interesting, and would loved to have seen the material. This is the link as shown on Google Search;

Ships Nostalgia - The Forum and Discussion Board for all things ...
Listed in this forum are a few of the Elders Fyffes Line ships, please add any you would like to see in here. Reventazon. by R58484956 ...www.shipsnostalgia.com/ - 101k - Cached - Similar pages

Cheers,
Rory

Jim S
2nd May 2006, 22:40
Hi Rory,
With reference to ANTIGUA -she was one of a class of six. I believe all were built by Newport News SB & DD Co and Bethlehem for the New York - Central America passenger service around 1931/32.
They were twin screw turbo-electric ships of around 7600 gross ton. The six were TALAMANCA, QUIRIGUA, VERAGUA (these three were transferred to Fyffes in 1958/59 and renamed SULACO, SAMALA and SINALOA respectively).
The other three were ANTIGUA, CHIRIQUI and SEGOVIA.
All six had extra refrigerated space installed and the original four smoke tube boilers replaced by two high pressure water tube boilers in 1950.
In 1953 most of the passenger accommodation was cut off aft of the funnel giving a very odd profile. The three Fyffes ships were broken up in 1964, 1962, and 1969.

Jim S

Rory
5th May 2006, 10:14
Hi Jim;
Fire flues and gas tubes? Sounds like railroad locomotive boilers on a big ship. Wouldn’t that be a step backwards? I would have thought all large steam driven vessels would have been equipped with three drum type water tube boilers in the twentieth century.

I had seen the postcard for Sven Salen’s “Tortuga” ex Antigua, and wondered why things looked a bit deserted back aft. I looked at the two German boats [Blexen & Blumenthal] also, and they too had the passenger section aft of the funnel removed as did the three Fyffes boats. I believe your SEGOVIA should be Peten [Jamaica] later to Blumenthal(?).

I have managed to locate some of the builders for UK built Fyffes Boats [and also some United Mail/United Fruit]. Cammell Laird, Alexander Stephen & Sons, Barclay Curle & Company and mention is made of Workman Clark, Belfast. I wonder if you might shed some light on other builders for this comoany,

As always, Jim thanks for your help.
Cheers.
Rory

Jim S
5th May 2006, 21:09
Hello again,
In the UK the marine smoke tube or fire tube boilers were known as "Scotch"
boilers - I don't know if there was an American variation of the type.
Cylindrical shells about 16 feet in diameter they usually had either 3 or 4 furnaces and many large ships had double ended designs. The main attraction of the Scotch boiler was its ability to accommodate less that perfect feed water quality. Pressure was a limiting factor being no greater than about 250 psi. You may be surprised that the Brocklebank Line of Liverpool had an 8700 gross ton turbine steamer ship built as late as 1957 with 3 - Scotch Boilers. - That was exceptional. You have named the main yards that built for Elders & Fyffes - Stephen was the major yard. Others that I know of are:-
1893/94 four ships by Furness Withy, West Hartlepool. 1904 the first Matina by Swan Hunter & Wigham Richardson, Newcastle, Bremer Vulkan, Vegesack Germany built the Leith Hill/Lempa and Box Hill/Leon in 1952 and also six T-class turbine steamers for the UF Co subsidiary Surrey Shipping but managed by E & F. Eight fast motorships were built in Japan between 1969 and1973 by Kawasaki Heavy Industries, Kobe and two small container ships for service Puerto Cortes to Galveston/Gulfport were built in Spain by Hijos de J Barreras of Vigo. American built ships transferred to E & F came from Newport News,
Bethlehem, Sparrows Point and Gulf S.B. Corp of Chiksaw Alabama

I hope this is of some help,
best wishes

Jim S

akbruton
7th May 2006, 17:14
Yes Rory the photo of the Golfito looks like the real one as I can remember being sent to her as 2nd cook in Avonmouth but did not sail as the other cook turned up so I went to the Manistee Alan Bruton

Rory
8th May 2006, 19:11
Jim S

Thanks Jim;

I have heard the term “Scotch Boiler”before, but never really understood what it meant: or that it was not a watertube type. I guess I just assumed that watertube units were used in the big spaces of power houses and spacious areas of ships, and the fire tubes were for railroad locomotives where loading gauge would restrict size. There were a few experimental water tube and hybrid types used on the rail, but were not the success they had hoped for.

I am hoping the book you pointed me to “Going Bananas” [and I am] will shed more light on the United Fruit ships. That combined with the Fyffes material might just show enough to have a decent roster.

Thanks again for your input, and know it is always appreciater.


Hi Alan;

Thanks too for your remarks. Perhaps you can shed some stories with us.

Cheers,

Rory

terence
8th May 2006, 23:47
jim there still plum boats ?

Rory
19th May 2006, 05:34
Hi Jim S and All you Fyffes Fans;

I did receive the book "GOING BANANAS" you pointed me to, Jim, and have to say it is the Bible for United Fruit Co. Vessels. Thanks for the pointer. Very well done, and a wealth of information plus a very large selection of photos and drawings.

I had ordered the book "Merchant Fleets: Elders and Fyffes No. 31" from Ian Allan Superstore [they said they had it] to help provide a roster for the Fyffes Vessels. However, today I received a couple of railway and outer space catalogs from them. Inside one of the catalogs was an invoice printed in about #2 font with lots of zeros, and an op cancelled in the corner. Now I assume the op cancelled is the Modern version of the Queens Language telling me they don’t have the book? I do hope they credited my account. All of this has put me back in the Stone Age regarding Fyffes ships. The Clydeside Site does have a good deal of info on ships built up there, but I suspect not nearly all of them. Also there is a posted Cammell Laird & Co. site with a very limited “Works List”. On the web one finds the ex MOWE and her sister. The ex German Reventazon and the Swedish built Zent show up, but for the most part a lot is missing.

I wonder if any of you might have a reasonably good Fleet List for Elders & Fyffes, and be willing to share same with me. I would be glad to purchase a reasonably priced copy of the Roster if need be.

Any consideration will be most appreciated.

Cheers,

Rory

Basil
21st May 2006, 18:00
Jim S,
Recognise a couple of names from your crewing lists.

Scottseng,
Would the 2/E you mention be George Fairgrieve?

Scottseng
22nd May 2006, 00:18
Hi Ian
George Fairgreive who I sailed with was from Carnoustie and served his time in the coal mines. I think it was the Tenadores we were on, I was 4th. and the thing that always made him exceptional was that he went ashore wearing the kilt, no matter the port.
I met him briefly years later just after he got his c\e ticket.

Basil
23rd May 2006, 09:01
Scottseng,

Don't recollect the kilt and beginning to wonder if I've got the name right. Have a look at:

http://www.btinternet.com/~af-aditel/lion.htm

Is that George second from top on left and second from bottom on right?

Scottseng
23rd May 2006, 11:52
Hi Ian
It certainly looks like the George I was with. I had a photo of him in his kilt taken just as he was going ashore, but cannot put my hands on at the moment.
I dont remember much of the Matina as I only stoodby her once, she was being defumigated in Avonmouth.

Rory
26th May 2006, 06:59
Hi All;

Can any of you shed some light on these two Fyffes Boats. Both of these vessels became members of the Royal Navy 10th Cruiser Squadron during WW1, as converted to Armed Merchant Cruisers.

The first was Changuinola, and this is all the information I have on her. There is nothing in HAPAG I can find, and again nothing in my United Fruit book.

Changuinola-1912
Laid down as Columbia for Hamburg America Line, ex- Carl Schurz, United Fruit Co., 1914 transferred from United Fruit Co., renamed Changuinola, 1914-1920 became HMS Changuinola, 1933 scrapped.
5,978 tons gross.

The second was ss Motagua, and this is all I have on her.

Motagua-1913
To HMS Motagua

Any info on the builder, specs, and such for these two vessels will be most appreciated, and I thank you all for your continued support

Cheers,

Rory

John Rogers
26th May 2006, 14:01
Rory, on one of the pictures I sent you one of them has a seaplane on the bow, also the bayano was a armed cruiser,picture of her in my gallery.
John

Jim S
26th May 2006, 21:14
CHANGUINOLA and MOTAGUA were built 1912 by Swan Hunter & Wighham Richardson, Newcastle.
5978 grt Twin Screw triple expansion steam recip steamers with a servicew speed of 14 knots.
Dimensions. L 410.9 ft, B 51.1 ft, D 30.4 ft.
The situation regarding ownership at ordering was complicated.
Suffice to say the order for the pair was placed by Hamburg America Line who had took over the shares of the largest shareholder of At;antic Fruit & Steamship Co. This brought them into conflict with United Fruit Co. Deciding it was not worth the battle Hamburg America offered to withdraw if United Fruit Co took over the ships.
CHANGUINOLA was laid down as COLUMBIA but on purchase on the stocks was renamed KARL SCHURZ but at launch this was changed to CARL SCHURZ.
United Fruit Company decided to let Elders & Fyffes operate and she was renamed. She became Armed Boarding Vessel HMS CHANGUINOLA in 1915.
In 1933 she was broken up in Glasgow.
MOTAGUA was laid down as NORMANNIA on purchase in 1913 she was renamed EMILE L BOAS. March 1914 saw her transferred to E & F and renamed MOTAGUA. In 1915 she was converted into Armed Merchant Cruiser.
16th March 1917 she struck a mine off Shetlands but survived. In March 1918 she collided off Plymouth with USS MANLEY and had her stern blown off by exploding depth charges.
Broken up in Rotterdam in 1933.
During WW 1 E & F had five ships serving with 10th Cruiser Squadron.

Jim S

Rory
27th May 2006, 00:51
Jim;

Thanks a Bunch (*)) for that information on the two vessels. I had no idea the Montagua was in the same mold as Changuinola. I can see why the Changuinola did not appear in either UFCo or HAPAG Lists. Looks like she [they] never left England for either company, and went directly into Fyffes or HM fleets. Interesting too why neither showed up in what I have available for builders records [Stephen and Cammell Laird only]. Of course, in the case of the former I had thought it might be a German builder. These two led quite interesting lives.

It seems I read somewhere about the collision of a US destroyer with an armed merchant cruiser earlier, but did not know any particulars other that something about the destroyer was alongside, and rolled into the AMC if I remember correctly.

Jim, the information on these too is wonderful, and most appreciated. I thank you for your time and effort.

John;

You are quite right on the “Catapult Ship”. Looks like she has a Hawker Hurricane on the rack ready for launch. Look out FW-200 “CONDOR”. Yes I saw that shot of Bayano with the corvette painted on her side. Speaking of which, I noticed an outfit called Mersey-Views has a fairly large group of Fyffes Banana Boat photos [the very old ones] for sale. Anyone here ever get any of these? I sure would like to know the quality as the views shown even at about 350dpi are really terrible. I thought it odd, if I understand it correctly, the SCAN is more expensive that the Photograph??? I must be missing something there.

And remember, “Yes We Have No Bananas” :@

Cheers,

Rory

Aldinga
28th May 2006, 08:09
Hi Rory
Your mystery ship we first thought was the “Barranca” but after further examination we now believe it to be the “Samala” built in 1932 as the Quirigua for the “United Fruit Co. and joined Fyffes in 1958. it was finely broken up in Formosa 1964.
So cast your eye over this posting and see if you agree, sorry about the quality of it.
The information was taken from a March 1967 “Sea Breezes” magazine.

Ron

Rory
28th May 2006, 09:14
Hi Ron;

Thank you for the Post and attachment.

