Help Advice. Career change

Bill Aitken
21st June 2010, 23:20
Dear Bank line ship mates.
I left the the Bankline many years ago as a navigation cadet. I am now 55 years young. I joined MV Yewbank in Tampa USA in 1973 I think(9) months trip.Then SpeybanK followed by Lindenbank on shorter trips.
When I left I joined IBM and stayed 19 years with them, working my way up to management. I now work for a large bank as an IT Manager.
I am to be made redundant shortly(VR), but that's not bad.
I have a dream. I want to work on a ferry as an AB or EDH.
All past documents have long now been lost. Steering cert. discharge books
Catet log showing bridge watches, knots, rules of the road tasks completed etc.
Can I make this happen ?
I have started a bit of research and think I would have to do a 5 day EDH again + medical and the STCW 95(5 Days) now required since 2002 and perhaps some extra seatime.
I need proof of seatime and old discharge books.
I hope you guys can point me in the right direction.
This is my dream. I do not want to work in IT if I can avoid it.
I hear Andrew Weir are still going also. I wonder if they have any old records??
Thanks all.

chadburn
22nd June 2010, 16:15
Bill aka V twin, forget about Ferries most of them are being re-crewed by "other nations" these day's. What about Private Yacht work? Plenty of Training School's on the go for that application and a chap with your background will soon find a good berth I am sure.

Bill Aitken
22nd June 2010, 19:25
Thanks Chad for taking the time to reply.
Today I contacted Andrew Weir. They are having a few problems themself right now with this recession. They don't have records going that far back it may be on micro fiche though. They put me onto an Irish agency and got some good advice on positions advertised in the Telegraph. She has even sent me a copy. I also contacted MCA re old discharge books. They sent all their old records to to Canadian Marine Museum. They also advised I contact the national archive in London www.nationalarchive.gov.uk. They were very helpful and said I need to find out the registration number of my three ships and they might be able to help for a research fee.(Yewbank Speybank and Lindenbank) They also mentioned I would get these ship numbers a Lloyds registery.
Once I have these numbers the national archive can do their research.
I know I have to do the an STCW 95 course(5 days) and I would have to do the EDH(5 days) again also

Alan Rawlinson
23rd June 2010, 08:11
Dear Bank line ship mates.
I left the the Bankline many years ago as a navigation cadet. I am now 55 years young. I joined MV Yewbank in Tampa USA in 1973 I think(9) months trip.Then SpeybanK followed by Lindenbank on shorter trips.
When I left I joined IBM and stayed 19 years with them, working my way up to management. I now work for a large bank as an IT Manager.
I am to be made redundant shortly(VR), but that's not bad.
I have a dream. I want to work on a ferry as an AB or EDH.
All past documents have long now been lost. Steering cert. discharge books
Catet log showing bridge watches, knots, rules of the road tasks completed etc.
Can I make this happen ?
I have started a bit of research and think I would have to do a 5 day EDH again + medical and the STCW 95(5 Days) now required since 2002 and perhaps some extra seatime.
I need proof of seatime and old discharge books.
I hope you guys can point me in the right direction.
This is my dream. I do not want to work in IT if I can avoid it.
I hear Andrew Weir are still going also. I wonder if they have any old records??
Thanks all.


The advice above is good....

Huge numbers of shipboard jobs have gone to Eastern European seafarers and to other non Brit nationals and they do a good job.

The big yacht route is a possible, and there are a large number of interesting craft including the so called wind jammers ( who actually keep schedule with powerful engines) sailing in unusual areas with tourists.

My advise would be as always to list all your assets - not forgetting the all important IT skills which are in demand afloat - get the minimum certificates as needed, and scout round the Agencies online.

Good Luck

Cheers/AL

Burned Toast
24th June 2010, 14:28
Commercial yachts are looking for Abs/2nd.Mate
and with yourbackground I would imagine you would have little trouble finding a vessel.

