Languishing and unloved Bluie

jmcg
2nd May 2010, 14:40
On Friday last during a site induction I got talking to an former MN engineer who had recently returned after a long contract at Huai Power Station in Hubie Provence in China. He told me that there is a former Blue Funnel or Glen Line vessel (A or D Class) laid up in a cutting on the Yellow River.

She is in PRC livery and although laid up awaiting her final fate for at least 5 years she is still in remarkedly fine fettle. Her after derricks are still flying . He passed her twice a day and night with never a soul sighted nor a light burning. The locals do not talk about her other than agree her longevity at the cutting and that she is haunted by a spirit.

I would venture to advance that with a sum of K100 (maximum) we could save her and return her to Liverpool or London. Nostagia personified !!!!!

Apart from the more obvious considerations (crewing and insurance) what else would we need to consider. Discuss.

I'm up for it before I get too old.! We would need a Master, Mates & Engineers etc. and perhaps an AB that could cook!

BW

J

J

makko
2nd May 2010, 14:48
A lovely pipe dream, John!
Sign me up, I'll go as 4th to get the really shotty jobs! Maybe my old fella would be willing! I'd pay my own way but unfortunately couldn't make a meaningful monetary donation. Let's see what transpires...................A little dreaming never hurt anybody!
Regards,
Dave
p.s. Any photos?

jmcg
2nd May 2010, 15:01
Makko

No photographs I'm afraid. The cutting is inside the PS perimeter and the old protocols re photography remain.

I must say,however, that the two hour induction lasted for 3+ . He could confirm a lot and certainly no bull about it.

He also told me that shipping down river is mostly PRC flagged vessels with coal unloaded at the lower points of the Yellow river for lightering and onward travel to the PS.

Yes, I would love to develop this dream and could offer a not too unsubstantial sum to bring to fruition.

BW
J

Coastie
2nd May 2010, 15:14
When you say K100, I presume you mean 100,000 as opossed to 100 Hong Kong pounds?

jmcg
2nd May 2010, 15:27
Coastie

Yes!

Pat Kennedy
2nd May 2010, 17:58
John,
I heard about an old 'A' boat still afloat in some Chinese backwater about ten years ago, I was told it was possibly the Demodocus which had been sold to Chinese interests in 1973 and named Hungsia, then in 1979 became Hong Qi 137, Bureau of Maritime Administration Canton.
Sign me up, I'll go as AB, and maybe get my old cabin!
Best Regards
Pat(Thumb)

jmcg
2nd May 2010, 18:13
Interesting Pat - there may be a connection here. I shall see the chap concerned when I return to site next week and see if i can get any more information from him. The job in Hubie is still going with a few ex pats there.

Thanks for the info.

Two AB's so far. Any more?

BW
J

Dickyboy
2nd May 2010, 18:43
Interesting Pat - there may be a connection here. I shall see the chap concerned when I return to site next week and see if i can get any more information from him. The job in Hubie is still going with a few ex pats there.

Thanks for the info.

Two AB's so far. Any more?

BW
J

I'll go as Mess Peggy (H)

PS
Too old to go clambering about these days, can't cook, don't drink, but would like to go back to one of my first jobs at sea. Can do a trick at the wheel and keep a keen lookout. :o

MICHAEL SQUIRES
2nd May 2010, 18:50
Do you think an approach to the Philip Holt Trust may be in order ? the Trust supports the Blue Funnel Association and the Nestorians so I imagine that they would be sympathetic to the idea. Perhaps the Blue funnel Association maybe able to help.

According to Ships in Focus the Demopdocus was broken up in 1982.

I think the ship may be the Dolius she was sold to the Chinese, became the Hong Qul 119 and later the Zhan Dou 51, was deleted off Lloyds List in 1991. But that does not mean she was scrapped.

Regards


Mike

jmcg
2nd May 2010, 21:30
Michael

I will explore. It would require a massive effort but then again I'm sure its possible


Many thanks

J

jmcg
3rd May 2010, 17:43
Michael

I sailed on Glenfruin (Ex Dolius in 1971). She did indeed go to Chinese interests (in '77 ) with her last (reported) change of name as indicated in 1984. We may have something to distill here.

Regards to your Old Man.

BW

J

ddraigmor
3rd May 2010, 17:52
If they'd allow me a temporary medical cert, I'll go as AB as well.

It would be excellent to see a vessel representing the UK MN and let's face it, the Yanks do this in big style and make it pay. The thought of an active ship being available for UK and near Continetal tours / adventure training / etc etc is exciting.

Jonty

jmcg
3rd May 2010, 18:43
Not so sure we need ENG 1 if its a project. Very very early stages as yet. I need to get more (as much) info from the chap on site. I would have no plans for future tours or trips- just to bring her back for the next generation and us old timers. The Yanks as you say still have and protect their Jeremiah O'Brian .

I would welcome additional comments from Deck and Engine room depts re engine status , navigational requirements etc. Its 27 years since I packed up and so much has changed in that time.

Thanks for the offer. Will keep you posted.

SM has not volunteered his engine room skills.

BW
J

Octavius
3rd May 2010, 18:57
Keep your memories as good ones and don't venture into a world you know nothing about.
You will lose everything and for what?. A clapped out, rusty old Bluie

jmcg
3rd May 2010, 19:07
Sorry Octavius - I do know a little about the China, but only from the deck perspective.

That is why I seek wider counsel on matters I know nothing of. Shipping law was not one of the mandatory units I had to study.
Thanks for your contribution.

BW

J

roboted
3rd May 2010, 19:10
If it's an "A" boat,can at least volunteer some knowledge of engine room and sytems.......

Robbo.

