RFAs to be built overseas?

fred henderson
23rd February 2006, 11:12
Last December, Defence Secretary John Reid relaxed the previous requirement for the construction of all British warships and "war-like" vessels to be carried out in the UK. The MoD is running a project called Military Afloat Reach and Sustainability (MARS) - they must have a stupid name for every project, MoD probably has a highly paid department thinking them up. MoD has now announced the selection of three MARS "Candidate Integrators" (new words for a short list of Prime Contractors). Non of them are shipbuilders. The short list is AMEC, KBR and Raytheon. It looks as though they are setting the stage for the ships to be built overseas.
Eleven ships are planned in three classes of ships, "which will deliver fuel and other stores to the fleet, helicopter support and sea-based logistics for deployed forces." Delivery is required from 2011 to 2021 so a good long term programme is envisaged.
Can anyone imagine any other advanced military country contemplating the construction of these ships overseas? Most emerging nations are demanding local construction for defence projects. The remaining UK warship builders are trying to hang on until the Aircraft Carrier programme gets into the construction phase, aware that when they completed another order famine is likely. MARS could be phased to balance the work load. I think that if these vessels are built overseas it will finally kill off the remnants of UK surface shipbuilding.

Fred (Cloud)

tom nicholson
23rd February 2006, 14:37
i fully agree with you fred swan hunter is strggling now and if the so called MARS project goes overseas it will not be just the building yards affected but a lot off ancillary companys also, it seems as the powes that be dont want to produce anything in this country and the companys that do produce are mostly foriegn owned by the time they wake up to what is happening it will be to late just look at the state off tyneside for example.
cheers tom (*))

Paul UK
23rd February 2006, 16:42
pray tell if we let foreign companies build our warships what happens if at a point in the future they become un friendly a bit like iraq.

will they destroy the plans of our ships or will they play dirty and use the plans against us.

am i being small minded and a little islander.

paul

Hendo!
23rd February 2006, 17:00
I know they're not RN or RFA, but hasn't orders for new Scottish Fishery Protection Vessels gone to a Polish yard?

(Cloud)

With RFAs being merchant vessels, wouldn't new constructions come under the same EU bidding laws?

Hope they stay home built.

Paedrig
23rd February 2006, 17:04
pray tell if we let foreign companies build our warships what happens if at a point in the future they become un friendly a bit like iraq.

will they destroy the plans of our ships or will they play dirty and use the plans against us.

am i being small minded and a little islander.

paul

No, I think you have a valid point.

James_C
23rd February 2006, 17:43
I know they're not RN or RFA, but hasn't orders for new Scottish Fishery Protection Vessels gone to a Polish yard?

(Cloud)

With RFAs being merchant vessels, wouldn't new constructions come under the same EU bidding laws?

Hope they stay home built.


Two SFPA cruisers and the two new ferrys for the Wemyss Bay-Rothesay route went to Poland.

Hendo!
23rd February 2006, 19:16
Two SFPA cruisers and the two new ferrys for the Wemyss Bay-Rothesay route went to Poland.

And another possibly going to Germany.

http://www.greenocktelegraph.co.uk/readstory.php?id=6926

stevevincent1974
24th February 2006, 00:10
This a disgrace the these contracts should be given to british yards not foreign yards.
british ship building knowledge is huge as previous great ships military and merchant will show. This so call scheme should be sent to the bottom immediately and the people in charged sacked. This could be the final nail in the coffin of the once massive and great british ship building industry.

King Ratt
28th March 2006, 08:34
Dont forget that John Reid was an old communist who was agin all things British. He's now in a position to do what his "brothers" always wanted to do..get rid of our forces.

LEEJ
28th March 2006, 12:49
As one of the "brothers" I think the issue is more of globalisation. Look around you - cheap foreign workers everywhere at the expense of the local workforce.This is an extension of that. A mindset in the government that the market is always right, even at the expense of the national interest.

fred henderson
28th March 2006, 15:39
I feel that the mindset of the Whitehall civil servants is the major problem. A four paragraph general directive from Brussels emerges from Whitehall as a 40 page highly restrictive British regulation. In the rest of the EEC, the officials always seek to exploit everything to promote their national interests. I cannot see France or Italy building naval support ships overseas

Fred

cboots
30th March 2006, 00:06
May I respectfully point out to King Ratt that it was in his previous capacity as "an old communist" that John Reid, in company with many others, attempted to prevent the closure of the Upper Clyde Shipbuilders consortium in defiance of the very Conservative government of Edward Heath.
CBoots

James_C
30th March 2006, 11:33
Well, he'll no doubt follow in Ted Heaths footsteps if he starts ordering from overseas. That would finish shipbuilding in the UK.
Still, its no accident tht John Reid, Tony B Liar et al are widely known as 'The New Tories'.

Ron Stringer
30th March 2006, 11:46
Still, its no accident tht John Reid, Tony B Liar et al are widely known as 'The New Tories'.
James,

Is there any significance in the fact that they are all Scotsmen or is it just coincidence? Two is coincidence, three is......

I think I will log out now and change my handle before the shot starts to fly!

Ron

James_C
30th March 2006, 15:56
Well it would probably explain the meanness with money, and thus the Foreign yards. But you'd think if they were going to close yards, it would be the English ones, and leave ours open!
Revenge for the Poll Tax, the Trident fiasco, closing the Pits and Ravenscraig et al...
I think I better join you in the bunker...

LOL

(Night)

King Ratt
6th April 2006, 17:12
Oh Dear! I hope I have not stirred the pot too much!

Jeff Egan
6th April 2006, 17:29
The EU is a con trick. Multi national companies run governments and when they want a cheaper work force they will expand east as they have done these last couple of years, Romania and Bulgaria are next, the British working man is the loser. I like to think of it as in tanker terms, years ago some of the Western European countries were like full tanks, some of the Eastern European countries were almost empty tanks, make all the Tanks common by opening a valve or two and the tanks will find their own level. Western Europe will lose out and eastern europe will gain. The real winners will be the Multi nationals who will end up with a hugh cheaper workforce.