But you must have minimum EDH and ENG1 plus stcw 95. Have you forgotten your Dis book number? it will be on any old pay slips.
good luck

Ray

Bill Aitken
24th June 2010, 20:41
Thanks again guys. Your advice is really great. Received a copy of the Telegraph today.That lady at www.bibbyshipmanagement.com was true to her word. I will have a read tonight. Looks like a good shipping paper from
Nautilus international.
Yep I don't have any old payslips so the discharge/log book number is long forgotten. Once I get the ship numbers I hope to get this info from the National archive. Good point about the IT skills I have worked a lot with risk and audit also. I believe there is quite a bit of that these days on ships
with everything having to be documented etc for safety reasons etc.
Latest is I have found out there is an EDH catchup course at Glasgow Nautical Collage in September. thanks again.
Bill.

Alan Rawlinson
24th June 2010, 22:02
Bill,

Are you 100% sure about this dream?????

Don't want to deter you, but I recall wanting to be a local bus driver (fantasy, I suppose) really badly when the serious work was easing off, but took a good look at it and realised it would not have lasted five minutes! Also, I had a good friend and sort of Maverick who was very successful in senior management in a shipyard in Dubai, and he was fixated on getting a factory job back in the UK - any old factory job - where he could go to work on a bike with a packet of sandwiches held on with an elastic band. It was his vision of a stress free job. Well, he followed through all the way. The first day, he fell out with the foreman, after telling him how to improve the job plus a few other misunderstandings - and you know the rest..... Last thing I heard he was running a shipyard in Vietnam.

Cheers

Bill Aitken
27th June 2010, 22:48
Bill,

Are you 100% sure about this dream?????

Don't want to deter you, but I recall wanting to be a local bus driver (fantasy, I suppose) really badly when the serious work was easing off, but took a good look at it and realised it would not have lasted five minutes! Also, I had a good friend and sort of Maverick who was very successful in senior management in a shipyard in Dubai, and he was fixated on getting a factory job back in the UK - any old factory job - where he could go to work on a bike with a packet of sandwiches held on with an elastic band. It was his vision of a stress free job. Well, he followed through all the way. The first day, he fell out with the foreman, after telling him how to improve the job plus a few other misunderstandings - and you know the rest..... Last thing I heard he was running a shipyard in Vietnam.


Cheers
I know what you mean, but I'll keep the dream for now.
Right now going back to IT is a second choice for me. I am 55 and pretty fit. First will be a medical and the STCW 95(Do all 4 in 5 days). All jobs have good times and bad I guess.
Trying to get ships details from Lloyds and I have asked a private research consultant to do research in the National Archive for me.

Looking back on the trip on these ships, we had some tough/interesting times.
Engine packed up after leaving Tampa.
60+ foot waves down the SA cape (The Ben Crugan was bow bent in the same storm off Durban) I took the wheel in that storm. Bank boats are great.
A 2nd Engineer that flipped and required 24 hr watch(4 on 4 off) until shore side. I hope he is ok now and enjoying life.
A jute fire in no 1 hold from damp cargo. I had to use the old foot pump and rope breathing equipment for that one until the ethol 25 gal. drums on the tween deck we had as cargo started expanding. Next CO2 then flooded the hold to put the fire out.
Death of dockers falling down the hold.

I remember two real funny things also.
Special cargo of whiskey being smashed into the side of the hold and all these cups appearing from nowhere.
Barefoot dockers in Africa coming out of the hold with brand new shoes
from the indian cargo.
My pet hates were
Damp cluster lights: They went bang and burnt your arm when plugged in.
Cleaning a freshwater tank in extream heat at sea
Chipping the chain locker with a hangover.
We'll forget the strum boxes for now.
(LOL)

Good times and great crews !! Even if I don't get the dream I would not change a thing.
Would be great to get crew lists between- 1972-1974 also.

gdynia
28th June 2010, 08:30
Bill

I am same age as you i would advise you to go into Health and Safety there looking for lots of people with a Marine Background ive never looked back since going over to it and the pay is fantastic

Bill Aitken
28th June 2010, 18:04
Sounds interesting. Is that health and safety at sea ?
Would you have any idea where to start looking ?
Thank you Sir.

Bill Aitken
28th June 2010, 21:52
Guys
I thought I would share this information, should anyone else need it.
Received this email
Dear Mr. Aitken:



Thank you for your email of 28 June 2010 regarding the crew agreements of Yewbank, Speybank, and Lindenbank, for 1973.