I believe this is a British Boat of the B Type, particulars as below
Samala 1927 [1] B 923 Cammell Laird & Co. Birkenhead

The "MAIL BOATS" of the UFCo were rebuilt to freighters following the war, and three of the six went to Fyffes as you list in your Post. One other to Salen, Sweden, and two to Germany.

It is actually nice to see the vessel you posted as it is another B type I have not seen before.

Cheers,
Rory

Basil
13th June 2006, 11:13
Pic below of of Samala's stern Southampton 1962 (Matina in the background)
By the early 60s the 'S' boats had a reputation for being high maintenance - bit like my daughters :)
On Tuesday 13th June BBC2 had a programme about post war rationing which included a clip of the old Tilapa arriving with the first bananas. Picture of her at: http://iancoombe.tripod.com/id14.html
I presume from Aldinga's picture that the old Samala and old Tilapa were the same class.

Rory
15th June 2006, 22:59
This image was sent me by an old navy chum. Why the USN has this on file I do not know, but as a stores ship USS Mizar, that I can see.

ex- Quirigua, 1941 became USS Mizar, 1943 reverted to Quirigua, 1959 transferred from United Fruit Co. to E&F and renamed Samala, 1962 scrapped.

Images of these six "Mail Boats' as built sure seem to be rare. A lot more are to be seen when they were rebuilt freighters.

Cheers,
Rory

Rory
15th June 2006, 23:03
The attachment;
Rory

baribill
21st July 2006, 15:49
Hey I guess I am late in finding this site ex Vindi boy R399116 1947/48 Did one of my first trips on the Ariguani two on the Bayano and 6 on the Cavina as EDH just before leaving the sea. Also did one on the Manistee. I looked on the Elder Ffyes web site and this was the info i got its probably out of date for this forum but here goes
SS Ariguani Built 1926 Scrapped 1956
SS Bayano (2) ordered as "Cauca" then named Arguan but launched as the Bayano. In 1915-1918 HMS Bayano Scrapped 1956
SS Cavin (2) Built 1924 sold to Cia.Navier Lanena and renamed Catusha Scrapped 1958
MV Manistee (3)Build 1932 ex Eros Purchased from Morant renamed Manistee Scrapped 1960

I just thought somebody may be interested.

I shipped mainly out of Avonmouth so the skin boats were excepted there.

Why I even met Errol Flynne down there.

Bill R399116

John Rogers
21st July 2006, 18:18
Baribill, I sailed on the skin boats you mentioned,was out of the Avonmouth pool. Your Seamans number is a little after mine which is R398395 dated Oct 1947.Never got to see Errol Flynn but tied up along side his yacht a few times.
John.

Tony Breach
30th July 2006, 00:10
This is a fantastic thread & I have enjoyed going through everything. I have my own records of the refrigerated ships of UFC, UBC, CBC, E&F, Carabaische, Scipio, Fyffes, Surrey, plus all the other companies from whom these bought ships or sold ships to. I list 201 vessels in 55 classes with 286 names. I also have stats of losses, builders etc., & a whole bunch of obscure information: one of my favourites is a UFC internal list of ship names for UFC & subsidiaries with the identification of each name. It is interesting that someone advised of a MANISTEE still in service on the Great Lakes. UFC indicates the name MANISTEE as "City, river & lake in Michigan USA". I could never figure this one out as it does not fit in with the normal naming patterns. I could also not understand why Hocking did not include the loss of the MAROWIJNE in his Dictionary of Disasters at Sea, in fact 22 UFC/E&F vessels are excluded from that work for some reason or other. Also I often see MANISTEE (3) referred to as being ex-EROS which is incorrect & seems to be taken from Haws: this ship was ex-ERIN as Ruud has already advised.

I have a question which hopefully some one may be able to help me with: The three "C" ships built for Caraibische in 1956/7 were, according to Goldberg, fitted with different stabilising equipment for appraisal as follows:
CALAMARES (2) fin stabilisers which according to Goldberg were ineffectual at banana draft.This is understandable.
CARRILLO (2) flume tanks (were these passive)?
CARTAGO (2) was not fitted with either as a control.
What was the result of these comparison tests in respect of, actual stability as fluid GM, roll period & magnitude, effect on fruit quality & effect on speed & consumption.
It would also be interesting to know if these vessels were fitted with bilge keels. Interesting to note that the Geest ships from GEESTBAY (1) until GEESTSTAR (2), 8 ships, were fitted with passive flumes but without bilge keels.

A banana a day helps the rum to be digested.
Tony.

PAULD
6th September 2006, 12:10
I served on the mazatec,matina and manistee in 73/74 as a cadet, junior and 4th eng good times, was on the maz when the fuel pumps fell of the side of the engine (Thumb)

fowler19481
8th September 2006, 11:15
Any one from the 'M' boats before being sold on in the 80's

ian walker 1973/76

Tony Breach
9th September 2006, 11:18
The late Captain K. Leslie had compiled extensive records of E&F ships. Does anyone know where these are today & if they are available for inspection?

Jim S
9th September 2006, 16:58
Hi Paul,
Fuel pumps falling off engine is an unusual event - can you tell us more?
I sailed on Motagua and that was perhaps the only failure she did not experience.

I served on the mazatec,matina and manistee in 73/74 as a cadet, junior and 4th eng good times, was on the maz when the fuel pumps fell of the side of the engine (Thumb)

PAULD
11th September 2006, 12:53
Fuel pumps falling off engine is an unusual event - can you tell us more?
I sailed on Motagua and that was perhaps the only failure she did not experience.[/QUO


Recollection a bit cloudy now, the ship was about 4months old at the time but the injector pumps were in two banks of five and one of these sheared its retaining studs and fell away, damaged the engine casing slightly damaged the camshaft [ that was supposed to get checked/repaired/replaced at bethlehem steel in america if i remeber correctly ]. Ripped out five fuel lines, thier trace heating lines amd the safety sheathing that was around them. I think we were stopped for about 36 hours. We had to turn up new main studs, I was on it for another couple of months after that and paid of just as it was suppose to be going to get the camshaft checked/changed

Jim S
15th September 2006, 21:56
Fuel pumps falling off engine is an unusual event - can you tell us more?
I sailed on Motagua and that was perhaps the only failure she did not experience.[/QUO


Recollection a bit cloudy now, the ship was about 4months old at the time but the injector pumps were in two banks of five and one of these sheared its retaining studs and fell away, damaged the engine casing slightly damaged the camshaft [ that was supposed to get checked/repaired/replaced at bethlehem steel in america if i remeber correctly ]. Ripped out five fuel lines, thier trace heating lines amd the safety sheathing that was around them. I think we were stopped for about 36 hours. We had to turn up new main studs, I was on it for another couple of months after that and paid of just as it was suppose to be going to get the camshaft checked/changed

Thanks for the further info on the fuel pump problem. - Am I correct that Manzanares was designed for UMS (unmanned machinery space) operation?
I guess the engine room must have been manned at the time of the incident or the result could have been disastrouswith all that hot fuel oil spraying about. The earlier M - class were not UMS classed (Matina,Morant,Motagua).
How long were you with Fyffes? I was with them from 1968 - 1974
Jim S

wa002f0328
15th September 2006, 22:04
anyone sail on TURRIALBA in the 60s?

terence
15th September 2006, 22:14
what music would remind you of the mn like m

armalade reflections of my life
bobby darin
beyond the sea
jonney hates jazz
turn back the clock
neil sedaka
i miss the hungry years
(Hippy)

PAULD
18th September 2006, 19:38
I guess the engine room must have been manned at the time of the incident or the result could have been disastrouswith all that hot fuel oil spraying about. The earlier M - class were not UMS classed (Matina,Morant,Motagua).
How long were you with Fyffes? I was with them from 1968 - 1974
Jim S[/QUOTE]

Was with them71 -75. The Mazatec was and there was one hell off a mess everywhere[=P]

Jim S
18th September 2006, 20:07
I guess the engine room must have been manned at the time of the incident or the result could have been disastrouswith all that hot fuel oil spraying about. The earlier M - class were not UMS classed (Matina,Morant,Motagua).
How long were you with Fyffes? I was with them from 1968 - 1974
Jim S

Was with them71 -75. The Mazatec was and there was one hell off a mess everywhere[=P][/QUOTE]

Phew, You were certainly fortunate not have had a serious fire.

(for some reason I got mixed up between Manzanares and Mazatec)

Jim S

Tony Breach
19th September 2006, 11:26
An excellent photograph of NICOYA (1) 1905 was published in Marine News Sept 2006. This ship has no poop as per Haws No.31 pp22.

Haws indicates that there were 7 ships in this class as follows (with dimensions):
NICOYA (1) 1905 3911GRT 365.5' 574nhp Stephen, Glasgow
PACUARE (1) 1905 3891GRT 367.3' Workman Clark, Belfast.
ZENT (1) 1905 3890GRT 367.3' Workman Clark
BARRANCA (1) 1906 4115GRT 630nhp Stephen
CHIRRIPO (1) 1906 4041GRT 666nhp Workman Clark
REVENTAZON (1) 1906 4175grt 666nhp Workman Clark
TORTUGUERO (1) 1909 4175 413nhp

Haws then has the ARACATACA (1) class of 1911 illustrated by a ship with a poop, otherwise similar to NICOYA (1), 2 ships as follows:
ARACATACA (1) 1911 4154GRT 376.3' 413nhp Workman Clark
MANZANARES (1) 1911 4094GRT Stephen.

Where there is no information Haws refers to vessel as "sister of". He refers to TORTUGUERO (1) as being "transitional" with ARACATACA (1) class.

Parsons' The White Ships & Davies' Fyffes & The Banana have slighlty different numbers but essentially similar. However Parsons indicates dimensions as follows:
NICOYA(1) to ZENT (1) 367' x 46'
BARRANCA (1) to TORTUGUERA (1) 374' x 47'
ARACATACA (1) & MANZANARES (1) 375' x 48'

In addition to the NICOYA (1) photo I have photos of ZENT (1), BARRANCA (1) & MANZANARES (1) which show that ZENT (1) has a poop, BARRANCA (1) does not have a poop & MANZANARES (1) does have a poop as indicated in Haws drawing on pp23.

It seems that there are really 3 classes here: NICOYA (1), BARRANCA (1) & ARACATACA (1) based upon length, beam & tonnage but with detail differences in engine output & the provision or otherwise of a poop. (Fairly significant details!)

It also seems that it was normal for the Workman Clark ships to have a poop whereas the Stephen ships did not although the MANZANARES (1) did have one.

I would be interested to learn which vessels within the total 9 did have poop decks in order to correct my records of these vessels. (To Fyffes they were all "B" class anyway)

TonyB aka Berni
19th September 2006, 11:28
No mention of the T's. I sailed on Tucurinca and then Turrialba (three trips running) Enjoyed Fyffes but decided it was a bit limited so moved on to Whitco before swallowing the anchor.
Didn't see any mention of Capt Geoff Wallis who I thought was the best Master I sailed with.

R58484956
19th September 2006, 11:36
Wecome to the site TonyB enjoy it and all it has to offer.

Jim S
19th September 2006, 18:59
Tony B,

I attach a photo that MIGHT be Geoff Wallis. I had written the caption on it that it was Capt Evans but looking at the signature in my discharge book it looks more like G Wallis. He is the one nearest camera and was taken on BAYANO in mid 1972. He was the first master on BAYANO from the builders in Vigo, Spain. A good guy if I may say in the kindest way slightly eccentric. The picture is of him and chief steward scrubbing some palm fronds that he thought could be fashioned into an awning. - One night in Puerto Cortes he was thinking of going ashore for a walk but it was pouring with rain and he was concerned his pipe would go out - A deck apprentice suggested he turn his "sou'wester the other way around and that would shield his pipe - he thought it a great idea. - maybe it was just his sense of humour.
Please let me know if it is indeed Geoff Wallis so that I might correct my mistake.

