schwartz zee

billyboy
17th November 2005, 23:06
hope i spelled the name right. Heard a rumor she is now a museum piece! anyone know anything about her or have a picture I would appreciate it.

Jan Hendrik
17th November 2005, 23:30
Several seagoing tugs with this name were built.

The most famous one is the Zwarte Zee (4) built in 1963.
She went to the wreckers in Taiwan in 1984

Find some particulars: http://www.nedships.nl/slepers/zslepers/zwarte_zee631.html

There is one preserved tugboat called Hudson. There are many websites on the restoration of this particular vessel.

http://www.museumschip-hudson.net/

ruud
17th November 2005, 23:43
Ahoy Billy,

I think your pronouncing isn't correct, because I don't recognize this name, there were a few[4] Zwarte Zee's [tugs]but non is left.Try to find out what name it should be and what kind of vessel,please.

Note: Jan are you not missing some? ELBE & FURIE & HARDI

Jan Hendrik
18th November 2005, 04:44
Yes Ruud. I made an example with one such famous tug, the "Hudson", also there is the "Holland", I think she is berthed in Den Helder and no doubt there are few more.
Beautiful ships with a large funnel and quite recognisable.
Good to see that some of those ships have been preserved.

billyboy
18th November 2005, 07:19
AShoy Ruud and Jan. The one I mean is the "zwarte Zee"(4) Many thanks for the websites Jan.nice picture of her on nedships. has she also been scrapped? she was a very good tug, often in the right place at the right time as i remember. Great design too! Hope she was preserved. met an ex crew member a few years ago who had made a radio controled modle of her for the exhibition at windsor race course.
thank you both for your help.

Jan Hendrik
18th November 2005, 07:43
Billyboy.
She was not preserved, refer to my earlier message. Scrapped in Kaohsiung in 1984.

A lot of models were built following this design and you find some in SN.
Stay in the same thread of tugboats, go to page 2 and here you find another posting with more links of this vessel.

Also plenty of websites about with same or similar names.
Most tugboats from Smit were named after an ocean or a sea at the time.

Zee means sea or ocean.
Zwarte Zee =- Black Sea
Rode Zee = Red Sea
Witte Zee = white sea
Noord Zee = North Sea
You will find all these tugboats back on the old sites of Smit International

ruud
18th November 2005, 08:11
Ahoy Billy,

Here some links:
http://members.lycos.nl/franshop/zz-fotos.htm
http://members.chello.nl/rverburg/pagina1_zwartezee4.html
http://members.chello.nl/rverburg/pagina_zwartezee4_foto.html
http://www.scheepsbouw-alblasserdam.nl/jks_zwarte_zee_IV_1963.htm
http://www.zeesleepvaart.com/zwartezeeIV.htm
http://www.tugspotters.com/tugs/ZWARTE.ZEE.IV.htm
http://members.chello.nl/rverburg/overz-3.html

billyboy
18th November 2005, 10:13
Ruud! you do it again. what nice pictures on that site. so sad and sorry she was scrapped my friend. to me she was awesome as tugs go. take care my friend. thank you again for sall you do on this site. you get my gold star award for everything you have done. God bless you.

meechingman
18th November 2005, 18:30
Yes, she was a looker. I've always thought her to be the ultimate evolution of Smit's sleek designs that started (I guess)with the Nordzee of 1949 (compare her with the Humber of a year earlier) and then really got going with tugs from the late 50's like the Barents Zee, Clyde and Elbe. Zwarte Zee and Witte Zee (and their smaller sisters) just looked so good. What happened then - they took away all the curves with Noordzee and Poolzee - YUK! :@

Anyone know the current situation regarding the Elbe, after her second sinking? She was going to be preserved with Hudson.

Andy G

ruud
18th November 2005, 18:55
Ahoy Andy,

Here some links regarding the Elbe:

http://80.126.138.173/forum/zoeken/zeevaart/pietsinke/2004/2004_elbe.htm
http://80.126.138.173/forum/zoeken/zeevaart/pietsinke/2005/images/2005_NewsletterElbe_no1.htm
http://80.126.138.173/forum/zoeken/zeevaart/pietsinke/2005/2005_feb08.htm
http://www.nautiek.nl/sinke/237-13-11-2005b.pdf

meechingman
18th November 2005, 19:41
Thanks Ruud, great to know that she is being preserved. The last photo I had seen was when she had sunk the second time.