Octavius
3rd May 2010, 19:18
The world is littered by those who have lost their **** pursuing nostalgia.
I was too long in Ship Management not to know that what you are trying to undertake will come to nothing except tears.You do not need a degree in Admiralty Law either, common sense will do.

jmcg
3rd May 2010, 19:22
Fine - if nothing comes of it . It may never take off. But no tears either way.

A pretty sharp retort no less.

J

Hank
3rd May 2010, 19:22
Malcom McLeman spent some years trying to find the "Qing He Cheng", formerly Glenfalloch, with a view to bringing her back as an MN memorial. It came to nothing in the end, but he might have a few tips as to how to go about it. His email addy used to be malcolm.mcleman@free.fr but whether it's still live, I don't know. The search seems to have been abandoned in mid-2006.
Cheers, John

Octavius
3rd May 2010, 19:24
I would say direct

jmcg
3rd May 2010, 19:27
Thanks Hank. The "search" would not be required for this one as I understand it. She is lying in a cutting way upstream on the Yellow River. I know no more at this stage,

BW
J

John Dryden
3rd May 2010, 19:43
If you can get more specific location and correct spelling? it,s amazing what you can see on google earth,some of the imaging in China is really clear.
JD.

MICHAEL SQUIRES
3rd May 2010, 22:25
Fine - if nothing comes of it . It may never take off. But no tears either way.

A pretty sharp retort no less.

J

John

My Dad once said to me that Ship Owners had no sentiment or soul, when a ship had done its time, send it to the breakers, obviously our ship manager, Octavious is of the sme ilk.

There's no harm in dreaming, but I fear there a lot of obstacles to overcome if you are to suceed in your quest, I hope it will happen and if I can come up with any ideas I'll let you know.

Regards


Mike

capt.jim
4th May 2010, 17:30
it is worth dreaming--in liverpool it is as if blue funnel never was .having spent 20 years in blueys . i would contribute to returning a ship of the haydays for future generations to admire

price
4th May 2010, 19:59
I went around the land on the Dolius 10.8.56. until 1.9.56. just prior to her maiden deep sea voyage, so I was there nearly at the start.
Bruce.

roboted
4th May 2010, 21:59
it is worth dreaming--in liverpool it is as if blue funnel never was .having spent 20 years in blueys . i would contribute to returning a ship of the haydays for future generations to admire

And sometimes dreams do come true....

John Briggs
4th May 2010, 22:08
As the others say, there is nothing wrong with having a dream. If you managed to get substantial finance and your dream progresses then you would bring her to UK as a private boat, not a registered ship, and you would not have to worry about all the myriad of regulations.

Anyway if things go well you can put me down for any deck position from galley boy to master.

jmcg
4th May 2010, 22:10
Thanks to all so far.


Not a dream at the moment. More of a potential voyage of recovery.

BW

J

Tom Inglis
7th May 2010, 10:16
Fine - if nothing comes of it . It may never take off. But no tears either way.

A pretty sharp retort no less.

J

There is nothing I would like better than to see a Bluie permanently moored in pride place in Liverpool's Alberts Dock, however I tend to agree with Octavious. Unless you can get the Liverpool city fathers interested in such a project, sadly I feel it is going nowhere. There used to be a model of a "P" boat in the museum at Albert Dock but that seems to have gone now. Perhaps the City Fathers sold it. I saw recently that the Builders [Caledon] Model of "Glenearn" sold at auction in America for 61,500.
Perhaps one of these wonderful models in the huge glass case [like they used to have in India Buildings] would be a more realistic project.
Anybody know where they all went to?
Come to think of it I doubt if a Bluie would get into Albert Dock in Liverpool.
Regards to All

Tom

Pat Kennedy
7th May 2010, 10:31
The ideal berth for it would be in Birkenhead, at Cathcart St, the berth where she would have loaded many times during her career as a Bluey.
If Peel Holdings could be persuaded to include it in their 'Wirral Waters' plans. It would make a wonderful attraction.
Pat

Scousegit
7th May 2010, 11:13
Tom.

The model you are referring to is now or was when I last looked on the third floor (?) of the Liverpool maritime museum.

It was only returned there because of a great deal of pressure from the Blue Funnel Association and on the direct instructions of the MD at that time and whose name escapes me at present, of Ocean Fleets. otherwise the museum would, apparently, loose the model together with all the other Blue Funnel Models, as they are only on lone to the museum and they don't own them, in fact Huge Wylie told me this himself.

If you want to build a model of a Blue Funnel/Glen vessel built at Caledon, most of the plans can be found in Dundee library.

Scouse.

eriskay
7th May 2010, 11:37
Speaking of models of the incomparable 'Blueys', check out my Gallery for some images of an 'P' Class, the 1949-built S.S. Peleus

Pat Kennedy
7th May 2010, 13:26
Eriskay,
That is a superb model, I'm wondering if it is the one that was in the deckboy training school at Odyssey Works.
Peleus was my second ship.
By the way its a 'P' class not 'A', and it was SS, not MV. (sorry to be so pedantic)
Best Regards,
Pat

Andrew Craig-Bennett
7th May 2010, 13:39
Two points, well three really:

1. IF this is for real, I can probably get some of my colleagues in COSCO "on side" for it (esp. if she is an ex Glen!)

2. It was I who found the Qing He Cheng ex Glenfalloch and I had a great deal of trouble convincing certain romantics that she really had been broken up.

3. There's an excellent model of an A class in John Swire and Sons' Head Office but its not on public view.

jmcg
7th May 2010, 14:16
Craig

My source is satisfied that she is a Bluey or Glen. He took little notice or further imtensive interest in her after the first few initial observations. He is still trying to get additional information.

Many thanks for your offer.