Jim S
19th September 2006, 20:56
An excellent photograph of NICOYA (1) 1905 was published in Marine News Sept 2006. This ship has no poop as per Haws No.31 pp22.

Haws indicates that there were 7 ships in this class as follows (with dimensions):
NICOYA (1) 1905 3911GRT 365.5' 574nhp Stephen, Glasgow
PACUARE (1) 1905 3891GRT 367.3' Workman Clark, Belfast.
ZENT (1) 1905 3890GRT 367.3' Workman Clark
BARRANCA (1) 1906 4115GRT 630nhp Stephen
CHIRRIPO (1) 1906 4041GRT 666nhp Workman Clark
REVENTAZON (1) 1906 4175grt 666nhp Workman Clark
TORTUGUERO (1) 1909 4175 413nhp

Haws then has the ARACATACA (1) class of 1911 illustrated by a ship with a poop, otherwise similar to NICOYA (1), 2 ships as follows:
ARACATACA (1) 1911 4154GRT 376.3' 413nhp Workman Clark
MANZANARES (1) 1911 4094GRT Stephen.

Where there is no information Haws refers to vessel as "sister of". He refers to TORTUGUERO (1) as being "transitional" with ARACATACA (1) class.

Parsons' The White Ships & Davies' Fyffes & The Banana have slighlty different numbers but essentially similar. However Parsons indicates dimensions as follows:
NICOYA(1) to ZENT (1) 367' x 46'
BARRANCA (1) to TORTUGUERA (1) 374' x 47'
ARACATACA (1) & MANZANARES (1) 375' x 48'

In addition to the NICOYA (1) photo I have photos of ZENT (1), BARRANCA (1) & MANZANARES (1) which show that ZENT (1) has a poop, BARRANCA (1) does not have a poop & MANZANARES (1) does have a poop as indicated in Haws drawing on pp23.

It seems that there are really 3 classes here: NICOYA (1), BARRANCA (1) & ARACATACA (1) based upon length, beam & tonnage but with detail differences in engine output & the provision or otherwise of a poop. (Fairly significant details!)

It also seems that it was normal for the Workman Clark ships to have a poop whereas the Stephen ships did not although the MANZANARES (1) did have one.

I would be interested to learn which vessels within the total 9 did have poop decks in order to correct my records of these vessels. (To Fyffes they were all "B" class anyway)

Tony,
It seems that John Bartlett has opened up a can of worms with his photo in "Marine News" He was right to correct the mistake on the back of the photo that indicated it was the NICOYA of 1905 and not the one of 1929.
Regarding "nhp" - I would not put much emphasis on it - James Watt was to blame for it and at best it can be used only for comparative purposes and may in the distant past have been used for insurance or tax purposes. It has no direct comparison with actual horse power Indicated, Brake, Shaft or otherwise.
As you can imagine Brocklebank was one of the few companies that incorporated nhp on the ship's stamp. For example MAGDAPUR had an nhp of1226 and a shp of 6800. MANGLA 1294 nhp 7250 shp.
I think there were always design detail differences between Workman Clark ships and Stephen built. Will be interesting to see if Rory comes up with an answer to your query - he has built up an excellent knowledge of the ships of Elders & Fyffes and parent United Fruit Company.

Rory
20th September 2006, 09:24
Hi All
Glad to find this new segment.

Thanks, Jim, for you confidence in me, but I am not as well versed, as I would like to be.

To show my ignorance let me ask what a "Poop" really is? As I recall if you had a raised deck aft it was called the "Poop Deck", and if there was a structure built upon it, then that was the Poop?

If we consider then that to have a Poop you also have to have the 'raised' Poop Deck that can be a problem with drawings. If one was to look at a side drawing of E&F Pacure-1905(1) we would say it had the Poop Deck and all the trimmings of the classic Poop. However, that is not the case here. I have a 3/4 Port view of this fine ship, and I will try to explain exactly what is aft of the Main Castle. Firstly, the main castle has steel plating and gunnel instead of a railing at main deck level. Then it curves down to main deck level in the area of the Mainmast and Hatch. This section is protected by a railing Port and Starboard, and at the end of the hatch curves upward to become the plating and gunnel again all the way aft, and around the counterstearn. As I say if you look at a drawing [broadside] it will appear to have a Poopdeck aft.


Tony, I think when Duncan just says “Sister of” it means only that the Builder and specs are the same. If the year of build or other changes are needed he then inserts “except”. and then explains the differences... builder and such.

I would be most interested to know more about the ship terminology in case I messed it all up here. The years have taken its toll.

Cheers,

Rory

Rory
20th September 2006, 09:41
I should have mentioned that the aft structure of Barranca-1906 is basically the same as that of Pacure-1905. However, this ship has a railing aft of the main castle, and extending all the way aft, and around the counterstern. I think it correct to say the main deck is the only deck aft of the main castle for this class of vessel regardless of builder. The difference is only cosmetic in the use of railing and/or combination of railing and steel plating. It is the latter that gives the appearance of a Poop Deck when in fact there is only the Main Deck in this group of vessels.
Rory

wa002f0328
20th September 2006, 20:51
[=P] (Hippy) The fuel pumps never fell of on the TURRIALBA so what happened on the M boats, May be lack of enginering knowledge

Jim S
20th September 2006, 22:30
That is a bit harsh to question the engineering knowledge on Mazatec.
As the original writer stated the ship was only 4 months old and for holding down studs on a bank of fuel pumps to shear is most uncommon.
That said the Kawasaki built M-class of motorships had various mishaps in their early careers and were not my favourite ships. Motagua for instance had to take refuge at Hawaii on her maiden voyage when a crack developed across main deck. The other two ships of the class in service at the time were ordered to nearest suitable port where I-beams were welded to the main deck either side of the fore deck hatch coamings from the accommodation to the fo'csle until the builder solved the problem of hull strength.
Turrialba was a turbine ship and not a motor ship.

Tony Breach
22nd September 2006, 11:53
Rory & Jim,

Thanks your comments & information.
Rory, I finally managed to get back into this thread & took another look at my photo of ZENT (1) which is not too sharp. You are correct - on close inspection this is not a poop but a bulwark & therefore can be counted as a detail difference.
Jim, Seems that nhp is a bit of an abstract value although Haws does dwell on the vessels prior to TORTUGUERO (1) being overpowered for their speed requirements while he gives 12 knots as being the speed for all of the 9 ships. I'll never be much of an engineer!

Do you both think that, in view of the dimensions that I have taken from other publications, my proposed division of the NICOYA (1) seven vessels is correct. I understand that sister ships always have identical frames & there seems to be a difference between ZENT (1) & BARRANCA (1) & the ships that followed her. This difference is in all dimensions & GRT although there is a significant lookalike factor.

Tony

Rory
22nd September 2006, 18:32
Hello Tony;

Thanks for updating me on the correct nautical term “Bulwark”. It has been so many years since I was at sea I have forgotten most of the seagoing terms for nearly everything.

As Jim said, I too think there will be slight differences in ships from different builders, but also vessels from the same builder when they are constructed over a long time span. The basic specs from the same builder for some of the ships in question here are as follows from Alexander Stephen & Sons, Glasgow, by Clydeside Database. These present another version from wherever.

NICOYA-1905 3911grt 365’0”x 46’0”
BARRANCA-1906 4124grt 372’0”x 47’0”
TORTUGUERO-1909 4161grt 374’7”x 47’7”
MANZANARES-1911 4094grt 376’0”x48’0”

I would think there is no harm in putting the vessels into two different classes [or at least adding a sub class] as outwardly the ships with the bulwark aft do look quite different than the others.

The E&F “B-Class” of 19 Reefers were built over the span of nearly a decade 1920-1929. There were slight differences here too, and I’m not sure if I can give accurate specs for any of them, but were basically very near the same design throughout. One can easily tell the Cammell Laird vessels from the other two builders, but that’s about it.

Just my views, Tony.

Cheers,
Rory

PAULD
23rd September 2006, 15:14
[=P] (Hippy) The fuel pumps never fell of on the TURRIALBA so what happened on the M boats, May be lack of enginering knowledge

That is a bit harsh to question the engineering knowledge on Mazatec.
As the original writer stated the ship was only 4 months old and for holding down studs on a bank of fuel pumps to shear is most uncommon.
That said the Kawasaki built M-class of motorships had various mishaps in their early careers and were not my favourite ships. Motagua for instance had to take refuge at Hawaii on her maiden voyage when a crack developed across main deck. The other two ships of the class in service at the time were ordered to nearest suitable port where I-beams were welded to the main deck either side of the fore deck hatch coamings from the accommodation to the fo'csle until the builder solved the problem of hull strength.
Turrialba was a turbine ship and not a motor ship.

i agree with both of you the m class were troublesome, but the standard of some of the staff employed left much to be desired
i rembewr going through the panama canal we had a 4th and3rd of steam ships never sailed on motor, they had been on the ship a fortnight so they both took half the trip through with the second eng. I took the other half with the chief eng who sat in the control room chair pissed as a rat, and slept most of the passage, i was eng cadet at the time

wa002f0328
23rd September 2006, 18:07
what a great story, Turrialba was one of the best ships I sailed on, She was T class to a "T" built in Germany along with her sisters great ship great run, better than tankers,. she was class.(Thumb) (Thumb) (Smoke) (Hippy)

Rory
23rd September 2006, 21:30
Elders & Fyffes Banana / Tomato Boats.

While Duncan Haws does a fine job on these vessels in his “FLEET LISTS” I thought I would pass along more history on them not covered in the Haws Book.

Below is from Mr. Mark H. Goldberg’s fine book “GOING BANANAS”

ARGUAL, OROTAVA and TELDE These three sisters were "hot boats" equipped with natural draft ventilation built in 1927 to carry bananas and tomatoes for Elders & Fyffes Canary Island service from Liverpool.

Because of the tremendous growth in the size of the modern banana carrier, these three smart looking ships are regarded as Miniature "B"2 Class ships. Handsome three decked steel steamers with slightly raking bows and modified counter sterns, they would not really fit into Fyffes' fleet for very long. The ARGUAL came from the 'Newcastle yards?' of Cammell Laird while the OROTAVA and TELDE were built by Alexander Stephen and Sons, Ltd. at Linthouse. Measuring about 2,700 gross tons, they were 314 feet long overall, 300 feet long between perpendiculars, 44 feet in beam and 20.5 feet in depth. With a cargo capacity of about 127,000 cubic feet, they were listed at 1,603 net and 2,615 deadweight tons. Equipped with triple expansion engines, these ships generally steamed at 12.5 knots. The Depression cut into their trade forcing them to service other ports even splitting cargoes by leaving a portion in one and the remainder elsewhere. Fitted with an ammonia system of refrigeration in 1933, these three were transferred to the Mayan Steamship Corp. and registered in Honduras in 1934. The ARGUAL, at least, worked for a while between Boston and Honduras that year.

Because of the practice of loading heavy cargoes on deck in the Canary Island trade, these ships had a high metacenter, which rendered them somewhat stiff and made them liable to roll. Like the contemporary AZTEC class built at Cammell Laird, cement was poured into bridge wing cabs in an effort to serve as counterweights to their hulls. But the trio were never really cured of their tendencies and developed a reputation among sailors as ships to avoid on that score.

