MV Dalla

the_vietnam_bear
18th October 2009, 23:44
Anybody on here sail on the Dalla around the 1970's.

I was chippy on her sailing from east coast USA to West coast West Africa.

stan mayes
19th October 2009, 00:05
I think Les Gilbert of Tilbury was Chief Steward of Dalla during those years.

davewr
21st October 2009, 13:42
I was 4/Engineer on the Donga in 1974 doing the same run - West Africa to the US. Most ports from Jacksonville to Houston.

eldersuk
21st October 2009, 23:51
I was 2/Eng on the Dalla 73/74

Derek

Crabman
22nd October 2009, 22:57
Was on Dalla 12/74--04/75 as cadet and again 08/79--11/79 as Third Mate

Tony Mundella
4th November 2009, 18:31
I was cadet on the Dalla from Dec 69 to Jun 70 with Capt DG Brown, Ted Greenwood was 2/O and Mylo Parry 3/O - if I really think hard I might remember some others!

the_vietnam_bear
8th November 2009, 00:38
I have a photo of us crossing the atlantic in 1970 Ted, Mylo, Billy the Liverpool bosun, Charlie 3/e from Newcastle who was sent ashore due to drink problems.

I will try to scan the photo if you want a copy please send me a private message.

BillH
8th November 2009, 09:54
DALLA (1972) Steel motorship.
O.N. 301444. 6,564g. 3,476n. 465' 0" x 63' 1" x 26' 7 "
8,831g. 5,067n. x 28' 3 "
4-cyl. 2 S.C.S. A. (750 x 1500mm) B&W type oil engine made by J. G. Kincaid & Company Ltd., Greenock. 5,850 BHP. 14 kts.

1.2.1961: Launched by Lithgows Ltd., Port Glasgow (Yard No. 1141), for the British and Burmese Steam Navigation Company Ltd., (P. Henderson & Company, managers), Glasgow.
1961: Completed.
20.3.1964: Sold to Elder Dempster Lines Ltd.
1972: Transferred to the China Mutual Steam Navigation Company Ltd., for one round voyage to the Far East.
1972: Reverted to Elder Dempster Lines Ltd.
19.3.1980: Sold to Diamant Engineer Shipping Company Ltd., Greece, and renamed MARMARAS.
1982: Sold, in a damaged condition, to Seagleam Maritime Ltd., Cyprus.
9.1983: Sustained fire damage to engine room and accommodation.
19.6.1984: Delivered to Brodospas, Split, for demolition.

the_vietnam_bear
10th November 2009, 00:00
DALLA (1972) Steel motorship.
O.N. 301444. 6,564g. 3,476n. 465' 0" x 63' 1" x 26' 7 "
8,831g. 5,067n. x 28' 3 "
4-cyl. 2 S.C.S. A. (750 x 1500mm) B&W type oil engine made by J. G. Kincaid & Company Ltd., Greenock. 5,850 BHP. 14 kts.

1.2.1961: Launched by Lithgows Ltd., Port Glasgow (Yard No. 1141), for the British and Burmese Steam Navigation Company Ltd., (P. Henderson & Company, managers), Glasgow.
1961: Completed.
20.3.1964: Sold to Elder Dempster Lines Ltd.
1972: Transferred to the China Mutual Steam Navigation Company Ltd., for one round voyage to the Far East.
1972: Reverted to Elder Dempster Lines Ltd.
19.3.1980: Sold to Diamant Engineer Shipping Company Ltd., Greece, and renamed MARMARAS.
1982: Sold, in a damaged condition, to Seagleam Maritime Ltd., Cyprus.
9.1983: Sustained fire damage to engine room and accommodation.
19.6.1984: Delivered to Brodospas, Split, for demolition.


Go to this site all ships built on the Clyde..www.clydesite.co.uk/clydebuilt/

Ian Stanley
3rd January 2010, 03:59
I was 5th (Junior) Engineer in 1973. Did several West Africa runs on her before switching companies eventually ending up in Australia. Eldersuk (derek) was most likely my 2nd engineer but my memory fads over time.
Ian

Dod Caukie
7th March 2010, 13:23
Sailed on "Dalla" 1971/72 first trip 2nd Engineer. Mike Williams was Master,Ven Webster Chief Eng and Billy Cunningham was the "Chippy"

richardwakeley
4th December 2010, 16:19
Are you Billy Cunningham? I was the sparky on Dalla 1970-71 on the USA-west africa run. I remember the bosun was a well known Birkenhead philosopher by the name of Billy Eastwood, but my memory is fading a bit. I do remember you (Chippy) building a dance floor over the deck cargo of logs so the crew could get back aft. Captain Leathart. It's all coming back!

the_vietnam_bear
27th April 2011, 11:24
Are you Billy Cunningham? I was the sparky on Dalla 1970-71 on the USA-west africa run. I remember the bosun was a well known Birkenhead philosopher by the name of Billy Eastwood, but my memory is fading a bit. I do remember you (Chippy) building a dance floor over the deck cargo of logs so the crew could get back aft. Captain Leathart. It's all coming back!