The information you are requesting is possibly contained in our collection of crew agreements and official log books, 1951-76. This series of documents is housed in an off campus storage site and has not been indexed. Because of this I can’t tell you immediately if we have the documents you are looking for.



If we do have the crew agreements/log books you are looking for, we would be happy to research/photocopy any of them subject to our research charges: $40.00 1 hour minimum fee, $0.50 per page for photocopies, $2.50 per scanned page and a recovery charge for air postage. Our fees are based on 1 hour to complete a search of 2 years of crew agreements for 1 vessel (or 2 vessels for 1 year). It will cost $60.00 to search through the 3 different vessels. Payment can be made by Visa or MasterCard only. Please note that you would only be charged if we hold the crew agreements/log books that you are requesting. Once I have been to our off campus site, I would write you again informing you of the cost.



The Maritime History Archive holds approximately 75 percent of the surviving crew agreements and official log books of British registered vessels for the periods 1863-1938 and 1951-1976. The National Archives, Kew, has retained all surviving documents prior to 1861, and 1939-1950 as well as a 10 percent sample in the 1861-1938 and 1951-1976 periods. Ninety percent of the surviving crew agreements for 1861-1862 and years ending in '5' (e.g. 1955) are held at the National Maritime Museum, Greenwich.



Let me know if you would like me to proceed.



Sincerely,



Tanya McDonald

Archival Assistant

Maritime History Archive

Memorial University of Newfoundland

St. John's, NL

A1C 5S7



Tel: 709-737-8428

Fax: 709-737-3123



Website: www.mun.ca/mha

I have asked them to continue with this work. I feel like a man on a mission.
This looks interresting also on health and safety.
http://www.oraclesafety.net/productby.php?basecode=47e3cdbb3646a&code=47e3cdc5f268d&dcode=47e3ce1f6aea7

Johnnietwocoats
29th June 2010, 06:20
Guys
I thought I would share this information, should anyone else need it.
Received this email
Dear Mr. Aitken:



Thank you for your email of 28 June 2010 regarding the crew agreements of Yewbank, Speybank, and Lindenbank, for 1973.



The information you are requesting is possibly contained in our collection of crew agreements and official log books, 1951-76. This series of documents is housed in an off campus storage site and has not been indexed. Because of this I can’t tell you immediately if we have the documents you are looking for.



If we do have the crew agreements/log books you are looking for, we would be happy to research/photocopy any of them subject to our research charges: $40.00 1 hour minimum fee, $0.50 per page for photocopies, $2.50 per scanned page and a recovery charge for air postage. Our fees are based on 1 hour to complete a search of 2 years of crew agreements for 1 vessel (or 2 vessels for 1 year). It will cost $60.00 to search through the 3 different vessels. Payment can be made by Visa or MasterCard only. Please note that you would only be charged if we hold the crew agreements/log books that you are requesting. Once I have been to our off campus site, I would write you again informing you of the cost.



The Maritime History Archive holds approximately 75 percent of the surviving crew agreements and official log books of British registered vessels for the periods 1863-1938 and 1951-1976. The National Archives, Kew, has retained all surviving documents prior to 1861, and 1939-1950 as well as a 10 percent sample in the 1861-1938 and 1951-1976 periods. Ninety percent of the surviving crew agreements for 1861-1862 and years ending in '5' (e.g. 1955) are held at the National Maritime Museum, Greenwich.



Let me know if you would like me to proceed.



Sincerely,



Tanya McDonald

Archival Assistant

Maritime History Archive

Memorial University of Newfoundland

St. John's, NL

A1C 5S7



Tel: 709-737-8428

Fax: 709-737-3123



Website: www.mun.ca/mha

I have asked them to continue with this work. I feel like a man on a mission.
This looks interresting also on health and safety.
http://www.oraclesafety.net/productby.php?basecode=47e3cdbb3646a&code=47e3cdc5f268d&dcode=47e3ce1f6aea7

I used them quite a few years ago. I have the Crew Lists and Official Log for all my ships.

They are very efficient and do good work.

Make sure you give them the Exact dates you were on board as they charge for every page.