The TELDE inaugurated the new port at Barranquilla, Colombia on December 31, 1936, being the first ocean ship to tie up there. Scheduled to deliver her cargo as usual to Puerto Colombia, a last minute order from the home office instructed the ship to pick up officials there but to proceed into the new port. The new port eventually caused the demise of shipping operations at Puerto Colombia, some 10 miles away down the railroad track. During July 1937 all three sisters went for refits at the Sparrows Point yard of Bethlehem Shipbuilding where at a cost of $160,000 for all three, additional refrigeration was added and their banana capacity increased from 30,000 to 32,000 stems.

Like most refrigerated banana boats, these did their duty during the early war years, bringing countless loads of foodstuffs to bases around the Caribbean.

Quite appreciated were the cargoes of bananas and coffee these ships brought at the request of the authorities. During the later part of the War all three sisters were transferred to Los Angeles to work on the Pacific carrying general cargo south to Balboa and returning with bananas and coffee loaded at Quepos, Costa Rica. At the end of the War they worked between California and Hawaii. With the return of peacetime trading, the trio returned to the Caribbean. After nearly a decade of dependable postwar service, the ARGUAL was sold on November 12, 1954 for breaking up at the yards of the Pinto Island Metal Company breakers at Mobile, Alabama. The TELDE was sold on October 5, 1959. She was scrapped by the Patapsco Scrap Corp. at Baltimore. New boilers installed in the OROTAVA prolonged her life. She continued carrying bananas until sold for scrap in September 1967.

Jim S
23rd September 2006, 22:50
Rory,
Methinks Cammell Laird is at Birkenhead and not Newcastle - You obviously think so too hence your question mark after "Newcastle Yards".
Very interesting story though.
Jim S

KevinR
3rd January 2007, 00:48
Thanks for the further info on the fuel pump problem. - Am I correct that Manzanares was designed for UMS (unmanned machinery space) operation?
I guess the engine room must have been manned at the time of the incident or the result could have been disastrouswith all that hot fuel oil spraying about. The earlier M - class were not UMS classed (Matina,Morant,Motagua).
How long were you with Fyffes? I was with them from 1968 - 1974
Jim S

Yes, you are correct in that the Manzanares was designed for UMS operation. I sailed on her as C/Eng. and the ER was unmanned during the night.

Tony Breach
3rd January 2007, 12:53
Does anyone have the refrigerated hold capacities in cubic feet for the earlier UFC & E&F ships; mostly pre WW2. I have most of the books pertaining to these fleets but it seems that the capacities of the older ships were generally given in stems.

Another question - how did the ARIGUANI lose the top of her mainmast in WW2?

Tony

John Rogers
22nd January 2007, 22:01
Maybe she lost it when she was hit by two torpedoes in 1941. I have a picture of the Cavina with the main mast cut down when she was used as Ocean Boarding vessel in 1942 Not seen the Ariguani with her main mast down,dont remember that when I sailed on her in the 1950s
John

Jim S
22nd January 2007, 22:36
Does anyone have the refrigerated hold capacities in cubic feet for the earlier UFC & E&F ships; mostly pre WW2. I have most of the books pertaining to these fleets but it seems that the capacities of the older ships were generally given in stems.

Another question - how did the ARIGUANI lose the top of her mainmast in WW2?

Tony

Tony,
I have a couple of builder's drawings for CAMITO built by A.Stephen in 1956.
The total hold capacities are given in a number of catagories :-
Insulated Grain 273460 cubic feet
Insulated Bale 208310 cubic feet
Gross Bin 202740 cubic feet
Elevator Deduction 7360 cubic feet
Giving a NET BIN capacity of 195380 cubic feet.

The Insulated Grain appears to be a gross measurement of the hold capacities
The Insulated Bale is less Air Ducts, gratings etc
Gross Bin is as Insulated Bale less deductiions for fruit fittings, posts etc.

As built CAMITO was carrying bananas as "stems" -By the time I joined Fyffes in 1968 the fruit was being carried in boxes.

Jim S

Santos
23rd January 2007, 15:01
Does anyone remember a Gordon Goodwin Chief Engineer ? He was my gandfather and was with Elders & Fyffes for many many years. He was torpedoed and hurt his leg, during WW2, cant remember the name of the ship. He retired in the early 50s when the ships were based in Garston.

Chris.

R58484956
23rd January 2007, 15:30
Chris would suggest asking the same question on www.mowbars.plus.com if not already done so.

Santos
23rd January 2007, 18:39
Thanks, I might do that.

Chris.

Rory
31st January 2007, 07:54
Hi Tony;

Regarding the Ariguani, and her Foremast. I can only find the following reference in the Fyffe's book. "When "Ariguani" was returned to commercial service in 1946 it was decided to cut down the foremast to the "Tee". No explanation is given for this.
Cheers,
Rory

Syd young
1st February 2007, 12:41
Any crew out there from the TENADORES fyffe boat in the 1960's,great time in New orleans and Moblie

Bill Lewis
23rd March 2007, 09:49
I have listed the names of Fyffes Line staff that I remember during my time with the company from late 1967 until mid 1974 to see if it awakens any memories, good or bad. I apologise in advance that the names I remember are predominately engineering.
Eng Supts;- Frank Parsons, Bob Thomson, Tommy Chambers, Derek Griffiths.
Chief Engs;- "Sam" Greedy, John Smith, "Silias" Hall, Pat Stockbridge, Frank Meredith, Andy Beveridge, Brian? Clarricoates, ? De Rozario. Pat "Snecky" Inverarity.
2nd Engs;- Pat Carey
Elects;- Eric Taylor, George Briggs, Ken Carlisle, Hugh King, Mike Ryan, ? Williams, "Spider" Webb, Ernie Stanhope.
Refrig Engs;- Jimmy Leatherbarrow, Trevor Owen, Kevin Murphy or might have been Murray, Benny Banks, his brother Bobby Banks.
Captains;- Chubb, Hamilton, Thomson, the one from Arran, there was another "Aberdeen" Thomson, Hill, Dole, Young, Morris, Booth, Hodges, and Evans.
Gilbert who was Mate became Master before I left.
Pat Carey became Chief Eng on Rio Cobre.
Marcus Bowden who was 3rd Eng on Camito became Chief Eng on Barranca and when I last heard was with the Dutch based " "White Ships" Ship Management Co.
"Sam" Greedy became Supt and then Operations Manager before the demise of Fyffes.
I heard from Marcus Bowden a couple of years ago that some of the above have passed away. Tommy Chambers, Frank Meredith, Eric Taylor, Hugh King,
Jimmy Leatherbarrow and in tragic circumstances while still serving Bobby Banks.

Hi Jim,. this is indeed nostalgia, I knew or sailed with many of the above. Knew frank Parsons because he interviewed me for job as Junior Engineer and later appointed me to first job as second Engineer (Tilapa Voy 2) I was saddened to learn of so many deceased but then I realise 47 years have passed in some cases. However Jimmy Leatherbarrow was a shock likewise Bob Banks (in tragic circumstances) can anyone elaborate ?
There are more names that I can add to the above between 1959 -1965 if anyone is interested.

Bill Lewis.

TonyB aka Berni
23rd March 2007, 11:42
Sailed with Fyffes, as Third Mate, in early 70's. Always on T's Tucurinca and three trips on Turrialba. Enjoyed my time with them but moved on to Whitco for the usual reason...........more money plus world wide not just Central America / USA.

Fond memories of time with them.

Bill Lewis
24th March 2007, 11:02
Hi Jim,
The names Trevor Owen C/frig and Eric Taylor certainly ring a bell. The C/steward was a scouser whose brother I believe was a C/steward with Harrisons Liverpool. He was also the agent for Vat 19 from Trinidad.
If memory serves me correctly the problem on that trip was alack of feed water. There was a knackered forced draught fan.
You mentioned the Banks brothers. I sailed with Benny on the Tucarinca and with Bobby on either the Chicanoa or Changuinola where the 2/eng was Lewis {Two feet yard}. During that trip he got his feet badly scalded when a junior opened the 1st stage evap. open while still half full of rather hot water. Someone previous hadnt cut the centre out the inspection door.
Thanks for the reminiscences.

Hi:
I am the 2/E Lewis who had feet scalded on the C boat it may have been the Changuinola but I think it was the Chuscal. The Scotsman who took over my 4 to 8 watch whilst I was layed up, had a girlfriend working for British High Commission in Kingston. What happened to Bob Banks? we were good friends but lost touch when I came to Australia.
Bill.

lightfoot
18th April 2007, 21:45
Joined Manzanares as an engine cadet in early 1974 in Long Beach.C/eng was
Willy Duff. I stayed with Fyffes until 1982 when I left the Matina in Genoa as
2nd engineer. Happy days.

Santos
18th April 2007, 21:59
Probably a long shot but is there anyone who used to be with Fyffes who remembers my grandfather Gordon Goodwin, he was a Chief Engineer with them and retired in the early 50s.

Chris.

Scottseng
20th April 2007, 00:13
Bill
It was certainly the Changuinola where the accident happened,I never sailed on the Chuscal and it was my first encounter with Pat Inverarity.I was 4/e and on returning to my cabin after dinner on our first night at sea he was scrutinising the clan map of Scotland on the bulkhead,and after a few comments I asked if he was a Scotsman.He was waiting for you,drumming his fingers on the easychair in your cabin when came off watch.

Jim S
20th April 2007, 21:25
I only experienced a trip from Southampton to South Shields (for dry-docking)
with C/Eng Inverarity or "Inversnecky" or just "Snecky" as he seemed to be known as. Although I was 2/E on Chicanoa I was leaving at South Shield and the releaving 2/E was doubled up with me for the trip. It was he who had to endure Mr Inverarity. I remember his first words to the 2/E when we both went to make ourselves known to him " Aye, so you' are here under a cloud".

Bill Lewis
22nd April 2007, 04:56
Bill
It was certainly the Changuinola where the accident happened,I never sailed on the Chuscal and it was my first encounter with Pat Inverarity.I was 4/e and on returning to my cabin after dinner on our first night at sea he was scrutinising the clan map of Scotland on the bulkhead,and after a few comments I asked if he was a Scotsman.He was waiting for you,drumming his fingers on the easychair in your cabin when came off watch.

You are correct it was the Changuinola, my last trip. It proved to be a 'double header' we had a quick turn-around in Avonmouth, back to Jamaica and then payed off in London. Pat Inverarity was C/E, sometimes known as 'Too much hilarity Inverarity' which is what he used to mumble as he walked along the Engineers alleyway when the boys were partying. On the other hand I had sailed with his brother Frank Inverarity C/E some years earlier, he was as different as chalk and cheese, enjoyed a laugh and a drink with passengers and others. However I still thought that Pat was a good conciencious Chief and we got on well together when I was 3/E on the Chicanoa and 2/E on the Changinola. I am sill trying to place you as 4/E.

Scottseng
24th April 2007, 22:59
Bill
I signed on again in London and did another trip to Jamaica and left in Soton and then joined the Chicanoa as 3/e practically straight right away.
Jim
Was it in Feb.1967 that you brought the Changuinola up to Shields for D/dock, as I joined her there and Snecky was chief. Pat Stockbridge relieved him out in the States.