BW

J.

eriskay
7th May 2010, 14:55
Eriskay,
That is a superb model, I'm wondering if it is the one that was in the deckboy training school at Odyssey Works.
Peleus was my second ship.
By the way its a 'P' class not 'A', and it was SS, not MV. (sorry to be so pedantic)
Best Regards,
Pat



Hi, Pat :

Cannot believe I got that wrong - 'A'-Class motorship indeed! - and of all people I should have known better seeing as I worked on her several times in KGV (Shieldhall, Glasgow) and Elderslie Drydocks (Scotstoun West) 1958-1964

I will of course go back and correct that and thanks for bringing it to my attention, nothing pedantic about it, an unforgivable mistake !

Pat Kennedy
7th May 2010, 16:28
Eriskay,
Its not unforgivable, we all make mistakes from time to time, me as much as anyone else.
We probably were on that Peleus in KGV and in Barclay Curle's dry dock at Elderslie at the same time, because I was deck boy on her in Glasgow in April 1959 and again in August 1959.
She was a great ship, and I particularly remember the whine of her steam turbines while making 20 knots from the Clyde to the Mersey, and for some reason I always associate this ship with Kenneth Mc Kellar singing 'The Song of the Clyde'.
A good video at this link;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbwEvUDtWgY

Best Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

Andrew Craig-Bennett
7th May 2010, 19:20
Malcom McLeman spent some years trying to find the "Qing He Cheng", formerly Glenfalloch, with a view to bringing her back as an MN memorial. It came to nothing in the end, but he might have a few tips as to how to go about it. His email addy used to be malcolm.mcleman@free.fr but whether it's still live, I don't know. The search seems to have been abandoned in mid-2006.
Cheers, John

The search was abandoned in mid-2006 because I finally convinced those behind it that I had been telling the truth when I told them the ship had been scrapped in 1996. After all, I just work for the company that owned her for most of her life so what would I know?

For ten years they refused to believe me because someone claimed to have seen her in Hong Kong and someone else had a photo of her alongside in Singapore. I was able to show them that the photograph dated from the mid-80's as the godown she was alongside has long been the site of a container terminal and she was carrying the old funnel mark.

Yes, I do feel rather sore at having involved colleagues in the search for the ship, and then not being believed.

I would love to believe this story, too, but I am afraid that it has all the makings of a "yarn" .

Starting from the top, I'm certainly not aware of any restrictions on photography of merchant ships in China - try and snap the PLA Navy's latest and that might be another matter!

Can we at least identify where this ship is meant to be? Which port is she meant to be lying in? Are we talking about Hubei or Hebei? The Yellow River does not flow through either of them, and it is scarcely navigable anyway. The Yangtse does flow through Hubei and is navigable.

Tom Inglis
8th May 2010, 10:21
The ideal berth for it would be in Birkenhead, at Cathcart St, the berth where she would have loaded many times during her career as a Bluey.
If Peel Holdings could be persuaded to include it in their 'Wirral Waters' plans. It would make a wonderful attraction.
Pat

Yes I agree Pat, Birkenhead Cathcart Street would be a more suitable location, even though it says LIVERPOOL on the stern. It was always the Birkenhead side we sailed from when heading out East. I had drive around that area a couple of years ago and nearly got lost. It's difficult to recognise the places after so long. I last sailed out from Cathcart Street in April 1966 on Menelaus and brought her back in there in August '66 after a deep sea and the coasting.
Happy days
Tom

Pat Kennedy
8th May 2010, 14:27
Hi Tom,
You are right it has changed around that area, and not for the better.
Cathcart St is now a steel stockholder's yard with the very occasional coaster alongside. A maker of kitchenware has some storage space in the sheds further along, and the rest of Vittoria Dock is used for ships laying up.
Peel Holdings plan to turn the whole area into a shopping centre with some housing thrown in, similar to the Salford Quays area in Manchester. A spruced up 'A' boat could be a major attraction in that sort of set up.
Look at the Cap San Diego moored in Hamburg, a ship of similar vintage, kept in very good condition by the city,which has become a world wide symbol of the maritime heritage of Hamburg.
By the way, I was in the Menelaus in 1959/60, a good ship, but hard work on deck.
Regards,
Pat

Octavius
16th May 2010, 15:17
John

My Dad once said to me that Ship Owners had no sentiment or soul, when a ship had done its time, send it to the breakers, obviously our ship manager, Octavious is of the sme ilk.

There's no harm in dreaming, but I fear there a lot of obstacles to overcome if you are to suceed in your quest, I hope it will happen and if I can come up with any ideas I'll let you know.

Regards


Mike

MIchael,

In response to your post above. I think you have it in one.
Dreaming is something Shipowners are not to familiar with. Ship Managers have the responsibility to fulfil Owners expectations.

You Blue Funnel men should keep your money in your pocket and keep your memories.

I have to smile when I read the enthusiasm of you all. Its steel and nothing more. Now rusty. She is in fact a DEBIT on the balance sheet

DURANGO
16th May 2010, 17:17
MIchael,

In response to your post above. I think you have it in one.
Dreaming is something Shipowners are not to familiar with. Ship Managers have the responsibility to fulfil Owners expectations.

You Blue Funnel men should keep your money in your pocket and keep your memories.

I have to smile when I read the enthusiasm of you all. Its steel and nothing more. Now rusty. She is in fact a DEBIT on the balance sheet You could well be right Octavius i was only in 4 blueys during my 12 years at sea but i have to say that when i joined my first one the old Agapenor i remember standing down aft and saying to myself " i,m on a Blue Funnel ship " i know most where company men and i wasn,t I mostly shipped out off London but I have to say that once you have sailed in one you dont forget it in a hurry so if and even if it,s a big if put me down for a sub and a berth as A.B. and to Pat Kennedy i have to say i never sailed in one that wasn,t heavy on deck but what i wouldn,t give to break out the jumbo just one more time before I go to that permanent anchorage .