No, my name is Billy Ross, sailed May to Nov 1970.

John Gillespie
27th February 2012, 23:16
Ships I sailed on and Officers I sailed with :-
Shonga from 04/65 to 5/65
Master Walker Brown,C/O Leslie, 2/O Rae, 3/O Self,4/O McLeod, C/E Tweedle, Purser Salt.

Mallam from 08/65 to 9/66
Masters Armstrong/McManus, C/O Pierce, 2/Os Darwell/Kinsella, 3/O Self,R/Os Cartwright/Massey, Cadets Dixon,Stonehouse,Bickers, C/E Moore,2/Es Cantwell/Cunningham/Bullock, 3/Es Mitchell/McMutrey/Colley, 4/E Flockhard/Billy/Hannah, Electricians Ennisbeer/Knowles.
Cat/Os Sunderland/Collins,Pursers Laws/Hill/Ellis.

Owerri from 01/67 to 10/67
Masters Greenwood/Johnston, C/0 Paton. 2/0s Atkin/Rae 3/0 Self,
4/0 Edmonds, C/E McCutchion, 2/Es Barron/Kemp, 3/Es Greene/Hood
4/Es Anderson/Alder/Shortt, Elect.Wardle/Nimmo, Purser Ritch, Cat/Os Mooney/Carswell, R/Os Gore/Woods,Cadets Monkton/Norton/Kinsey Purser/ Cadet Ward

Aureol from12/67 to 01/68
Master Sullivan, C/O Woodward, 2/0 Moore/Willerton, 3/O Self/Grant
R/O, Noonan/Higgins, Pursers Burgess/Hanson, Cadets Moore/Houldsworth.

Dixcove from 01/68 to 02/68
Master Dunne, C/O Kean, 2/O Binnie, 3/0 Self,4/0 Brown, R/O Cartwright, C/E Wilson, 2/E Fletcher, 3/E Lowe,4/E Owen,Elect Sheen,
Purser Forsey

Owerri from 7/70 to 9/70
Master McManus, C/O pearson, 2/0 Self, 3/0 Dickson, R/0 Nolan C/E Webster, 2/E Burnett,3/E Patterson, Elect Bigley,Cat/0 Caurus

ed glover
28th February 2012, 14:48
sailed on her Maiden voyage 1961
Ed Glover (ginger)
controlled drifting

Julian Calvin
28th April 2012, 11:17
Another thread is talking about good looking or efficient vessels.
The Dalla was certainly not beautiful but am sure she was efficient and certainly a happy ship to be on.
Seem to remember a good tonnage carrier yet we chugged across to the States burning, I think, five tons a day. Can someone correct me on this as figure seems a little low.
Clearly remember passing through the Chesapeake/Deleware canal with a full deck cargo of logs. Weekend and us cadets had a case of beer, sat on the logs waving to all the dolly birds gazing in admiration at this fine ship that had come all the way from darkest Africa.

eldersuk
29th April 2012, 00:43
A figure of 12 tons a day would be nearer the mark. If we had run her at 5 tons I would still be living on the proceeds of my bonus!

Derek

Ron Stringer
29th April 2012, 07:56
A figure of 12 tons a day would be nearer the mark. If we had run her at 5 tons I would still be living on the proceeds of my bonus!

Derek

At a party in the 3/E's cabin, much drink had been taken and a "discussion" broke out between the 2/E and the 3/E about a ship that they both had served on in the past. One claimed the that consumption had been x tons and the other claimed a far higher figure. Things got quite heated for a while, getting to the point where several of us were sitting on the 3/E, before it became clear that one was talking tons-per-day and the other, tons-per-watch.

As the R/O I hadn't a clue what it was all about or why they would even want to talk about it. After all it wasn't as if they had to pay for the oil at the pump.

alan ward
29th April 2012, 11:50
Ships I sailed on and Officers I sailed with :-
Shonga from 04/65 to 5/65
Master Walker Brown,C/O Leslie, 2/O Rae, 3/O Self,4/O McLeod, C/E Tweedle, Purser Salt.