Bill Lewis
13th May 2007, 12:08
Scottseng,
I have placed you exactly, after re-reading your first encounter with 'Snecky" I remember you relating (with a chuckle) your meeting with him to me so well now. I left the sea after that trip and have enjoyed the rest of my life since, but look back on those times with great pleasure, hope the same applies to you.
Bill.

Scottseng
13th May 2007, 23:20
Bill Lewis
I was not aware that you had left Fyffes after that trip,but it is nice to hear that you are enjoying a happy retirement. I also look back to those days and think how laidback they were compared to today.

Jim S
14th May 2007, 19:43
It was July 1968 that I sailed on Chicanoa from Southampton to South Shields for dry docking - I had joined her as 2/E for my first trip with Fyffes in December 1967. Chiefs were Silias Hall then John Smith with Snecky for the trip to South Shields.
Later I sailed with Pat Stockbridge on Camito. Pat was releaving Sam Greedy the regular C/E.

AndyT
13th June 2007, 06:55
Alan
I sailed as Junior Engineer on the Davao in 79 and Darien in 80, Both were really hard working ships but the runs were great, especially the Darien, I joined her in Port Huon in Tasmania and payed off in Valpariso Chile 6 months later.

On Darien we had one drydock in Barry followed by two weeks engine repairs at the MAN engine builder in Hamburg. This was to replace if i recall correctly No7 unit entablitcher.

I later sailed on Motagua with a 4th engineer called Dave Millar who was from Whitby, He was on Morant when it went agound in the Carribean and was later towed to Savanah for repairs. He told me that the fuel oil double bottom sounding pipe caps were off and the cocks open when the ship went aground and what a mess.They thought they had struck oil.

The old man i think was a guy called Emyln Hughes, not the footballer.

Cheers
Andy

Jim

It could have been worse when I first joined Fyffes they asked me to join the Darien in Japan. Fortunately or unfortunately suppose which way you look at it she had a major engineroom fire of the coast of Japan. No one hurt I think but she was towed to a Japanese port for repair, on joining the Magdelana in Genoa everyone on board said I was very lucky to have missed the Darien.

Jim you might be able to answer this, one of the M boats hit an uncharted reef in the carribean sea and she had to be towed to Savanha for dry dock and repairs. The old man was highly thought of by crew on the Motagua. I think his first name was Emyln ?
Apparantly there is a statue on this reef dedicated to three scotsmen who lost there lives there.

Cheers Alan

Old Jake
19th February 2008, 10:04
Wonder if any of you Fyffes chaps sailed on the Motagua or Davao whilst they were under Whitco/Salen UK management. The Old Man on Davao was of the Chippendale family. (Furniture that is not male strippers)
Did a trip on Motagua in '77 and Davao in '78 before getting on one of the Moroccon Flagged Clipper class reefers the Smara. Oh great days they were.
Tim Spencer was old man on Smara. Brilliant chap from Sark.
(Thumb)

exmoor 77
20th February 2008, 10:42
hi al rogers, pete here melbourne, good to hear about the skinners pete

exmoor 77
9th March 2008, 04:21
thinking back about the deck crowds on the ari, and cav, and the bayano, remember hopton ,and swisher buck ,fred stinchcombe old oscar ,god what days in the foscle 6 in the cabin qms aghhh r548411

exmoor 77
9th March 2008, 10:21
thinking back about the deck crowds on the ari, and cav, and the bayano, remember hopton ,and swisher buck ,fred stinchcombe old oscar ,god what days in the foscle 6 in the cabin qms aghhh r548411

cant think what someone was saying re the Ariguani foremast cut down not in the early 50s thats for sure , painted her myself, aghh o if johny rogers is out there , great to meet jhn rogers who stopped into Port melbourne on the Cruise we only had a hour to have a quick half and he was gone, still great memories Of Shire and the Royal keep the flag flying petexxxxxxxxxxxx

John Rogers
15th March 2008, 19:11
Hello Pete, good to see you on the board. I wish I could of stayed longer in Melbourne swinging the lamp but I don't think the good captain would of waited for me,plus that would have been a long drive to Sydney to catch up with her. All those names you mentioned are now etched in stone,great bunch of men they were,don't make them like that anymore. Give Reg a bear hug for me but don't hurt him or break the bottle in his pocket.

R527835
16th March 2008, 02:13
Ah you guys bring water to me eye.. I think I may have posted this'n before. but sit back, pour a little Planters Punch and have another memory.




THE LINTHOUSE TWINS


When Stephen's Shipyard laid her keel
At Linthouse, on the Clyde;
And the rivets clenched the steel to steel,
While the Riggers 'rigged' topside.
Then the Clydeside shipyard's 'canny men'
Raked both her masts and stack,
These classic looks of an 'A' class ship
Just kept Fyffes coming back.
Then they gave her forced draught boilers,
With twin engines, painted white:
These Linthouse Twins, standing side by side:
In paired pristine delight.

She was champagne'd down the slipway
Like her sister ship before;
The CAVINA'S legend put to sea;
In Nineteen Twenty Four.
Then she had her final fit-out,
And a makeshift crew aboard;
When the twin screws dipped her counter stern;
Five thousand voices roared.
She was bunkered to the coamings,
There was coal from seam to seam:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
An engineering dream.

Now "Full Ahead" down the Irish Sea.
Against a gentle blow.
While the helmsman fought the gimbal'd road,
And the blackgang, down below;
Sliced, pitched and raked; and forged her myth,
And cursed her hungry maw;
Glared at the gauge with black-rimmed eyes;
And worked their fingers raw.
She came about; off St Ann's Head,
Stern to the Western Ocean:
And the Linthouse Twins, standing side by side:
In syncopated motion.

Between Lundy Isle and Avon mouth,
The Breaksea’s flashing light,
Would herald Bristol Pilot's launch;
And thirsts would ease, that night:
One King's tug took the bow line,
The Sea Prince hooked the stern,
The blackgang sighed, and eased their backs:
There's coal enough to burn.
The makeshift crew would head back north,
They'd finished their transaction;
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Still warm from all the action.

Warped, motionless against West Wharf:
Devoid of human sound:
Metallic silence: filled with time:
A Queen; as yet uncrown'd.
She waited for the different touch,
Of deep sea men; headstrong:
But sure of hand; their secret was:
The "Oldest kind of Song".
They came from England's south and west,
They brought their seamens' lore:
And the Linthouse Twins, standing side by side:
A nascent rhythmic core.

The strident song of life returns
As she prepares for sea.
The watches set; by Bosun's eye
For 'salt sagacity;'
Hold ready for the coming task
Of magic transformation;
Of moving steel and men, and minds;
To a distant destination.
Two Bristol hands caress the wheel;
Two Pill men ease the spring:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Matched powers, burgeoning.

The tugs' whistles build the tension
And she's eased out from her berth;
There's some cheering from the quayside,
People wave for all their worth.
Lines are snaking back and foreward,
Mates' caps dashing side to side,
Her counter stern just clears the lock;
She's made the evening tide.
Tugs take their leave at Kingroad,
The Avon's proper mouth:
And the Linthouse twins standing side by side:
Pushed the 'Cavina' south.

The Pilot, dropped at Breaksea Light,
Will miss the world that forms
When ships head westward, free of land,
In Western Ocean storms.
Some Westerlies, some North East Trades,
A thousand miles of sea;
Brief landfall, off the starboard bow,
The Azores slips a'lee.
The West Indies’ banana trade
Had grown with White Ships' fame:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Played their part in the game.

The rhythms of the ship and men
Were bonded to the sea;
And the markings of her labours
Were attended ceaselessly;
But the "Oldest Song" was being sung,
And unity prevailed;
As the White Ship crossed the hidden line
Where once the Pinta sailed.
But thoughts were few for history's course,
For they were making history then:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Crossed the hidden line again.

A British fact: When passengers
And crew live quietly, side by side;
Like planets in celestial arcs,
They never do collide.
They just revolve in their station,
Very British: without fuss;
Quite different when they're all aboard,
A Bristol Omnibus.
Ah; but this was not Potemkin,
With her history to acquit;
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Made revolutions by the minute.

The order came to "Rig the pool,"
And "Paint the Masts and Stack,"
So chairs were rigged and gantlines reeved,
And "Aye Aye's" thundered back.
The pool; a mix of canvas, spars;
Wireropes and bottlescrews,
Was set up on the Well Deck; aft;
And the blackgang had good views.
When the passengers, discreetly dressed,
Bathed in a box of sea;
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Pumped in complicity.

While seamen know how freedom feels
To work a bosun's chair,
And blackgangs know a banjo's weight;
Or desperate need for air;
The steward battles daily woe
Or visceral insurrection;
But none can match the Peggy's angst:
When the Captain has inspection.
Each Sunday brings this Moby Dick,,
In white, from head to toe:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Maintain the status quo.

Nineteen degrees of Latitude,
With blue translucent sea;
The rhythm of the holystones;
Fyffes water therapy.
Fifty degrees of Longitude,
Eight hundred miles to run,
Just two days from Barbados:
One day anchored in the sun.
The mail is lower'd to a launch,
The rum will come back up:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Each with an oiling cup.

With Trinidad and Port of Spain
Just half a day away,
From the western 'Caribbean' side
Of 'Little England's ' cay.
The steel drums and calypso sounds;
Now float out from the shore;
And the bottled liquid migraine
Means; it's Mardi Gras once more.
Strange music from a primal source
Throbs well in to the night:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Welcome the brief respite.

Berthed all too brief, in Port of Spain,
Just passengers and mail;
Some barter for 'Three Daggers' rum,
Then, 'standing by' to sail;
For Kingston and some time ashore;
Jamaican recreation;
West Indies fruit and produce
From Hannover Street plantation.
The Gleaner read, more 'Planter's Punch'
At the Myrtle Bank Hotel:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Get their oil changed as well.

The lure of Kingston after dark,
Reflected in the eyes,
Of the deck crew and the blackgang,
Who come back, with the sunrise.
They came with smiles and memories,
Some faint, some violent;
They bore the look of men who felt:
Their money was well spent.
Now waiting: while the tales unfold;
Pale prince, dark heroine:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Now waiting, to begin.

With steam syphoned from Scotch boilers
Her departing whistle's call,
Echoed and swooped through Kingston town;
Farewell, to one and all.
The twin screws pulled her bow round,
Her stern line slipped away,
The telegraph rang: 'Half Speed Ahead",
Next stop: Montego Bay.
The plantations get the order,
Fyffes want nothing but the best:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Respond to this behest.

Her twenty two feet, 'shallow draft',
Will moor most anywhere;
And Orocabessa's foreshore
Has a tiny rail line there.
Green stems are ported: high on heads,
A machete cleans the ends;
The Tallyman is keeping score,
Hands outstretched for stipends.
Four stems a penny, is the wage,
But no pay for the ripe:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Their pay: an oily wipe.

The final port of Martinique
Is slipping fast astern;
With North East course and North West wind
The helm needs, half a turn.
With fifteen days to Avonmouth
It's soogie time again;
So there's two men on the Foremast
And there's three men on the Main.
In the evening there's sea stories,
And there's smoking and there's rum:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

And so it was, for many years,
For thirty years or more.
This veteran queen of countless seas;
Had battled through a war.
She'd made her home at Avonmouth,
Her name was legendry;
She'd taken boys away from home,
And brought men back from sea.
Many names had made this legend;
Each with their tale to tell:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
Were famous names as well.