Octavius
16th May 2010, 17:31
You could well be right Octavius i was only in 4 blueys during my 12 years at sea but i have to say that when i joined my first one the old Agapenor i remember standing down aft and saying to myself " i,m on a Blue Funnel ship " i know most where company men and i wasn,t I mostly shipped out off London but I have to say that once you have sailed in one you dont forget it in a hurry so if and even if it,s a big if put me down for a sub and a berth as A.B. and to Pat Kennedy i have to say i never sailed in one that wasn,t heavy on deck but what i wouldn,t give to break out the jumbo just one more time before I go to that permanent anchorage .

Durango, I am well aware of the sentiment the Blue Funnel men have for that company ships from the posts. But, let's not go over the top on this one. Your talking of a ship probably over 50 years old!
She will cost a fortune to bring her back up.

Pat Kennedy
16th May 2010, 18:54
You could well be right Octavius i was only in 4 blueys during my 12 years at sea but i have to say that when i joined my first one the old Agapenor i remember standing down aft and saying to myself " i,m on a Blue Funnel ship " i know most where company men and i wasn,t I mostly shipped out off London but I have to say that once you have sailed in one you dont forget it in a hurry so if and even if it,s a big if put me down for a sub and a berth as A.B. and to Pat Kennedy i have to say i never sailed in one that wasn,t heavy on deck but what i wouldn,t give to break out the jumbo just one more time before I go to that permanent anchorage .

Durango,
Well I sailed in 28 of them, some of them two or three times,(one of them was Agapenor) and I agree they were all 'heavy on deck' compared to some other company's ships.
However some Blueys were harder work than others. The 'P' and 'H' class although the biggest of that period, were well laid out and relatively easy on deck, as were Nestor, Theseus and Neleus.
The later 'M' class ships had all the winches, lead blocks,bitts etc, crowded together on top of mast houses/contacter houses, making any work on the cargo handling gear extremely difficult.
Incidentally the ship I found hardest work was T&J Harrison's Tactician with that monkey puzzle Stulken derrick.
As for Octavius's comments, well I would say that he must be a bean counter at heart, not a romantic bone in his body.
Best Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

jmcg
16th May 2010, 19:17
Still no updates.

Might just see the chap to-moorow, he assured me that he would contact his colleague who is still on the station.

Pat.

I sailed 13 of them. Best of all was Autolycus followed (very closely) by Hector, Neleus, and Theseus. Protesilaus (Super P) was the least enjoyable (voyage)with a nightmare and troublesome Stulken. Compared to the Hallen swinging derricks (with or without the grabs) on Jebsens Binsnes they were easy.

BW

J

Pat Kennedy
16th May 2010, 19:36
John,
looking back I believe I worked on most of the fleet at one time or another, because I spent some time in the shoregang in Birkenhead as well.
Of the ships that regularly came into Liverpool/Birkenhead I can only think of three that I never set foot on board, they were the Neleus, Ixion, and Helenus.
Of course there were plenty of others that spent most of their time out East and rarely came home such as Charon, Gorgon, Tyndareus. Ships that made my blood run cold whenever I saw them swinging on the hook in Singapore.
Best Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

jmcg
16th May 2010, 19:44
The "Aussie" ships rarely loaded at Birkenhead if at all in my early days. In fact I cannot remember ever joining Hector, Neleus, Helenus or Theseus in Birkenhead .

What was the arrangement for cargo for these if B'head was generally the receiving sheds? Did they receive it and then transport it by lorry to Gladstone.

BW

J

Pat Kennedy
16th May 2010, 20:14
John,
No, cargo for the Aussie boats was received at Gladstone Dock.
Pat

jmcg
16th May 2010, 20:46
On review Pat, first trip for Hector Far East I joined her in BHead.

Thanks for the confirmation.

BW

J(Gleam)(Gleam)

TonyAllen
16th May 2010, 22:39
Pat when I sailed on the Ixion we sailed from Birkenhed, I was on the shore gang before I joined her,Sad to say it was not the beat trip I did Tony

Pat Kennedy
16th May 2010, 22:45
Pat when I sailed on the Ixion we sailed from Birkenhed, I was on the shore gang before I joined her,Sad to say it was not the beat trip I did Tony

What was the problem Tony, I always heard she was a good ship, for the deck crowd at least.
Pat(Thumb)

TonyAllen
16th May 2010, 22:53
Pat. No real problems just the catering staff did not realy gell together and after leaving aussie it was a case of keping yourself to yourself if you know what I mean and I was glad to get back to the far east run again althought I did enjoy the aussie coast in particular Brisbane Regards Tony

Coastie
16th May 2010, 22:59
Is what I've hear true that if you were sacked from Blue Funnel, then you didn't work at sea again as no one would take you on??

I have seen many a Blue Funnel boat stop off here to pick up the Pilot for onward voyage to Liverpool.

Pat Kennedy
16th May 2010, 23:03
Coastie,
I did hear that but I never heard of anyone getting the dead sack from the China. You could get the sack from a ship without it affecting your standing in the company. I'm talking now about ratings, I suppose for officers it would be a severe black mark,
Regards,
Pat

Coastie
16th May 2010, 23:07
Thanks for that, Pat. I have also heard of a comparison between Blue Flue and Eddy Stobart Trucking in a similar respect.

jmcg
17th May 2010, 09:54
Pat/Coastie.

I sailed with a few who were sacked from the China - not just from the ship. The "Pool" sometimes looked on them with compassion.

No peggy ever sailed with JB for more than one trip. He made sure they got sea time elsewhere!.

