Naval Books

Abbey Hill
10th March 2010, 09:46
I have been to see someone who has a magnificent collection of naval books and photos. Amongst them is a 1978-1979 Janes Fighting ships and Janes Merchant Ships both in excellent condition. There are also several bound copies of Maritime News from the 1960's and about three albums of Royal Navy ship photos from the 60's and 70's which look as if they are MOD photos. He is wanting to sell them and I would like to buy them but am unsure of what to offer him. He thinks they are worth about 300 ! I think that this is too much. Has anyone any thoughts on what this collection may be worth.

10th March 2010, 10:17
Hi Abbey Hill, surprisingly (well I thought so) Jane's Fighting ships from the 70's and 80's can go for very little money on sites like Ebay, I have picked up a few of them in good condition over the years for around 15 and thats including postage. The photo albums are a bit harder to value and maybe this is where this is where the seller is finding the 300 value, possibly they are rare? but I would agree with you that 300 sounds a bit too much for the lot. Do you have a figure in mind?
Kind regards

K urgess
10th March 2010, 11:00
Jane's fighting ships about 10 to 20, Merchant ships 20 to 30.
Maritime News about 10 to 15 a volume if they are properly bound.
Shipping pictures about 1 each if postcard size. Usually about doubles for every doubling in size but it all depends on subject, quality, photog.......etc., etc.

Abbey Hill
10th March 2010, 14:32
Thanks for the advice. I had in mind to offer 150 for the lot and see what happens. I will scan some photos and post them on the gallery.


Bob Theman
10th March 2010, 23:24
Watch out for the photos if they are copies of official phots. It surprised me to learn that Crown Copyright (on these sort of things) is no less than 125 years !

11th March 2010, 07:41
British copyright laws says:

Crown copyright protection in published material lasts for fifty years from the end of the year in which the material was first published. Therefore material published fifty-one years ago, and any Crown copyright material published before that date, would now be out of copyright, and may be freely reproduced throughout the world.

I would expect a picture that has been multiplied for commercial purposes to be considered as published by the law - but I wouldn't absolutely swear to it.

Pictures published by other than the government has a 70 year copyright period in Britain, if it was published 70 years ago today. The law has been rewritten so a picture published for the first time today has a longer copyright period.

11th March 2010, 08:40
The attached diagram clarifies the position with Crown Copyright. It all depends on the date of creation or publication.

Abbey Hill
11th March 2010, 17:49
The photos are of Royal Navy ships taken in the 60's and 70's (e.g. HMA Andromeda/HMS Exmouth). They are very clear and look as if they have been taken from the air. All of them have the ships crest on the top left hand corner. They look lioke the sort of post cards that would have been dished out at the Navy Day's of the time. They have superb clarity and would be very disappointing not to be able to scan and post them on this site particularly as they are all photos that I haven't seen before.

I have offered the man 150 for them irrespective and he is having a think about it !

If anyone is interested he also has numerous motoring/train/aircraft stuff of a similar nature.


11th March 2010, 18:59
Unfortunately, owning a print does not give you any rights over publishing the image.
Its a matter between you and SN.
The United States have a much more enlightened view on these matters, when it comes to photos paid for by the taxpayer.

11th March 2010, 23:52
It sounds to me as if these are Navy News photos. I suggest you go the Navy News website - you may be able to get back issues - you can certainly get some idea as to how much each photo is worth. They would be crown copyright but they will be officially released postcards so I am sure there would not be a problem

12th March 2010, 00:01
To give you more detail. Navy News used to issue one a month and I used to have an annual subscription for the postcards. It may be that you can still do this. Thus, over a number of years it was possible to build up a decent collection and this is what I did before selling my albums last year on ebay. I just did not have enough space to keep them!

Bob Theman
13th March 2010, 00:09
I feel a bit uneasy taking issue with people who probably know a lot more about the subject than I do. But, here goes.
Stein whe you say British Copyright law what exactly are you quoting?
Reading from the Copyright , Designs and Patent Act 1988 Section 6vi says Crown copyright will exist in works made by an officer of the Crown this includes....etc etc.
Crown Copyright will last for a period of 125 years from the end of the calendar year in which the work was made.
If the work was commercially published within 75 years of the end of thecalendar year in which it was made, Crown Copyright will last for 50 years from the end of the calender year in which it was published.
The 70 year period is more complicated that it may seem and depends upon the date on which the last remaining "author" of the work or picture dies.
If the author is unknown then the 70 years lasts from the end of the calendar year in which the work was created. BUT (oh no here we go again) If it was made available to the pub
lic during that 70 years then the duration of copyright will be 70 years from the end of the calendar year in which the picture was first so made available publicly.
I really wish I hadn't entered this thread .....
Of course you CAN copy copyright work if you are a librarian and for various other reasons called fair dealing.

13th March 2010, 08:20
Go back to the diagram HERE ( A different duration applies to work created before 1989. Another critical date is 1st June 1957 (1956 Act).
The death of the author is relevant for private material but not Crown Copyright. Librarians must obey the law like anyone else, they may make copies but have no rights of publication.
Fair use is expained here - and here - but is unlikely to include posting pics on websites.