But then; in Nineteen Fifty six,
With progress closing in;
And the British Merchant Navy
Fought a fight they couldn't win.
So Fyffes sold the old Cavina,
She was renamed 'Catusha';
And went sailing to her graveyard,
With the flag of Panama.
She was broken up at Hong Kong;
Her fate, not unforseen:
And the Linthouse twins, standing side by side:
The still heart of a Queen.

Reg Kear
Australia ©1992

exmoor 77
16th March 2008, 06:45
god me old son, brings tears to the old eyes that , and we were really a part of all this, god i would not have missed my days for the world, and what a world, 50 years later we meet up with old friends have chat re-in force the good days of our youth , muscles rippled then, aghhhhhhhh, pete xxxx good to hear from you john and i will give reggie a hug for you pete xxxxxxxxxxxxxx

eric's ruth
6th April 2008, 15:11
Hello
I'm Eric Taylor's daughter just been reading about some of the old names I remember as a little girl. Going on the ship with mum when she was docked in Southampton and once having to go to Avonmouth. Are any of the crew still about from the old day's does anyone know if Marcus Bowden is today he used to come a vist dad once in a while before he passed away.

sailingday
8th April 2008, 13:06
Camito 1958, just did a couple of trips, nice saloon and passengers, I remember the captain was a big fan of Lonnie Donegan and played his music throughout the ship

jmcg
20th April 2008, 21:59
Hi all

I sailed on the MUSA and Motagua in the early 70's as GPSI. The engine room was always manned when under way by Eng and GPSI. As a deck rating I enjoyed the engine room and could "do the job" but the C.O. would never have engine room ratings on deck if he could help it.

seawing
11th May 2008, 20:52
Any crew out there from the TENADORES fyffe boat in the 1960's,great time in New orleans and Moblie

Hi Syd joined Tenadores 2 august 1965 whole crew paid off in BALTIMORE 7 april 1966 DAVE CLISHAM EX A/B

harryc1939
21st June 2008, 15:05
Yes you were lucky Darien and sister Davao were fine looking ships but engine wise they were dogs. The previous German owners were glad to get rid of them.
About the M-Class grounding and Master's name - I don't know but I know a man who might. Will let you know.
Jim S

Would this be Emlyn Jones

Jim S
21st June 2008, 18:14
Harry,
Yes, The Master of Morant at her grounding at Watling Island, San Salvador was Emlyn Jones. The date was 24th Oct 1979 and I believe the repairs to the ship's bottom came to around 3.5 million dollars.

Jim S

tom roberts
8th August 2008, 23:51
tom roberts tilapa june 1955os other os peter newlands awarded B.E.M was informed by skipper in jamaica where is peter now?nicoya april1957 chirrpo may 1958 one trip in each couldnt get used to the bloody spiders

tom roberts
8th August 2008, 23:52
(Jester) tom roberts tilapa june 1955os other os peter newlands awarded B.E.M was informed by skipper in jamaica where is peter now?nicoya april1957 chirrpo may 1958 one trip in each couldnt get used to the bloody spiders

billyboy
9th August 2008, 06:31
Not surprised Tom, them little critters have a nasty nip mate. I often wondered Did they carry any anti venom on those ships?
Dont think i could sleep with them critters marching around at night

Tony Breach
9th August 2008, 10:43
Hi Fyffes Folk,

I'm looking for some information on the 3 ex UFC ships RONDE, RIO COBRE & ROATAN which were in Fyffes service from 1969 to 1977. I am building a model of one but the plans are rather basic & do not show how the decks were constucted. I am assuming that being US built there were no wooden sheathed decks but would like confirmation. Assuming that most, if not all, decks were steel, what colour were they painted? Also what type of hatches did they have - were they plugs, boards & tarps or steel slabs & if steel slabs what colour were they? What colour were the winches, windlass & deck fittings such as bitts etc.?

I would be grateful for any information anyone might have.
Tony

NoMoss
9th August 2008, 11:28
Did my first trip to sea on "Ariguani" in March, 1955 - I was 2nd R/O

Regards

Trevor

That's a coincidence - I did my first trip as 2nd R/O on Ariguani in April 1956. Can't remember the name of the 'Chief'.

David E
10th August 2008, 01:18
That's a coincidence - I did my first trip as 2nd R/O on Ariguani in April 1956. Can't remember the name of the 'Chief'.

Snap !
I was 3M there from April 10th till 26th June 1956. Lundy-Master:Jock Penney 1M:Nigel Abbot 2M.Was glad to get out of her.The sight of me seemed to move RWL up from his normal "Convulsion 2nd Class" state to "Condition Bligh".

David E

Jack T
31st August 2008, 19:50
#####

blindcambo
7th September 2008, 18:46
Hi there I was on the Morant in75 for 6 months as a lowly deckboy.

Chris.

Brandane62
7th September 2008, 19:22
Hi all,

I was an 8 year old passenger on the Camito in September 1970. At the time I lived in Kingston, Jamaica; and was returning to Jamaica with my parents. We sailed from Southampton, complete with our newly acquired Ford Escort in the hold, which was bought in the UK and was also going to Kingston!

Half way across the Atlantic I took ill and was diagnosed by the ships Doctor (who liked a wee drink!) as having appendicitis. He was so concerned that he was going to have to operate on me that he went on the wagon..... Anyway, we managed to get to Antigua without him cutting me open, and from there I flew with my mother the rest of the way to Kingston for medical attention. I still have my appendix at the age of 46; turns out I had a kidney infection!!

Apart from that, I enjoyed the Camito experience and it was probably a major contributor to my decision to go to sea as a deck cadet with P&O 8 years later.

I always remember that some of the stewardesses and crew got together and bought me a get well present of a pen and pencil set; so if that was any of you, thanks again!

Al.

Jim S
9th September 2008, 19:38
Al,
I missed you by one trip I was on Camito for the following trip leaving Southampton 30th Sept 1970.
The stewardesses on Camito at that time would have been Margaret a Welsh girl and Eileen a South African.

Brandane62
10th September 2008, 07:28
Al,
I missed you by one trip I was on Camito for the following trip leaving Southampton 30th Sept 1970.
The stewardesses on Camito at that time would have been Margaret a Welsh girl and Eileen a South African.

Hi Jim,

I think that was the same trip! Now that I think about the dates; 2 of my brothers started at school in the UK that September, so we were definitely still in UK mid september, then visited relatives in Swansea en route to Southampton. So yes, that would fit in with a 30th September departure.

Al.

bloomdido
22nd September 2008, 00:54
Yes you were lucky Darien and sister Davao were fine looking ships but engine wise they were dogs. The previous German owners were glad to get rid of them.
About the M-Class grounding and Master's name - I don't know but I know a man who might. Will let you know.
Jim S

hi guys the ship in question was the morant,my dad bob grieves was chief on there at the time.the ship was carrying two bods from the office in the states going on a visit to banana land,the old man decided to take the ship into the bay to show the passengers a monument on the cliffs,acording to my dad at almost normal crusing speed,then without waring ran her onto a reef.dad told me that the old man was a really good guy and it was a real shame as he lost his job over the incident,ill find out his name and post later
all the best
malcolm grieves

BillH
22nd September 2008, 09:58
Hi there I was on the Morant in75 for 6 months as a lowly deckboy.

Chris.
MORANT
6,082g. 3,059n. 134.52 x 20.42 x 12.58 metres bp.
10-cyl. 2 S.C.S.A. (700 x 1200mm) MAN K10Z70/120E type oil engine made by the shipbuilder, geared to a controllable pitch propeller. 12,600 BHP. Thwartship thrust controllable pitch propeller forward.
17.6.1969: Keel laid by Kawasaki Heavy Industries Ltd., Kobe (Yard No. 1121) for Elders & Fyffes Ltd., later restyled as Fyffes Group Ltd., London. 27.9.1969: Launched. 8.1.1970: Completed. 1982: Sold to Abdullah Abbar & Ahmed Zainy Cold Stores, Saudi Arabia, (Cayzer, Irvine Shipping Ltd., managers), and renamed AL ZOHAL. 1988: Managers restyled as CI Shipping Ltd. 1992: CI-SAF Shipping Ltd. appointed as managers. (50:50 CI Shipping & SafMarine). 1993: Managers restyled as London Ship Managers Ltd. 22.1.2000: Arrived at Alang for demolition. 2.2000: LR deleted owners and managers – vessel to be demolished.

Weemac
25th October 2008, 09:36
Hi I was 3m on Patia when we took her to the breakers west of Genoa still have her US courtesy Flag.

R815614
26th October 2008, 19:09
Hi joined morant in Kobe on maiden voyage 7.1.70 as GPSTWD also inJan 71 and June 73 as purser. Also maiden voyage on Musa.Twice on Matina plus 1. Once on Magdelana .Plus other Fyffes?Whitco/Salen ships over 15yrs. Central America took some beating as runs ashore. Eddie R815614

BillH
26th October 2008, 19:47
Hi joined morant in Kobe on maiden voyage 7.1.70 as GPSTWD also inJan 71 and June 73 as purser. Also maiden voyage on Musa.Twice on Matina plus 1. Once on Magdelana .Plus other Fyffes?Whitco/Salen ships over 15yrs. Central America took some beating as runs ashore. Eddie R815614
MATINA
6,085g. 3,066n. 134.52 x 20.42 x 12.58 metres bp.
10-cyl. 2 S.C.S.A. (700 x 1200mm) MAN K10Z70/120E type oil engine made by the shipbuilder, geared to a controllable pitch propeller. 12,600 BHP. Thwartship thrust controllable pitch propeller forward.
1.3.1969: Keel laid as MATINA by Kawasaki Heavy Industries Ltd., Kobe (Yard No. 1120) for Elders & Fyffes Ltd., later restyled as Fyffes Group Ltd., London.
17.6.1969: Launched.
30.9.1969: Completed.
1982: Sold to Abdullah Abbar & Ahmed Zainy Cold Stores, Saudi Arabia, (Cayzer, Irvine Shipping Ltd., managers), and renamed AL ATTARED.
1988: Managers restyled as CI Shipping Ltd.
1992: Pellmore Ltd later restyled as CI-SAF Shipping Ltd. appointed as managers. (50:50 CI Shipping & SafMarine).
1993: Managers restyled as London Ship Managers Ltd.
3.10.1993: Arrived at Chittagong Roads for demolition.
29.10.1993: LR deleted owners and managers – vessel to be demolished.

MUSA
6,075g. 3,121n. 134.52 x 20.40 x 12.58 metres bp.
10-cyl. 2 S.C.S.A. (700 x 1200mm) MAN K10Z70/120E type oil engine made by the shipbuilder, geared to a controllable pitch propeller. 12,600 BHP. Thwartship thrust controllable pitch propeller forward.
26.1.1971: Keel laid as MUSA by Kawasaki Heavy Industries Ltd., Kobe (Yard No. 1147), for Elders & Fyffes Ltd., later restyled as Fyffes Group Ltd., London.
27.4.1971: Launched.
3.8.1971: Completed.
1982: Sold to Abdullah Abbar & Ahmed Zainy Cold Stores, Saudi Arabia, (Cayzer, Irvine Shipping Ltd., managers), and renamed AL ZAHRAH.
1988: Managers restyled as CI Shipping Ltd.
1992: Pellmore Ltd, later restyled as CI-SAF Shipping Ltd. appointed as managers. (50:50 CI Shipping & SafMarine).
1993: Managers restyled as London Ship Managers Ltd.
8.2.2000: Arrived at Alang for demolition.
3.2000: LR deleted owners and managers – vessel to be demolished.