BW

J (Gleam)(Gleam)

Pat Kennedy
17th May 2010, 10:28
John,
I left The China for the pool twice. looking for pastures new I suppose, but both times I eventually went back to Odyssey works, and had no problems getting a ship.
I was always treated well by that company and can understand why many spent their whole seagoing career with Alfie Holt's.
Regards,
Pat

jmcg
17th May 2010, 12:56
Yes Pat, like you I left for other outfits . Some good -some awful. AH & Co.was a mighty fine outfit to work for - I guess I would do a trip for no pay at all if offered under the then same circumstances and conditions..

Must go back to work now!


JU

Hugh Ferguson
17th May 2010, 19:21
Much mention of the Peleus in this "thread". I wonder how many ever watched the T.V. program, "Who Do You Think You Are". On one of those, the person whose ancestry was being explored, was Laurence Llewelyn-Bowen: his grandfather (on his mother's side) was Captain R.E. Wilks, first and long time master of that ship.

lillimckenzie
18th May 2010, 20:22
There are google Earth sat pictures of Hubei. Any idea of a Lat Lon for the power station? It would be very easyto pick out the ship if a position was known.

Trader
18th May 2010, 21:42
I only did four years with Blueys. First trip to sea, after attending Aberdovey Outward Bound sea school in 1952, was on the Bellerophon where I spent two years. Six Far east trips and a few coasting trips. I then did a couple of Far east trips on the Astyanax then coasted the Nestor and Ixion before joining the Neleus and doing a couple of Aussie trips. As every one says, they were hard working ships but it stood me in good stead in the years following.

I left to join Manchester Liners, Manchester being my home port, and what a difference, down from 24 derricks to 12 but a lot less crew. What a change, they were so laid back. I did about ten years on and off with the Liners which was also a good company to work for. I then moved down to London and sailed out of there for a good few years before ending up here in Dover on the ferries. I finished off doing 12 years on the same ship, the European Trader, before packing in and working ashore on the Channel Tunnel.

I still got a little tear in my eye whenever we passed a Bluey and love seeing all the photos on this site.

Alec.

TonyAllen
18th May 2010, 22:36
Much mention of the Peleus in this "thread". I wonder how many ever watched the T.V. program, "Who Do You Think You Are". On one of those, the person whose ancestry was being explored, was Laurence Llewelyn-Bowen: his grandfather (on his mother's side) was Captain R.E. Wilks, first and long time master of that ship.

Hugh I did 2 trips on the peleus wirh cap wilks and it was 2 great trips, he aske me to sing at a birthday party for passengers, there was 4 in the band and the next day a case of beer appeared in the mess Tony

capt.jim
19th May 2010, 20:56
memories--- sailed with `gentleman` t wilks on the astyanax 51 again on the perseus 56 happy days

Pat Kennedy
19th May 2010, 21:21
Pat/Coastie.

I sailed with a few who were sacked from the China - not just from the ship. The "Pool" sometimes looked on them with compassion.

No peggy ever sailed with JB for more than one trip. He made sure they got sea time elsewhere!.

BW

J (Gleam)(Gleam)

After having said earlier in this thread that I had never heard of anyone getting the dead sack from The China, it came to me that, yes I had.
1960 I was in the Nestor, and four of the deck crowd, a couple of EDHs and a couple of ordinary seamen, came from the same neighbourhood in Kirkdale (Liverpool). They were a bit wild when they had some booze, but didnt cause too many problems on that voyage.
A while later I heard that they had shipped out together on the Automedon, and that they had all ended up in goal after what someone who was there described to me as the voyage from hell.
It seems that there was whisky stowed in the after masthouse, and these four plus a couple more, got in there and proceeded to hide cases of whisky all over the ship.
From that time on they were drunk 24/7, and out of control much of the time. It all culminated when the ship loaded a deck cargo of cattle homeward bound for, I think, Port Sudan.
They proceeded to daub the cattle with caustic, and apparently caused some horrendous burns.
I believe the police were waiting when the ship reached Rotterdam and the culprits were arrested, tried and given prison terms, and were never allowed to go to sea in any sort of capacity again.
Pat

Hugh Ferguson
20th May 2010, 17:28
Hugh I did 2 trips on the peleus wirh cap wilks and it was 2 great trips, he aske me to sing at a birthday party for passengers, there was 4 in the band and the next day a case of beer appeared in the mess Tony

A nice memory, Tony. Captain Wilk's first command was the Glenfinlas. On 6th Ap.1941 she was bombed somewhere about off Harwich whilst on passage Southend to Middlesbrough. Several killed and the ship disabled and towed to off Harwich, pumped out and eventually towed to Wallsend-on- Tyne for repairs.
I believe that Captain Wilks was never in luck for Christmasses at home when his children were growing-maybe that's why they gave him the Christmas ship, Peleus, but a bit late for a Christmas with the kids; three of them had already gone to sea by 1949!

tony poutch
22nd May 2010, 22:58
What was the problem Tony, I always heard she was a good ship, for the deck crowd at least.
Pat(Thumb)

Pat ,Ixion was a was a good ship for the deck crowd ,after my first two trips as a peggy with Joe Kavanagh as Bosun I was fit enough to go anywhere .

Pat Kennedy
23rd May 2010, 10:41
Hi Tony,
I went round the land with Joe Kavanagh on the Laomedon. He worked us bell to bell and made sure he got his pound of flesh, but I found him OK.
regards,
Pat(Thumb)

roboted
23rd May 2010, 18:39
Hi Tony,
I went round the land with Joe Kavanagh on the Laomedon. He worked us bell to bell and made sure he got his pound of flesh, but I found him OK.
regards,
Pat(Thumb)

My first deep sea.....bloody marvellous ship and crowd,tho in 76/77,deckies were Indonesian,Engine room Singaporean Chinese.....Paid off in Singapore where she was sold and went for further trading...that was a sad day...