Good luck

JTC

Charlie Stitt
29th June 2010, 11:07
Bill you say you left Bank Line as an Apprentice, you do not say if you got your AB's certificate at that time, if not, then your chances of getting an AB's job on a ferry would be slim. Having sailed as Mate on Ferries, I can assure you that every Ab is expected to know all about the job,and as crew numbers have been cut to the bone, there is no place for learners, you would find it demanding, and perhaps your dream would turn into a nightmare. I now only have to travel as passenger on a ferry, look at the Mates in all their safety clobber,dodging in and out through lorries and cars, and my rose tinted glasses shatter. Pity you lost your discharge book, perhaps through no fault of your own. I keep my Ab's Cert, Radar cert, Firefighting cert, Masters cert British Seamans ID card and two discharge books safe in a brief case, I treasure these documents, and often bring them out to show to my Children and Grandchildren. Makes me feel ten foot tall. Good luck in whatever you decide to do Bill.(Thumb)

Winebuff
29th June 2010, 16:58
Have I missed a trick here? Why did Bank Line send all our records to the Canadian Maritime Museum? We have a perfectly good one of our own in Liverpool and Greenwich.

I fortunately still have my discharge book plus a list of everyone I sailed with, unfortunately only surnames and initials coupled with a very poor memory.

Peter Smith
74-84

Charlie Stitt
29th June 2010, 18:38
Bill, I was talking to a friend this afternoon who told me the Pand O fast ferry which runs out of Larne, is crewed through the employment agency'' Grafton''. Anyone (no sea going experience required) is sent to do a sea survival course, and then is appointed on board the ferry in the customer services department. Not sure about requirements for other positions on board, but that info could be got from Grafton. It would appear, that the crew are actually employed by Grafton, not P and O Ferries. Cheers.

gdynia
30th June 2010, 12:29
Bill

Look at following web sites

www.oilandgasjobsearch.com
www.oilcareers.com

Bill Aitken
1st July 2010, 20:52
Once again thank you very much guys.
Latest is Good News
I think I have found my discharge record cost me £5.00
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=-3834664&CATLN=7&Highlight=%2CAITKEN%2C1954&accessmethod=0
Am I right is thinking R912971 is my discharge number ?
If you know the surname and date of birth you can do a search. Then request the document to be printed or ready for download. I have gone for download first.
70% of the records are kept in Canada 10% the National Archive. Can't remember where the other 20% is, but it's in a museum in the UK I think.
So I got lucky. Perhaps because my surname starts with an A.
Canada are doing a search for me also.
Received this last night.
We do not have discharge books. We have crew agreements, and some log books. The crew agreements provide particulars of the vessel, including the port of registry, tonnage, form of propulsion, owner and intended voyage. The information relating to the individual crew members includes the person's name, year and place of birth, capacity, previous vessel served on, and date of signing on and off the vessel.

On the question above re an AB, An AB must have 2 years seatime.
I did about 14 months I think and will build up to this if poss. I got my steering certificate. As you know the bank line was one of the best for getting experience. It was only at the end of the first 9 month trip I got near the bridge. All the rest of the time was on deck. I can still tie knots behind my back and would be able to splice wire etc. Had to learn all 32 rules word perfect and recite them back to the mate. I can only remember the first these days though.
Times will have changed I am sure and that's why I would have to do and EDH catch up. I would like to have a chat with an AB also.
Thanks for that other info on that ferryservice , that would be good for me.
It would be perfect in Oban Scotland. Looking at Cali Mac also.
I'll look at those Oil links .
Doing this research is much more fun than being an IT manager lol.
Thanks to all. Will keep you posted when the request is complete at the national archive.
ps If anyone needs to know these numbers from Lloyds shipping registery
Yewbank 301386
Speybank 304133
Lindenbank 301460
And a bit of info on records
http://www.mun.ca/mha/holdings/crewlist.php

Bill Aitken
12th July 2010, 22:14
Latest is below. They are on there way to me par airmail.(Thumb)