Mike Wiltshire
12th November 2008, 20:23
I sailed with Emlyn Jones in the Musa in 72 on her maiden voyage, Emlyn was the mate and I was the 3rd engineer and he really was a very nice person.
His name came up in the late 80s' when a surveyor friend, who was a real stickler for correctness, mentioned that he had done a dockside safety survey of a ship and found a problem with a lifeboat even though it had recently been inspected by an American Bureau of Shipping inspector in New Orleans (I think it was) named Emlyn Jones. I assumed that this was the same Emlyn and I hope that thinks worked out for him and his wife Annette.
I joined Morant and Fyffes as 3rd eng in November 1970 and sailed as 3rd in Musa and Manistee and 2nd engineer in Mazatec and Manzanares.
Reliefs always seemed hard to come by though so I went with T&J Harrisons in 75 as 2nd and later chief engineer before the UK job market started to shrink dramatically as the companies flagged out or went container.
That was another great old time British shipping company, but I still have happy memories of my time with Fyffes.

Bosun bill
23rd November 2008, 19:51
anyone around who sailed on SS Sulaco 1957/1962 (A)

kenji
30th November 2008, 04:26
have just foind this thread and would like to know if anyone has ever come across anyone who sailed the last voyage of the sulaco. i was senior 5th and 2nd frig eng. am an aussie and would love to hear from anyone who actually sailed on the sulaco as well.
in '64 we rang off finish with engines for the very last time up the aix river in ghent.

lilguy43uk
30th November 2008, 08:05
Never on a "M' boat but sailed on the "A", "B" and "C"
ARIGUANI, BAYANO,CORRALES,and the CAVINA . Oh!! Happy days.
John

I sailed on Corrales to the west coast of Africa. My first trip.

Tanuki
17th January 2009, 17:07
To answer the original question, (though a long time ago that it was posted) I sailed on Morant in late 1977 (joined in Baltimore and paid off in Rotterdam with a cargo of bananas). Very fond memories indeed, as she was my first cargie boat, after many years enduring the torture of the passie boats. But, I sailed with her when she was managed by Whitco Marine ... and so I am intruding on your forum. Apologies -- but I just have such fond memories of that ship :cool: . The fast clippers were such a beautiful vessel. Out of interest, in "another world" I discovered that a colleague of mine, Peter Malpas also sailed on the Morant, but many years after my time. I think he was Fyffes.

janp
21st January 2009, 12:01
I must have sailed with you on Camito - I joined her in late October 1968 for eight consecutive trips until end June 1969 as 2nd Eng. After study leave I rejoined her in December 1969 until end March 1970, End Sept 1970 until end Feb 1971 and April 1971 until Sept 1971. In total 22 trips as 2nd Eng.
In March/April 1972 On gaining Chief's ticket I did a trip as C/Eng on Camito before joining new container ship Bayano for motorship time.
I sailed with C/Engs Sam Greedy and Pat Stockbridge and with Jimmy Leatherbarrow on Camito - I heard a couple of years ago that Jimmy was dead.
He was a great lad - with a bit of encouragement Jimmy and Elaine one of the two stewardesses would put on an excellent display of the Zorba the Greek Dance.

Yes I was on my first trip Dec 1969, first time at sea, away from home, with boorish passengers and some with different "alignments" total cultural shock. Lasted 2 trips, asked for a transfer. Was sent to Bremerhaven to take over Patia.

voyagerx1
22nd January 2009, 12:06
Hi, I did a run to Jamaica on the Patuca mid '73 as steward, Kingston, Montego Bay and Port Antonio. None of the officers knew about the two girls we had on board in MBay, then those who flew to Port A, Officers had fun stripping me and paying for that girl, lol if only they'd know I had allready gotten 'involved' with one, it might have saved them a little money. Thanks to the Chief Steward for making the fun possible. :) R88878 Bernie Granger

wharferat
8th February 2009, 21:46
Jim


Jim you might be able to answer this, one of the M boats hit an uncharted reef in the carribean sea and she had to be towed to Savanha for dry dock and repairs. The old man was highly thought of by crew on the Motagua. I think his first name was Emyln ?
Apparantly there is a statue on this reef dedicated to three scotsmen who lost there lives there.

Cheers Alan


Hi,
I sailed on all 4 of the Mk 1 M Boats after they were sold on in the early 80's. The grounding brings back memories of when I was on the ship Al Zohal by then. The word was that the stb'd genny shouldn't be run above 400 kW as the bed plate was probably not true after a grounding some years before. However, during the trip I was on her the crankshaft fractured, almost exactly in half, & the cause was put down to fatigue/cyclical stresses as a result of the grounding. When a spare crankshaft was scourced & supplied to the ship, MAN were in attendance & stated that the bedplate was definitely not true & the main bearing pockets had to be re-machined.
Funnily enough, after reading someones comments about 3 trips, etc, we did have some ex Ffyfes guys sailed on the ships after they'd been sold, & at least one said that that particular ship was better than when he'd sailed on it before. We put it down to the fact that the same people had been sailing in class for over 10 years by then, rather than different companies manning them without any thought for the future.
Being MAN's they were filthy engines, but once we got used to them they weren't all bad, & they were pretty good sea ships.

harryc1939
12th February 2009, 15:03
I sailed with Fyffes on the following ships Chicanoa sept.61 to jan.62 Telde feb.62 to aug.62 Tetela oct.62 to apr.63 Tucurinca sept.63 to jan64 Tenadores jul.64 to feb.65 Changuinola sept.65 to jan66 Chicanoa feb66 to may66 Changuinola feb67 to oct67 Turrialba dec67 to june68 Camito aug68 todec68.
Captains sailed with Morris,Howell,Nicholson,Chubb,Cruickshank,Hamilton ,Hodges,Wallis and Arran Thomson.
C/Eng sailed with
Pashley,Peach,Balls,Inverarity,Stockbridge,Purdon and Greedy.
2/Eng I can remember
Mason,Fairgreives. There was one from Renfrew Alastair who was drowned along with his father and brother on the old Lochinvar.
Also a leckie Ken Harper
The supers were Parsons,Thomson,Tommie Chambers and Reggie Raines
Jimmy Leatherbarrow was on one the T boats as third and Camito as C/Frig.
is this you tommy

Tom Inglis
12th March 2009, 18:02
I sailed with Fiffes for about a year. Joined Telde in Bremen March 1964 as 3rd mate and sailed out to Almirante with a load of Kraft paper. Then spent six months on bananas on both coasts discharging New Orleans, Baltimore and New york then on West coast to Long Beach and Seatle. After that did 5 trips as 3rd mate on Golfito The old man was an Ulsterman from Liverpool call Ferguson 2nd mate Bob Yell. Can't remember Mate's name but he seemed to get his way regularly with the passengers.
Happy days . I enjoyed that time as a sojourn from Blue Funnel, but went back to Blueys after Golfito May 1965.
My Mate Dave Slater who encouraged me to join him in Fyffes went to CPships and eventually ashore in Vancouver as a timber loading superintendent.
Anybody know any of these guys??
Tom Inglis

Chazeroo
12th March 2009, 19:35
Wow, reading all your quotes and stories has certainly brought back a load of fond memories of the Fyffes fruit boats and some of the guys that sailed on them. I'm afraid I'm rather a new boy on the scene. Unlike you old seadogs, I didn’t join Fyffes until October of 74, but I have fantastic memories of the Rio Cobre Oct 74-Mar 75, Ronde May 75-Sep 75, Manzanares Oct 75-Feb 76 and Dec 76-Apr 77, Davao Apr 76-May 76 and the Morant Jul 76-Sep 76.
I also read that Hugh King died, what a shame, smashing bloke. I remember him on the Rio Cobre, in fact I think I have a photo of him on deck when we ‘ran out of steam’ after just leaving the Panama Canal on the east coast. We were then towed into Balboa by one of the ‘A’ boats I think, after floating around in the Pacific for a day or two. If any of you guys were on the above boats at those times, I’d love to hear from you. Unfortunately, some of the memories have slipped away and I’d like to be reminded of them again.
One thing that does come to mind was while I was on the Morant, we docked at Hoboken, New Jersey for drydocking, and a ruptured crown on the aux'y boiler, that's when Whitco Marine took over the ship and I left and went back to the Manzanares. Great ships, great life.

RobW
24th March 2009, 17:08
Message to Tanuki - Mr. Malpas wants to confirm if your true identity, ie surname, is related to a clothing fastening? I have the pleasure of Mr. M's company in London for two weeks from Down Under.

geordie peacock
24th March 2009, 17:30
Any one from the 'M' boats before being sold on in the 80's

I was on all the M boat as a Leading seaman, 73-77.
George Peacock

jmcg
29th March 2009, 13:20
They were GP manned in my time - did they revert to conventional crewing i.e deck, engine, catering ratings?

GP crewing never a success for deck management. Will start a thread on GP crewing later.

BW

J

mcguire
11th April 2009, 20:19
I was on all the M boat as a Leading seaman, 73-77.
George Peacock

sailed on all the m boats from 1970/1976 gpstw had alot of good times

mcguire
11th April 2009, 21:12
Hi joined morant in Kobe on maiden voyage 7.1.70 as GPSTWD also inJan 71 and June 73 as purser. Also maiden voyage on Musa.Twice on Matina plus 1. Once on Magdelana .Plus other Fyffes?Whitco/Salen ships over 15yrs. Central America took some beating as runs ashore. Eddie R815614

hi eddie did you no peanuts

p.bassham
17th April 2009, 15:21
Hello shipmates, sailed on the Ronde 18/09/72 to 074/11/72 paid off sick in Porto Cortes, worst ship I ever sailed on but the run was great !!!
Was Assistant Steward at the time lots of trouble on board. flew out from London mixed crew,remember trouble betwwen I Irish AB and a Northern Irish AB.
Anyone on Board at the time? Regards Peter Bassham

Terry Worsley
21st April 2009, 20:00
Never on a "M' boat but sailed on the "A", "B" and "C"
ARIGUANI, BAYANO,CORRALES,and the CAVINA . Oh!! Happy days.
John

I did one trip on the BAYANO as a Fireman Dec 1947 Jan 1948 - what a nightmare! talk about Dantes Inferno!We had three stowaways outward bound and 8 Jamaican stowaways homeward bound. Also served in the NICOYA to Tiko in what was the British Camerooons. Best of all was the maiden voyage in the GOLFITO

p.bassham
23rd April 2009, 12:03
anyone sailed on the Ronde 17/08/72 joined in Baltimore sailed to Porto Cortes - Almeria - Marsailes - Genoa - Tela - Charleston ECT.
I was Assistant steward on her, also has anyone got a good photo of her ?
Pete Bassham.

fowler19481
1st May 2009, 20:48
JUst read your entry,i was on the morant when we had that time in new jersey,if i remember right the problem happened in albany,i was catering boy.Ian Walker

jackman
5th May 2009, 17:59
Hi. I was on the Manistee from 23-8-1949. sailed out of,and returned to the West India Docks--Also on the Eros in May 1946 and again [ Eros] in October 1949.

derek.colley
13th September 2009, 04:23
Hi gents - just found this thread - very intresting.
I served with Cayzer Irvine Shipping/C.I. Shipping/London Ship Managers from 86 - 02. Served on all four of the 'M' boats that were managed by C.I. for the DiNadai Group (who operated them) and the Saudi owners, 'Star Marine'.
The vessels were 'Al Attared' (Matina), Al Moshtaree (Montagua), Al Zohal (Morant) and Al Zahrah (Musa).
Their initial service was from Jeddah to Guatamala but by the time I joined them they were mainly running from Jeddah to Colombia (Turbo, Santa Marta).
By the mid '90s they were running mainly to the Philippines (Davao).
Known as the 'Al' boats, they were either loved or hated by the C.I. staff, I think the latter because they were nominally 'dry' ships. I enjoyed my time on them and they were performing well right to the end.
Some (one?) were fitted witha bow-thruster but they were long defunct. We use to berth them in Davao on a number of awkard berths with very limited tug assistance and they always handled beautifully.
The Al Attared suffered an engine room fire off the Philippines from which she never really recovered and I took her to scrap in Chittagong. I still have the Japanese doll from her lounge.
The Al Zohal's doll is in the Seamans Mission in Davao.
Some 'Great White' lads came over to C.I. with the boats but I can only remember a 3rd Engineer, Mark 'Womble' Wilding (who eventually became a Chief Engineer with LSM.)
Hope the above is of some interest, as I have enjoyed reading all your posts.
Rgds
Derek Colley

Davidh 54
15th September 2009, 19:09
I was on Mazatec late 83 Golly,Tela,ETC.........Happy Days,Now where did i put that pure coconut oil,suns coming out!