Robbo

Pat Kennedy
23rd May 2010, 19:00
Robbo,
It was 1962 when I was in the Laomedon. she was a fine ship then at nearly ten years old, she must have been 23 when you sailed in her. Broken up in 1978, 25 years old which was the average life span for a China boat.
Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

Trader
23rd May 2010, 22:17
Pat, I believe that Joe Kavanagh was a good friend of your old mate Jack Cleary(Jester). Both from Wicklow. When they met up in Singapore watch out.
Jack was on the Astyanax and Joe, I think, was on the Autolycus.

Alec.

roboted
23rd May 2010, 22:20
Robbo,
It was 1962 when I was in the Laomedon. she was a fine ship then at nearly ten years old, she must have been 23 when you sailed in her. Broken up in 1978, 25 years old which was the average life span for a China boat.
Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

Totally right Pat,and I only 21 !!! I owe a great debt of gratitude to the old Bluey's and those I sailed with......taught me so much,but I have to say I was a willing pupil !!!

Cheers
Robbo

macrae
23rd May 2010, 23:24
I could go as a sparkie if you help me up the gangplank with my simmer (Thumb)

Pat Kennedy
24th May 2010, 18:58
Pat, I believe that Joe Kavanagh was a good friend of your old mate Jack Cleary(Jester). Both from Wicklow. When they met up in Singapore watch out.
Jack was on the Astyanax and Joe, I think, was on the Autolycus.

Alec.
Alec,
I believe Joe Kavanagh and Jack Cleary were cousins along with Paddy Proctor. All three from Wicklow.
As regards Jack Cleary, I will not say a word against him since his grandaughter contacted me and gave me 'down the banks' for my earlier ill considered comments on another thread.
My own fault, you should never speak ill of the dead.
Suffice to say that Jack was a memorable bosun and a real character.
Best Regards,
Pat

capt.jim
24th May 2010, 19:28
i was senior middy on the astyanax with jack---lets say he was not the easiest person to get on with --having said that i probably learned more from him than anyother bosun. he was forever complaining to the mate about me ,to big for my boots (which i probely was )

railroadbill
27th May 2010, 18:25
You can count me in as Senior Electrician. I did several voyages on the old Blue Flue boats. It would be great to have her back into her home port of Liverpool.
It would be a hell of a work-up just to get it seaworthy and certificated in order to bring her home, but I'm ready, willing and able. Just ironing my 'Whites' now. Everything else is ready !

jmcg
4th June 2010, 21:55
Update

Slow progress on the contact in Hubei. He is not a seaman.

Still on the investigation though.

J

Wanstead
10th June 2010, 15:56
I assume those interested in this venture would want the ship returning to the Mersey.
Best of luck. We do not seem to have much success with preserving nostalgia here on Merseyside. What happened to the Sub close by the Four Bridges?

Pat Kennedy
10th June 2010, 16:10
I assume those interested in this venture would want the ship returning to the Mersey.
Best of luck. We do not seem to have much success with preserving nostalgia here on Merseyside. What happened to the Sub close by the Four Bridges?

They cut it up into 4 sections and moved it to a permanent site alongside Woodside Ferry Terminal. They did a good job on it and it is now open to the public.
Regards,
Pat(Thumb)

jaigee
11th June 2010, 09:00
Or if you are refering to HMS Onyx, she is now in Barrow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Onyx_(S21)

Wanstead
11th June 2010, 11:04
I was referring to the Sub to which Pat Kennedy has kindly addressed.

Wanstead
11th June 2010, 11:08
A little digression but is there anywhere in Liverpool where The Derbyshire incident is recognized? A plaque or similar

Octavius
20th June 2010, 15:24
As for Octavius's comments, well I would say that he must be a bean counter at heart, not a romantic bone in his body.
Best Regards,
Pat(Thumb)



Pat Kennedy,

Certainly not an accountant but having an eye on the budget is essential in Management.

Romantic? Leave that for the enthusiasts and the like.

Keep your money in your pockets boys and let some other romantic take the hit.

Pat Kennedy
20th June 2010, 16:02
Octavius,
i think the way forward with this , if in fact the ship is there and is 'up for grabs' so to speak, is to find a sponsor, or an organisation that can see a way of refurbishing and displaying the ship in its home port. There are plenty of examples around the world of this. Cap San Diego in Hamburg is one I quoted earlier on this thread, but there are others I've seen in the US, so its not a new concept.
If it ever comes to pass, then I would certainly go to China to help bring the ship back to Liverpool.
Regards,
Pat(Smoke)

Octavius
20th June 2010, 18:19
Pat,

You, and the other BF men seem determined. I wish you well.

R651400
3rd July 2010, 07:07
Along with John Stanford-Taylor ex Glen Line office London, I was involved in the hunt for Glenfalloch/Qing He Cheng from the outset.
The leads were many and some very positive but the end results few and always when dealing with COSCO. QHC's owners we were told the vessel had been scrapped.
My advice would be to positively identify the vessel as being BF and take it very "slowly slowly catchee monkee" from there.
I don't see funding as a stumbling block.
Snowbow Productions who were the prime-movers in the Glenfalloch project in 2002 didn't then.

jmcg
4th July 2010, 17:24
Thanks for this further lead.

Normal channels of investigation appear to lead nowhere. Unfortunately, the chap who first told me about this some weeks past passed away on 21st June. I do however, have a contact still occasionally working at Hubei who will "note interest".

Many thanks again

BW

J

R651400
5th July 2010, 07:18
Sorry to hear about the passing of your contact.
Just a small but important query are you absolutely sure he said the the Bluey is laid up in a cutting on the Yellow River and not the Yangtse?

jmcg
5th July 2010, 10:18
R.