Andy G (*))

ruud
18th November 2005, 21:08
Ahoy Andy,

Yeah, there been a lot of rumours[sabotage,assurances] last year about these sinkings, but gladly those volunteers keep the good work up, and they've raised, already a lot of money,all by donations, I dont have the exact figures, but it's far over 50.000 ; and as you said, these lovely "oldies" should be preserved.

Mr-Tomcat
3rd July 2007, 14:25
I thought at the time and still do the nicest tugs I ever seen where the Schelde (Afon Goch) and Tasman Zee (Afon Wen) back in 1976-7 while based at Holyhead with Holyhead Towing, when I was only 10-11. I have a model of the Zwarte Zee what a wonderful shape.

RayJordandpo
3rd July 2007, 16:22
The 'Zwarte Zee' was always my favourite tug for looks. Jan Hendrik mentioned the 'Holland' she was also a fine looking vessel. Didn't she become a Greenpeace ship? or am I getting mixed up with another tug.
Ray Jordan

ddraigmor
3rd July 2007, 16:34
Ray and Mr. TomCat,

'Zwarte Zee' was a real beuty, a classic and very definitely must be there amongst the top ten lookers when it comes to tugs.

I would put both the HTC ones in there as well, especially the 'Afon Goch' which was a classic.

The 'Holland' I think you are referring to Ray is a museum ship which is still sailing and in absolutely beautiful condition. here in the UK what have we got when we once had a deep sea tug fleet ourselves? Shame on us!

Jonty

Mr-Tomcat
3rd July 2007, 17:34
The 'Zwarte Zee' was always my favourite tug for looks. Jan Hendrik mentioned the 'Holland' she was also a fine looking vessel. Didn't she become a Greenpeace ship? or am I getting mixed up with another tug.
Ray Jordan

The Elbe became a Greenpeace ship.http://www.tugspotters.com/welkom.html

Click on Elbe if it does not take you direct.

Jan M
4th July 2007, 14:34
hello,

i agree, ZWARTE ZEE (4) (1962) & WITTE ZEE (2) (1966) were the best looking dutsch tugs (...)

ZWARTE ZEE (4) (1962)

(sisterships: ZWARTE ZEE, WITTE ZEE)
Registered: LR66-67:542312 /IMO 5423128 /(NLD)ON 12810
1539 GRT, 155 NRT, L77,50m(68,71), B12,86m(12,35), D6,147m(6,91) (254'3"(225'5")x42'2"(40'6")x20'2"(22'8")) - fifi, salv.
1 scr, 2x diesel 4tew 12cyl Smit-MAN, 7000bhp-5145kW total, sp 17kn, bp 70t

ZWARTE ZEE
1962 -12/10: Launched by "J. & K. Smit's Scheepswerven" at Kinderdijk (YN 884)
1963 -18/04: delivered to "LSIS - L. Smit & Co's Internationale Sleepdienst" at Rotterdam
(NLD flag, regd Rotterdam, ON 12810, c/s PIZQ)
(Smit Internationale Sleepbootmaatschappij 'Zwarte Zee' BV", stationed at Fayal (Azores)
1983 -15/12: arrived at Singapore and laid up
1984 -01/05: towed away by tug 'Smit London' to Taiwan (together with tanker 'Petrola 26')
1984 -16/05: for breaking up delivered to "Li Chong Steel & Iron Works Co Ltd" at Kaohsiung (Taiwan)

http://www.tugtalk.co.uk/images/2003/12/31314.jpg
http://www.tugtalk.co.uk/images/2005/01/62815.jpg
http://members.ams.chello.nl/rverburg/pagina1_zwartezee4.html
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=241870
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=338864

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

WITTE ZEE (2) (1966)