Hi was on the Mazatec,as a junior engineer circa 1975, anchor chain managed to get knotted after going 360 deg. on bow thruster! what with stowaway discovered after shutting down main engine to fix oil leak on turbo charger hydraulic changeover ram.Bosun was going aft to hoist red duster when he heard knocking from hatch cover, when opened he was asked if this was America!Happy days indeed also sailed on Patuca and Tucurinca

A.J.McMahon
16th September 2009, 16:02
I did one trip on the BAYANO as a Fireman Dec 1947 Jan 1948 - what a nightmare! talk about Dantes Inferno!We had three stowaways outward bound and 8 Jamaican stowaways homeward bound. Also served in the NICOYA to Tiko in what was the British Camerooons. Best of all was the maiden voyage in the GOLFITO

Hi Terry, Was the 2nd engineer at the time Ken Peach, Welsh ABA, and not afraid to use it. He told us a few tales about the old coal burners, although by '47 I would think you were changed over to oil fires. I stood/by the Nicoya at the last moment the office put me on the Reventazon. Nice little ship, George Griffiths was Chief Eng, The Skipper was P.A Chubb it was a good trip after the initial six hours tracing an electrical fault on a plural start panel.The ship had ships side return, like a car, exept everything was in German, the drawings the labels,we were initially unable to transfer any fuel and the day tank was going down minute by minute, after that the trip was a breeze.

Jim S
16th September 2009, 19:27
Tony,
I think Bayano and other "A-Class" ships remained coal fired until broken up around 1956. They had the dubious honour of being the last coal fired passenger ships on the Atlantic.

Certainly there were a couple of 2nds later Chief Engineers from that era who were, lets say, handy with their fists.

Regards

voyagerx1
16th September 2009, 20:48
Never on a "M' boat but sailed on the "A", "B" and "C"
ARIGUANI, BAYANO,CORRALES,and the CAVINA . Oh!! Happy days.
John

mine was the Patuca. and a good time was had by all but me and the chief steward had more fun than most......

A.J.McMahon
21st September 2009, 13:33
Tony,
I think Bayano and other "A-Class" ships remained coal fired until broken up around 1956. They had the dubious honour of being the last coal fired passenger ships on the Atlantic.

Certainly there were a couple of 2nds later Chief Engineers from that era who were, lets say, handy with their fists.

Regards

Hi Jim,
I think you are "correct" When I wrote a reply to the thread my mind was Oct/Nov 1958, regarding the fuel oil. I know the SS Manistee, I was standing by was oil fired.----- At that time there were 3 Fyffes ships in Avonmouth, It could be that one was an "A" boat, for this is the time frame that I first met Ken Peach, who I subsequently sailed with on a few ships during my time with E/F One good thing about coal bunkers was if a spill occured, it could be sorted. I well recall a day at "S" or "Q" shed Avonmouth, whilst taking bunkers, just hours befor a price rise, sounding (that meant taking an ullage) of No2 DB, with a trim of 5' forard 25' aft and a list of 10', the black stuff followed the ullage tape out of the sounding pipe!!!! Not a lot, but it feels like you struck oil when you are in full view of everone, especially when the "Office and the Eng.Super" are aboard for lunch. This was not one of the Great White Fleet, but a rather new black hulled vessel. Incidently the part of the thread about the Reventazon was around spring 1962 Best Regards AJM.

David E
21st September 2009, 23:19
Hi Jim,
I think you are "correct" When I wrote a reply to the thread my mind was Oct/Nov 1958, regarding the fuel oil. I know the SS Manistee, I was standing by was oil fired.----- At that time there were 3 Fyffes ships in Avonmouth, It could be that one was an "A" boat, for this is the time frame that I first met Ken Peach, who I subsequently sailed with on a few ships during my time with E/F One good thing about coal bunkers was if a spill occured, it could be sorted. I well recall a day at "S" or "Q" shed Avonmouth, whilst taking bunkers, just hours befor a price rise, sounding (that meant taking an ullage) of No2 DB, with a trim of 5' forard 25' aft and a list of 10', the black stuff followed the ullage tape out of the sounding pipe!!!! Not a lot, but it feels like you struck oil when you are in full view of everone, especially when the "Office and the Eng.Super" are aboard for lunch. This was not one of the Great White Fleet, but a rather new black hulled vessel. Incidently the part of the thread about the Reventazon was around spring 1962 Best Regards AJM.

I think the last of the last coal burners was "Cavina" in December 1956. Bayano,Cavina and Ariguani used to bunker at Port Royal in Kingston and a stock of coal was held there for them. This was run down as the three ships retired one by one.Cavina was the last and we found that there was insufficient coal remaining to to get us back to Avonmouth.After a fairly desperate search around the Caribbean we found enough stock at St Thomas in the American Virgin Islands to get us home.

R815614
4th September 2010, 16:34
hi eddie did you no peanuts

hello just looking through old fyffes messages and found that you asked if i new peanuts well yes i sailed with him on Matina,Morant and Pacuare I think ,and i think i remember that you were on them as well. eddie

voyagerx1
9th September 2010, 22:01
I was steward on the Patuca... anyone remember the Chief Steward and the two girls we bought back to the ship in Montego bay and how they flew to Port Antonio to meet us and the ship again... funny thinking the officers paid a girl to see if I was gay.. they didn't know I was sleeping with a girl and wasn't interested in laying anything else....

tom roberts
12th April 2012, 14:31
It is a long time since Ive posted on this thread, but when I did I was tryng to find an old pal a Peter Newlands B.E.M.who I sailed with on the Tilapa when we were both SOSs.Well I have just discovered why he was awarded the B.E.M,it was for attempting along with another seaman to rescue a man who had fallen into the oil covered dock in Flaaringden Holland.Peter was on the M.V. Asperity at the time it was around February 1955.The other seaman was awarded the Queens Commendation for Brave conduct phosthumously.The chap they attempted to recscue was named J McGEE. Peter must be one of the youngest persons to have been awarded such an honour.

davemackay
23rd April 2012, 21:27
(Pint)leith shippingpool punished me by sendingme down to southampton
6/may/1964/ to join ss camito sent down the holds with big brush
and swept away big bloody spiders and rats then every day washed down decks very busy dull trip signed of 31 may 1964/
short trip dave mackay E.D/H.(@)(@)

Basil
23rd April 2012, 22:00
davemackay,
Where did you go? IIRC, the big boats went to Port Antonio.
Re the spiders; when I was a 20yo junior engineer, we used to do 'fridge watches on the way home with cargo. Whilst walking through the hold on Matina one night to check temperatures (no telemetry) I found a large but lethargic spider. I took her back to my cabin and tied the bitter end of a bobbin of thread around her waist. Back in the nice warm engine room the spider became a bit lively just as it was lowered onto the shoulder of the sleepy watchkeeper.
The only other time I've seen someone move sideways so fast was when a gorilla grabbed him - but that's another story :)

baz140
21st February 2013, 19:56
think it was capt jones

baz140
21st February 2013, 19:59
was on mazatec when she hit reef up the gulf took her to japan for dry dock with sand as ballest

John Rogers
21st February 2013, 21:35
Anybody remember the name of the river we went up to load at Teco/Teko in the Cameroons W.Africa.

Ron Stringer
22nd February 2013, 00:34
Anybody remember the name of the river we went up to load at Teco/Teko in the Cameroons W.Africa.

Was it the Bimbia River? Long time ago but remember talking on the HF skeds to the 'Chirripo' or the 'Matina' out of Garston, which was anchored in the Bimbia River waiting to go up to Teko.

bob nightingale
22nd February 2013, 01:09
Thanks for post,
Would like to know river going to tiko.
Can obviously get from chart but this thread is interesting.
Bob

John Rogers
22nd February 2013, 02:22
Was it the Bimbia River? Long time agom but remember talking on the HF skeds to the 'Chirripo' or the 'Matina' out of Garston, which was anchored in the Bimbia River waiting to go up to Teko.

Thanks Ron,that is the name I was looking for.

Emlyn Jones
26th March 2013, 18:15
Hey Mike Wiltshire, Sorry it took so long but this is Captain Emlyn Jones

John Rogers
26th March 2013, 18:53
Welcome to SN Emlyn,your name has a Welsh ring to it.

venkys_out
29th May 2013, 09:31
My Granfather is in these 2 pictureS, Ron Braidwood.
I think he was an Electrical Officer.

George McCaffery
31st July 2013, 18:33
I sailed on the Chicanoa my first trip as baby R/O in 1969 from North Shields 4 months on the US/ central american coast. Then done 2 trips on the Golfito to finish my 6 months before going as solo R/O. Happy times and great runs

George McCaffery
31st July 2013, 19:03
I joined the Chicanoa in North Shields After dry dock August 1968. My first trip 2nd R/O the R/O was Maurice Meehan, the Old Man was Morris and C/E was Inverarity. Kevin King was Fridge Eng. Memory fails me after that.

Jim S
31st July 2013, 21:34
I signed off Chicanoa on 18th July 1968 at South Shields as she was being dry docked. - I had completed 6 months as 2/E on her. Pat Inverarity C/E had joined in Southampton relieving John Smith prior to the run up to South Shields.
Could the Fridge Engineer been Kevin Kilduff and not Kevin King?

George McCaffery
4th August 2013, 17:56
Hi Jim, No the Fridge was Kevin King from South Shields a lovely lad, i did see him for a number of years after that but have lost touch with him.

Jim S
4th August 2013, 19:34
Hi George,
My apologies if it seemed I was doubting you. A coincidence that Kevin King become Fridge Engineer on Chicanoa when his predecessor was Kevin Kilduff from Stockport
Hughie King was an Electrician and had thought that the two names had become entwined with the passing of time.

George McCaffery
5th August 2013, 01:41
Hi Jim, If it had not been that Kevin was from South Shields i would have doubted myself. It was a long time ago. I do however remember sailing between the tyne piers as if it was yesterday.

Alan Johnston
29th March 2014, 01:09
I sailed on the Matina III in 1964/5 as galley boy.
My father was Leslie Norman Johnston, he sailed on most of the "T" boats.
He passed away in 1962 on board the Turrialba.

Does anyone remember us and if so have any photographs of him.

john lintern
2nd April 2014, 13:05
i was chief cook on manzanares ,1979,chief steward was colin hinds,2nd cook was don roach-bryce,galley boy ginger from dover,a good ship and crew