Mallam from 08/65 to 9/66
Masters Armstrong/McManus, C/O Pierce, 2/Os Darwell/Kinsella, 3/O Self,R/Os Cartwright/Massey, Cadets Dixon,Stonehouse,Bickers, C/E Moore,2/Es Cantwell/Cunningham/Bullock, 3/Es Mitchell/McMutrey/Colley, 4/E Flockhard/Billy/Hannah, Electricians Ennisbeer/Knowles.
Cat/Os Sunderland/Collins,Pursers Laws/Hill/Ellis.

Owerri from 01/67 to 10/67
Masters Greenwood/Johnston, C/0 Paton. 2/0s Atkin/Rae 3/0 Self,
4/0 Edmonds, C/E McCutchion, 2/Es Barron/Kemp, 3/Es Greene/Hood
4/Es Anderson/Alder/Shortt, Elect.Wardle/Nimmo, Purser Ritch, Cat/Os Mooney/Carswell, R/Os Gore/Woods,Cadets Monkton/Norton/Kinsey Purser/ Cadet Ward

Aureol from12/67 to 01/68
Master Sullivan, C/O Woodward, 2/0 Moore/Willerton, 3/O Self/Grant
R/O, Noonan/Higgins, Pursers Burgess/Hanson, Cadets Moore/Houldsworth.

Dixcove from 01/68 to 02/68
Master Dunne, C/O Kean, 2/O Binnie, 3/0 Self,4/0 Brown, R/O Cartwright, C/E Wilson, 2/E Fletcher, 3/E Lowe,4/E Owen,Elect Sheen,
Purser Forsey

Owerri from 7/70 to 9/70
Master McManus, C/O pearson, 2/0 Self, 3/0 Dickson, R/0 Nolan C/E Webster, 2/E Burnett,3/E Patterson, Elect Bigley,Cat/0 Caurus

I`ve got a photo of the 3 deck cadets norton/kinsey and monckton
and some more taken in Freetown/Lagos.I used to see Dave Atkin up to the late 90`s when he lived in Kirkella,apart from Christmas cards we never meet up now.Hugh Monckton made master don`t know about the others Bob Norton was a lovely bloke.

bev summerill
2nd September 2012, 21:27
sailed deepsea on the Dalla 29 aug to 18 dec 1978 as 1st mate on the continent to West Africa
Bev Summerill

Ant P
1st December 2012, 09:45
I did my first trip 3rd Off on Dalla. I joined in Hamburg 19th December 1978. We had new year in Rotterdam and remember the din with all the ships whistles and bells going off at miidnight. Went ashore after that and found bar open that turned out to be for the Marthas of this world (not Arthurs!) we still managed to have a great night/morning.

I think the rotation was Hamburg, Antwerp, Rotterdam, Lome for bunkers, Lagos (Apapa), Tema (anchored awaiting orders), Takoradi, Monrovia, Freetown, Le Havre and Amsterdam for 13th March 1979. The waiting for orders off Tema shows the writing was on the wall then and sold the following year.
Regards, Tony Porter

Roger Turner
1st December 2012, 11:29
Ant P.
Your posting raises a question, how did Elders come to lose it? there`s still cargos going to and from Africa aren`t there?
Burma might be expected - but I would have thought Africa would be different

Julian Calvin
2nd December 2012, 07:54
Number of reasons.
Ocean had some disasterous investments in Gas carriers
Change in business to container traffic.
Lack of return cargoes (particularly from Nigeria)

oldseamerchant
2nd December 2012, 09:18
Ant P.
Your posting raises a question, how did Elders come to lose it? there`s still cargos going to and from Africa aren`t there?
Burma might be expected - but I would have thought Africa would be different

In a nutshell, BAD MANAGEMENT!

Ant P
2nd December 2012, 12:48
I seem to remember Ocean/Elders sold alot of the E and D boats to Greeks who jsut ran them on the same runs with the same cargoes for a couple more years before scrapping them or selling them on. I can honestly say that the ships were always full on the way out and homeward they wre chocca with palm kernals and cake, cocoa, ground nuts logs and the like. I could never understand how they couldn't make money. Crew costs were always thrust at us but On my first trip to sea on the Dunkwa there were 46 crew and on the same ship four years latter there were 26! We were still doing the same job though, there was no technology brought in to warrent the reduction just outright cost savings. I can only thisnk that they syphoned off the money for other projects such as warehousing, freight forwarding etc etc. In the Company newspaper it was solely about ships and cargeoes and crews at the start. When I finally left there was an edition that didn't have anything about ships just trucks, fork lifts warehouses and the like. At that time you could make more money by leaving your money in the bank. A 'proper' ship owner would realise the nature of the cyclical business and would bide the time to the up swing came and paid for the poor years. Accountants and share holders killed it off once the family were out of it.

oldseamerchant
2nd December 2012, 13:06
A 'proper' ship owner would realise the nature of the cyclical business and would bide the time to the up swing came and paid for the poor years. Accountants and share holders killed it off once the family were out of it.