Dear Bill,
I have just come back from our off campus storage site and was able to find the crew agreements for the Speybank, ON 304133 and Yewbank, ON 301386. I found you on the Yewbank voyage dated 24/10/72 – 1/6/73 and the Speybank voyage dated 20/7/73 – 6/9/73. The 1973 and 1974 crew agreements of the Lindenbank, ON 301460 are held at the National Archives in Kew.
Sincerely,
Tanya McDonald
Archival Assistant
Maritime History Archive
Memorial University of Newfoundland
St. John's, NL
A1C 5S7
Tel: 709-737-8428
Fax: 709-737-3123
Website: www.mun.ca/mha

terence
13th July 2010, 00:07
good luck to you bill if you dont try now maybe you never will
if you dont like it you can always come back
cheers
terry music man

Bill Aitken
16th July 2010, 22:27
Thanks Terence.
I received all the ships logs/crew list for Yewbank and Speybank today and can see my name there. So I now have proof of these two ships., but not Lindenbank.
Some great stuff in there.
Here are the crew lists for both ships. Have all discharge book numbers DOB and POB also.
I'll keep the Old mans log to myself, as there is some private stuff in there and makes great reading.
Yewbank Tampa 24-10-72 -- 1/06/73 Mombasa
William H Martin Master
Alan L Watson Chief Off.
Joseph Bryan Second Off
Jeffray Taylor Third Off
Arthur B Thomas Cheif Eng.
Michael J Kennedy Second Eng.
Darryll W Alderdice Third Eng.
William Daymond Forth Eng.
Norman Nairne Fith Eng.
Ian A P Picken Sixth Eng.
Martin De Retuerto First Lecky
Roy E Horwell Second lecky
James A Murphy Cadet
William CC Aitken Cadet Me
Roger C Godfrey Cadet
David Whitecross Radio Off.

I have the whole crew list and dates in ports .

Will do Speybank later.(Thumb)

Alan Rawlinson
17th July 2010, 08:22
Thanks Terence.
I received all the ships logs/crew list for Yewbank and Speybank today and can see my name there. So I now have proof of these two ships., but not Lindenbank.
Some great stuff in there.
Here are the crew lists for both ships. Have all discharge book numbers DOB and POB also.
I'll keep the Old mans log to myself, as there is some private stuff in there and makes great reading.
Yewbank Tampa 24-10-72 -- 1/06/73 Mombasa
William H Martin Master
Alan L Watson Chief Off.
Joseph Bryan Second Off
Jeffray Taylor Third Off
Arthur B Thomas Cheif Eng.
Michael J Kennedy Second Eng.
Darryll W Alderdice Third Eng.
William Daymond Forth Eng.
Norman Nairne Fith Eng.
Ian A P Picken Sixth Eng.
Martin De Retuerto First Lecky
Roy E Horwell Second lecky
James A Murphy Cadet
William CC Aitken Cadet Me
Roger C Godfrey Cadet
David Whitecross Radio Off.

I have the whole crew list and dates in ports .

Will do Speybank later.(Thumb)

Bill, You are an impressive researcher - amazing what you have unearthed so far...

As we are mostly ' down memory lane ' here, I attach ( hopefully) a snap of W H Martin when he was an apprentice on the Southbank in 1960. I am a young looking c/o on the left. The others are 2 more apprentices and a youthful sparkie from Dublin.

Healey Martin became a good friend of mine. A true gentleman, and a human being - the highest accolade I can think of.

Alan Rawlinson
17th July 2010, 08:26
Here is the pic

Bill Aitken
17th July 2010, 09:20
Fantastic shot Alan. Thanks for that. Looks like smokol time. Happy days.
Captain Martin had lost a bit of his hair by the time he sailed on Yewbank.
He was a great Master. He was Master on the my next trip on Speybank also. He had some tough stuff to deal with on Yewbank.
He was the one that signed my steering Cert. in my Cadet blue book.
Do you still keep in touch.

Alan Rawlinson
17th July 2010, 09:49
Fantastic shot Alan. Thanks for that. Looks like smokol time. Happy days.
Captain Martin had lost a bit of his hair by the time he sailed on Yewbank.
He was a great Master. He was Master on the my next trip on Speybank also. He had some tough stuff to deal with on Yewbank.
He was the one that signed my steering Cert. in my Cadet blue book.
Do you still keep in touch.


Bill,

You probably know about the "Sibonga" rescues that Healey and his wife and Officers etc carried out. Many stories and amazing details connected with this period, but won't go on about it because it has been quite well chronicled elsewhere in these Bankline threads. Suffice it to say his actions should have been a model for all vessels caught up in this mess.