He said it was on the Yellow River cutting. Seem to recall that the inland Yellow River was navigable when in flood only. Could be wrong on this however.

BW

J

Coastie
5th July 2010, 10:53
If you do manage to locate this ship and bring it back, make sure someone gets the the Press involved, I'm sure they'd love a story like this.

R651400
7th July 2010, 09:33
J..
If it is the Yellow River it makes the search a lot more simple.
I have a gut feeling this just may be Glenfalloch/QHC.
If not and it is another Blue Funnel ship, negotiations with the PRC will be tenuous and on our enthusiastic part hopefully conducted with extreme delicacy.
Sign me on.
B-r

R.

Capt.John Bax. Ret.
8th July 2010, 16:53
CERTUM PETE FINEM.

Never give up. Let me know when we sail !!!!!

Capt Bax.

(But hurry up, I am 80 in Jan.!!!!)R 399748

The Dog
9th July 2010, 13:46
Not a hope of bringing her to Liverpool. All the authorities are not just disinterested they are actually opposed. They did much to hinder keeping the Bar Lightship here and are still dragging their feet over HNS Wimbrel. Look at Manxman, Royal Iris and the Historic Ships collection. I am told that in London the PLA when approached offered help and A BERTH at Canary wharf if the ship does in fact exist. If it ever came off this would be the first ship with an octegenerian crew. I am on my way to Price Street now Mr Greenwood

R651400
9th July 2010, 17:26
Not a hope of bringing her to Liverpool. I am told that in London the PLA when approached offered help and A BERTH at Canary wharf if the ship does in fact exist.
Sad tidings on the attitude and demise of a once great seaport.
I can vouch for the fact when the hunt for Glenfalloch was first mooted London PLA welcomed the idea and had a berth.

Coastie
9th July 2010, 18:30
If this does come to fruition and a "mature" crew bring her back, it'd make a good film!!

Pat Kennedy
9th July 2010, 19:22
If this is indeed the Demodocus, there is a good photograph of her tear-arsing along at full speed here;
http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/240277/title/demodocus/cat/all

makko
10th July 2010, 04:25
If it ever came off this would be the first ship with an octegenerian crew.
Hold yer horses, I'm "only" 48 in September!!!![=P]
Rgds.
Dave

billyboy
10th July 2010, 04:44
Anyone found it on Google earth yet? If so whats the coordinates?

R651400
10th July 2010, 06:16
Have had a look and the clarity and definition are very good but nothing spotted the size of a Bluey.
Until we get something positive on coordinates, it's very much a needle in haystack scenario.

seeanji
12th July 2010, 00:08
Sign me on as leccy.

4eyes
16th July 2010, 23:26
If the hull's sound then it seems like there are enough of us to row her back home. I'm ex Flintshire so it would be wonderful if it was the 'falloch'.

jmcg
17th July 2010, 12:46
Still on this voyage of discovery chaps.

Have made an inquiry to a colleague who is off to an outage somehere in the region. I will pressure him as much as I can.

Have mulled the proposition over in my mind in moments of sentimental projection. Purely from the deck (Abs) perspective I have no issues or concerns. Imagine a crew of aged, balding and geriatric ABs hauling on a mooring rope now or attempting to get a heaving line ashore! No doubt we can all still manage the routine deck work and would rise to any challenge there.

From an engine room, navigation and catering perspective I would welcome comments on what lies ahead (if we find her) and progress to discussions with the Chinese.

All comments are welcome so long as they do not denegrate to a slagging match

BW

J(Gleam)(Gleam)

Thats another Story
17th July 2010, 13:06
the amount of medication we all have to take we would be banged up for drug smuggling.(Hippy)(Jester)(Jester)

R651400
18th July 2010, 07:10
J... If this dream comes to reality and assuming the ship is Chinese registered, it will no doubt be purchased as such?
A long shot tells me that Chinese ships still have a radio requirement and qualified staff to operate.
If that's the case along with Teb am happy to fit the radio bill and if not am still a dab hand with a wok.
Is there any chance we can pin-point your source's power station and it's exact location? The wikipee 2010 list for the Yellow River shows only one.

B-r

M

jmcg
18th July 2010, 13:06
R

My colleague is in Henan province in Central China on the Xaolangdi (usually known as the Langdi Station).

Where this is in relation to the "sighting" in the cutting on the Yellow River is not known.

Thanks for the info regarding the radio requirements. Your skill on the wok will be challenged I'm sure should we get her to sea again.
BW

J(Gleam)(Gleam)

Graham McMorine
26th July 2010, 21:24
Count me in and sign me on. Basically an engineer, but will do any job going. Just get me on it.

Tai Pan
1st August 2010, 10:27
J... If this dream comes to reality and assuming the ship is Chinese registered, it will no doubt be purchased as such?
A long shot tells me that Chinese ships still have a radio requirement and qualified staff to operate.
If that's the case along with Teb am happy to fit the radio bill and if not am still a dab hand with a wok.
Is there any chance we can pin-point your source's power station and it's exact location? The wikipee 2010 list for the Yellow River shows only one.

B-r

MStill got 1st Class PMG, so will sign as as Sparks.

TonyAllen
1st August 2010, 14:43
I'm still the potato peeler in our house and doing the strap up so still able to work in the galley Tony

R651400
1st August 2010, 16:24
Where this is in relation to the "sighting" in the cutting on the Yellow River is not known.Even the Yellow River for a lay-up/graveyard sounds nebulous.
Having said that, the fact that any Bluey/Glenboat has been sighted in the flesh is fantastic news.
We await further revelation...
B-r

R

Andrew Craig-Bennett
2nd August 2010, 16:21
J... If this dream comes to reality and assuming the ship is Chinese registered, it will no doubt be purchased as such?
A long shot tells me that Chinese ships still have a radio requirement and qualified staff to operate.
If that's the case along with Teb am happy to fit the radio bill and if not am still a dab hand with a wok.
Is there any chance we can pin-point your source's power station and it's exact location? The wikipee 2010 list for the Yellow River shows only one.