Registered: IMO 6613287 /(NLD)ON 13998
1539 GRT, 146 NRT, L77,50m(68,71), B12,88m, D6,135m(6,91) - salv.
1 scr, 2x diesel 4tew 12cyl MAN, 7000bhp-5145kW-9000ihp total, sp 17kn, bp 70t

1966 -03/05: Launched by "J. & K. Smit's Scheepswerven" at Kinderdijk (YN 911)
1966 -29/09: delivered to "L. Smit & Co's Internationale Sleepdienst Maatschappij NV" at Rotterdam
("Smit Internationale Sleepbootmaatschappij 'Witte Zee' BV")
(NLD flag, ON 13998, call sign PIRD)
19xx: restyled to "Smit Internationale Zeesleep & Bergingsbedrijf NV" at Rotterdam
1983 -xx/10: laid up at Bahrain, sold to "Euroatlantic Shipping Corp." at Monrovia
1984 -08/04: towed away by tug 'DRADO'
1984 -18/04: for breaking up to "Euroatlantic Shipping Corp" at Monrovia (LBY), beached on Gadani Beach near Karachi (PAK)

http://www.tugtalk.co.uk/images/2004/01/34394.jpg
http://www.tugtalk.co.uk/images/2003/05/18872.jpg
http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/9496/wittezee0nh.jpg
http://www.maritimephoto.com/collection/vessel/12143/photo/0
http://www.maritimephoto.com/collection/vessel/12143/photo/1
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84531
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84528
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84536
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84535
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84534
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84533
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=84532
http://www.shipspotting.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=21620

regards from Hamburg
/ Jan

Mr-Tomcat
5th July 2007, 00:36
Did anybody ever hit the directors of Smit for scrapping possibly the worlds most beautiful tugs.

billyboy
5th July 2007, 06:17
I have to admit Tomcat...they certainly had some nice vessels on their books!

Mr-Tomcat
6th July 2007, 23:09
Can someone tell me what became of the Tasman Zee, as I've said I remember her from Holyhead.
Andrew.

ddraigmor
7th July 2007, 00:42
Tasman Zee.

1958, L. Smit & Zoon, Kinderdijk, 526 brt, 1650 IHP
1966 re-engined to 3400 IHP.
1977 'Afon Wen' Holyhead Towing Co. Ltd., Beaumaris.
1979 'Karob' International Bazaar Ltd., Panama.
1980 'Karob' Trix Enterprise Inc, S.A., Panama.
1981 'Voila' Trix Enterprise Voila Inc., Panama.
1984 'Torten' International Bazaar Ltd., Panama.
1985 'Resolve' Resolve towing & Salvage S.A. (J. Farrel), Puerto Cortez. (br> 1987 Out of register

Last I heard she was damaged by a cycklone and laid up in a bad way on a beach in India and then scrapped where she lay.

Like the 'Afon Goch' (Ex 'Schelde' which was a CTL after a fire in Texas) a very sad loss.

Jonty

Mr-Tomcat
7th July 2007, 17:54
Something about the old Holyhead boats I remember my Dad telling me many years ago one had a Viking funeral, I was in the dark for years untill I went on Tugspotters, it was the tug Hengel (Afon Goch) one of the three tugs my Dad was in charge of before a certificate was required.

ddraigmor
7th July 2007, 20:06
Mr T,

Alas, sorry - she wasn't the 'Hengel' - she was the 'Hengst' - she had a German Swastika on her binnacle as she was built for the Kriegsmarine. her history is as follows:


C4S HENGST
1939: Built by "Howaldtswerke AG" at Hamburg
1939 -November: completed for the Kriegsmarine, the Marinehafenbauamt at Helgoland
1940 -August: transferred to Unternehmen Seelöwe (pennant C4S)
1945: confiscated by the US Allied forces
1946 -12/07: To "OMGUS - Office of Military Government of the United States" at Bremen, as HENGST
(DEU flag, regd Bremen, c/s DDSB, 121 GRT,13 NRT)
1948 -30/08: chartered to "Norddeutscher Lloyd" at Bremen
1954 -15/04: Sold to "Norddeutscher Lloyd" at Bremen
1957: re-engined diesel 2 by 9cyl Darmstadt, 720bhp (126 GRT)
1964 -02/06: To "Schelde Sleepvaartbedrijf NV" at Antwerpen, renamed SCHELDE VIII or SCHELDE 8
(BELGIAN flag, c/s ORPX, 126 GRT, 16 NRT)
1967: To "Holyhead Towing Co Ltd" at Holyhead, renamed AFON GOCH
(GBR flag, regd Liverpool, ON 334221c/s GWTU, 123 GRT, 36 NRT)
1973: To "Greenex A/S" at Marmorjlik-Greenland (DNK), renamed SORTE ENGEL
( DNK flag, regd Marmorjlik, c/s OWBF, 121 GRT, 13 NRT)
1975 -December: stranded and damaged
1979: scuttled

I don't know that she went on fire first - but the big 'Afon Goch' did - she was declared a CTL after thieves broke in and used the welding gear to try and strip copper out of her cabling in the engine room.

JOnty

Mr-Tomcat
13th July 2007, 15:47
'Hengst' I understand she was burnt in Iceland, looking at what you've posted it appears my info was wrong.

Ta, Andy.

meechingman
16th July 2007, 09:17
The 'Zwarte Zee' was always my favourite tug for looks. Jan Hendrik mentioned the 'Holland' she was also a fine looking vessel. Didn't she become a Greenpeace ship? or am I getting mixed up with another tug.
Ray Jordan

Just picked up this thread after a break, Ray.

Elbe was the Smit tug that became Greenpeace - photo in my gallery of her at Newhaven - in the third part of her career. As Ruud says, now being fully restored to her original appearance.

Andy

Andrew Craig-Bennett
26th February 2010, 17:53
The "Holland" - also an exceptionally lovely tug - was never anything to do with Smits - she was built for, and always owned by, Doeksens of Terschelling. Preserved as an active vessel.

Blue in Bim
16th March 2010, 19:31
Greetings, I am new to the site but have to say I think you have to go a long way to beat the looks of the Bugsier tugs Atlantic, Simson Titan and Wotan. I find the Arctic and Oceanic had too much accommodation as did the Pacific. The Seefalke was another beauty and even the smaller Bugsier 6 +7 were pleasing to the eye. The Bugsier 6 operates out here in the Caribbean now as the Gard 1. I used to have a small tug, La Carriere built in the UK for Texaco Trinidad which operated in the region all the way up to Texas on one occasion.
Single screw with 2 x Lister Blackstone ERS8. Still visible in Trinidad as the people we sold her to sank it close to the pilot station in Port of Spain. The Seefalke ended her days there too as the Baltic Rescuer.

Nice to be here,

Ian Cox (Blue)

Andrew Craig-Bennett
16th March 2010, 20:22
PACIFIC was the first of the Bugsier big tugs and I very well recall that she was a world champion roller, but the inside of her accomodation (as of the others) was really very nice indeed, finished with oak panelling.

SEEFALKE for a reason that I don't now know, if I ever did, carried the personal funnel marks and houseflag of the Schuchman family who own Bugsier. I agree that she and the TITAN SIMSON ATLANTIC WOTAN class were the prettiest. I had most to do with PACIFIC because she was the regular Brest station keeping salvage tug, generally under Hartmut Weinert.

Blue in Bim
16th March 2010, 20:35
One of the Atlantic size tugs was stationed here in Barbados on standby for any salvage jobs in the Atlantic and I remember the German crew unstuffing a 20' container of 'supplies' which seemed to consist mainly of tins of beer. The tugs were always beautifully kept, apart from when they first came in after a job.

Andrew Craig-Bennett
17th March 2010, 11:30
It was a rule, in the big tug companies, that ocean going tugs should always be provisioned for three months, because you never knew when a job might come up and it might take a very long time if for instance it was towing a floating dock or something of that sort. (I can tell a long story about the effects of this rule as regards beer but it is a Smit story not a Bugsier story.)

As you say, Bugsier tugs were always "kept like yachts".