We were in touch for a long time, and I had the opportunity to entertain him and his wife Mildred when they came through Dubai when I was working ashore there. Also saw him when he was master of a new Fish class Bankboat in the yard prior to the maiden voyage, early 80's.

When he came ashore, we lost touch, and Mildred did tell me over the phone that he had sort of ' cut off ' from his many old Bankline friends. Apart from rumours, I don't know any more, so would be grateful if any one reading this could enlighten me.

Cheers

boatlarnie
17th July 2010, 12:58
Here is the pic

Hullo Alan,
Checking that photo out of the Apprentices on the Southbank, was one of them Dave 'Paddy' Ramsey by any chance?

Regards,
Boatlarnie

Alan Rawlinson
17th July 2010, 17:06
Hullo Alan,
Checking that photo out of the Apprentices on the Southbank, was one of them Dave 'Paddy' Ramsey by any chance?

Regards,
Boatlarnie

I don't recall that name, but regret the actual names escape me after 50 years. The second figure from the right was the Sparky who was on his first ship solo. The lad on the right was a first trip apprentice, as was the lad with the straw hat. Both apprentices were English as far as I can recall.

Anyone out there recognise themselves 50 years ago?

I remember the shock I got in Liverpool a few short years later ( completing a radar course) when I opened the morning paper to read about the stranding of our ship on Washington Island where we had been also been loading copra. It was front page news.
Cheers

boatlarnie
17th July 2010, 18:58
I don't recall that name, but regret the actual names escape me after 50 years. The second figure from the right was the Sparky who was on his first ship solo. The lad on the right was a first trip apprentice, as was the lad with the straw hat. Both apprentices were English as far as I can recall.

Anyone out there recognise themselves 50 years ago?

I remember the shock I got in Liverpool a few short years later ( completing a radar course) when I opened the morning paper to read about the stranding of our ship on Washington Island where we had been also been loading copra. It was front page news.
Cheers

Alan, I'm talking about the guy 2nd from the left, looks like Paddy Ramsey; just wondered when that shot was taken for Paddy and I sailed on the old Lossiebank 1958-1959.
Talking about the Southbank stranding in the Pacific, my sister who had been living in the Solomons, actually had her belongings on her when she went aground and thought she had lost them. A couple years later one or two suitcases suddenly appeared at our house in London.
Boatlarnie

RayL
17th July 2010, 21:13
I'm probably far too late with this information, but I found the following web page on 'Speybank':

http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo-896014-SPEYBANK

Alan Rawlinson
18th July 2010, 07:21
Alan, I'm talking about the guy 2nd from the left, looks like Paddy Ramsey; just wondered when that shot was taken for Paddy and I sailed on the old Lossiebank 1958-1959.
Talking about the Southbank stranding in the Pacific, my sister who had been living in the Solomons, actually had her belongings on her when she went aground and thought she had lost them. A couple years later one or two suitcases suddenly appeared at our house in London.
Boatlarnie

Good morning Boatlarnie,

The second from the left is Healey Martin, later long time Master in the Bankline. He was App/acting 3/0 when the snap was taken.

Cheers

boatlarnie
18th July 2010, 07:27
Good morning Boatlarnie,

The second from the left is Healey Martin, later long time Master in the Bankline. He was App/acting 3/0 when the snap was taken.

Cheers

Thanks for that Alan, spitting image of Paddy though; remember Healey Martin for met him a few times although never sailed with him.
Regards,
Boatlarnie

Bill Aitken
12th August 2010, 21:54
Just a quick update.
I wanted to make sure I could get on an EDH course before spending money on the STCW 95 safety courses or I would forget this dream.
I sent all the information I have found to date to the MCA and Andrew Weir hr (Lovely lady there. She wrote a letter confirming I was an employee etc).
Good news is the MCA say I can attend, but will hold the cert. until I do 3 months sea time, as the last time I was at sea was a long way back.
So I will now do the STCW 95 courses, which are a prereq and then EDH, while I am still employed and use my holiday time for the courses. Then look for a company that will take me on for 3 months as a trainee. That will put me at the point I left the sea. I am very happy.