B-r

M

Sorry, not so, not for quite a few years now. Cosco hung onto radio officers because they spoke English and were therefore handy as Captain's Writers, but we did away with them a decade ago, now.

R651400
3rd August 2010, 05:32
Thanks for above Andrew.
Non R/O requirement notwithstanding the ship will still be Chinese registered so I would presume if the registry is not changed some presence of Chinese crew may still be mandatory?
Having said that, changing to foc should not really be too difficult!

billyboy
3rd August 2010, 05:54
Put me down as Greaser/oiler/wiper/tea maker and you got a deal.

Ken Green
3rd August 2010, 14:41
While working in Singapore for Straits Steamship Co, I took my Master's certificate in Hong Kong. Now that Hong Kong has reverted to Chinese Rule maybe my certificate would allow me to take the Masters job on a Chinese flagged ship!!!
All the best to all of you.

TonyAllen
3rd August 2010, 14:52
Rereading this thread and the guys who would love to go back like myself, I've just woke up to the fact that I am coming up to 73 years old,and I'm afraid that it is all a dream.so sad Tony

Pat Kennedy
3rd August 2010, 15:31
Rereading this thread and the guys who would love to go back like myself, I've just woke up to the fact that I am coming up to 73 years old,and I'm afraid that it is all a dream.so sad Tony
Tony,
Never give up hope, you could sign on as chief grocer and spend a leisurely few weeks typing up menus and indulging in long siestas on the after end of the prom deck, just showing up in the balloon for dinner in your tux.
As for me, my knees have carried away, so I'll go as Lampy and sit in the focsle smoking my pipe and fiddling round with paintpots etc.
PS. I saw a specialist yesterday about my knees. he took one look and said, "You were either a priest or a plumber" (no doubt you know that plumbers spend half their working life on their knees, and the other half with their arms elbow deep in sh1t).
Regards,
Pat(Jester)

Thats another Story
3rd August 2010, 16:31
i am the best peggy you will ever have the trouble is i never take any sh1t from anyone so change your own sheets and get your own fags(Jester)(Hippy)

TonyAllen
3rd August 2010, 17:14
Pat you are right that might be just the job and I'll open the bond from breakfast to breakfast not like the old days I'm more savvy now Tony

jmcg
10th August 2010, 20:17
Keep the dream alive chaps.

Had some feedback last week- that chap couldn't distinguish a "junk" from an unloved bluie .

Have sent him another "wire" and told him to check out a funnel instead of a sail.

BW

J(Gleam)(Gleam)

tantalus
2nd September 2010, 21:59
Hello all
I may be joining this conversation a little late but back in 1991 I photographed the Chinese ship Yang Cheng anchored off Georgetown (Penang) I recognised her as an ex Glen boat and, in fact she turned out to be Glenogle. The ferry to the mainline passed very close to her and, at that time she looked in excellent nick. The photos I took are on slides and are somewhere in that archive zone we all call the loft! The Glenfalloch I believe was also sailing under the Chinese flag at that time and may still be afloat. As for bringing her back? Well, for the last twelve months I have been involved in the part restoration of the SS Robin, a small Victorian (1890) raised quarterdeck coaster (Google 'SS Robin' for more info). The effort and costs involved are huge, the ongoing maintenance a major issue etc, etc. I have on many occasions over the last year wondered what the guys who built her would think if they saw the pain we were going through. Frankly I think they would think we were mad! No, sometimes dreams are best left just that way.

R651400
9th October 2010, 10:03
Keep the dream alive chaps.

On the many false leads and red herrings I had with Glenfalloch/Qing He Cheng, think this is turning out to be the same.

Sadly just a dream.

Jardine
4th December 2011, 10:26
I've done a bit of phoning around on this one initially, here in HK where there was a lot of interest and then in China. I am assured by those who I have spoken to, all with a marine background, that they have no knowledge of such a ship. Here in China, that does not mean it does not exist.

dom
4th December 2011, 11:57
it does excist,in all our minds,we can smell the oil,taste the tabnabs,hear the engineroom telegraphs,see the strain coming on the back spring,send the peggy along for the stores

Jardine
4th December 2011, 13:21
it does excist,in all our minds,we can smell the oil,taste the tabnabs,hear the engineroom telegraphs,see the strain coming on the back spring,send the peggy along for the stores

Now that's a coincidence, as it is the response I received from two of the people I made enquiries to.

capt.jim
4th December 2011, 19:10
Now that's a coincidence, as it is the response I received from two of the people I made enquiries to.
i think we all still remember the feel and smell of them . having been part of something special

DURANGO
4th December 2011, 19:52
Now that's a coincidence, as it is the response I received from two of the people I made enquiries to. Hello Jardine I tried to email you but somehow messed it up [ me and computers ] I am looking for some information with regards to Shanghai I will try again at a later date best regards Dave

CarolineD
11th December 2011, 12:37
This does sound a wonderful project if the ship does exist. Costly to bring her back to the UK though.

Am I right in thinking there are no Blue Funnel line ships left?

jmcg
11th December 2011, 13:50
Unfortunately, my contact for the lead in China has passed away. It is unlikely that I will ever get to the Huai Power Station to check out the initial "sighting".

Caroline D

Yes, unless the "A" class vessel as per the thread is in fact still languishing all BF & Glen Lines (as we recall them) are gone - some to the scrappers others, I believe, to the deep.


BW

J