Agreed!

Roger Turner
3rd December 2012, 16:58
Agreed!

Funny - not ha-ha,
It should be mentioned, ruinous investments, accountants, bad management and not biding time till cycle changes.

The funny bit, after I left the sea I became a building surveyor - more logical than you may think, I was a Purser and so there was a natural affinity with money.
But my employment ended when the company I ended up with failed - shot itself in the foot. It had just made a mint of money from one particular contract concerned with servicing the Oil industry - half the directors up and left taking most of the booty with them.
That money should have been left in the company as building is one of the most cyclical going - particularly from the effects of bad weather delays - builder doesn`t get penalised (Mostly) but absorbs the cost. So this company,no money left in the kitty, were tendering at net cost, then making a negotiating deduction and expecting the Surveyor by sleight of hand, bullying subcontractors for discounts and formulating claims to bring the contract out at cost at the best, just to preserve staff to stay in business till the tide turned.
So perhaps the answer to my question was in Harold MacMillan`s words "events dear boy" or "The winds of change blowing through Africa"
Anyway you can have your "Dalla" the "Degema" will do me.

eldersuk
3rd December 2012, 22:41
When EDs were running as an independent company they were very well financed. A portion of voyage profits, some of which were very substantial indeed, was always put aside to cover depreciation, drydocking etc.
However when they were incorporated into Ocean these savings were taken over by the conglomerate and by and large were unwisely invested in projects which subsequently failed to produce profit.
This, and the attitude of the senior management, which by this time was largely made up of accountants and others with no previous connection to maritime matters and who decided that mergers with shore based logistic firms was the way forward.
I know that all this can be considered simplistic, but essentially that's what happened.
This is what rang the death knell for EDs.

Derek

oldseamerchant
3rd December 2012, 22:54
It is debatable whether EDs were ever running as a truly independent company. AH were always in the background. Dry-docking etc were always part of the daily Opex and not dependant on voyage profits. Voyage profits were the residues after the Opex. Both companies had similar operating & accounting systems in this respect. It was quite simply abysmally poor management from India Buildings. The Directors should have been held to account.

eldersuk
5th December 2012, 23:24
Up until the formation of Ocean Fleets, Blue Funnel held 43% of ED's shares, but EDs operated entirely autonomously.
At the time of the merger EDs had reserves of 40m - where did that go? The new 'S' class (built in Poland early 1970s) were showing voyage profits of up to 500,000 for a 37/38 day voyage. Was that not reason enough to keep at least them going?

I'm not qualified to comment on their respective accountancy practices, but have always been led to believe that there were quite considerable differences.

Both Alfred Holt and Sir Alfred Lewis Jones must be turning in their graves at the sheer ineptitude which finished off their two great companies.

Rogerfrench
7th December 2012, 05:53
But even if that were true for Ocean Fleets, what about the rest of the Merchant Navy? It can't have been ALL bad management , surely?

oldseamerchant
7th December 2012, 07:53
Both Alfred Holt and Sir Alfred Lewis Jones must be turning in their graves at the sheer ineptitude which finished off their two great companies.

Very true.(Pint)

Roger Turner
7th December 2012, 17:23
Up until the formation of Ocean Fleets, Blue Funnel held 43% of ED's shares, but EDs operated entirely autonomously.
At the time of the merger EDs had reserves of 40m - where did that go? The new 'S' class (built in Poland early 1970s) were showing voyage profits of up to 500,000 for a 37/38 day voyage. Was that not reason enough to keep at least them going?

I'm not qualified to comment on their respective accountancy practices, but have always been led to believe that there were quite considerable differences.

Both Alfred Holt and Sir Alfred Lewis Jones must be turning in their graves at the sheer ineptitude which finished off their two great companies.

I have a feeling the answer is in the 45% shareholding - how much dividend was being paid on those shares? (I`ll bet very little - all going into reserves and buildings -new Lagos offices - dead money - sale and leaseback coming in)would guess this was all happening when shareholders were demanding "short term" returns on their investments. To take over a company and get your hands immediately on 40m. free dosh must have been irresistible
Roger T