28th December 2006, 14:05
In 1905, the following nine trawlers were sold from owners in the U.K. to owners in Stavanger Norway.
If this was a clean sale, or just a transfer of registration/management, I do not know.
Are there anyone at this forum that could provide me with further information about this, and/or photos of these trawlers.
Many thanks and best regards
29th December 2006, 21:44
Ref your item about trawlers, here is an extract from my database, but I can't help with reason for movement.
CAMPANIA. 104106. 1894/139. GY598. Edwards 487.
To Norway 03 r.n. Hvalen. To Holland 10 r.n. Maria Van Hattem.
CATALONIA. 108492. 1898/148. GY466. Edwards 570.
To Norway 04 r.n. Sobjornen. To Holland 12 r.n. Elie Cheneviere.
LUCIANA. 106731. 1894/194. H223. Edwards 491.
To Norway 04 Nordcap. To Holland 11 r.n. Julie Streiff.
PLOVER. 108000. 1898/181. GY174. Earles 428.
SANDO. 95718. 1889/170. GY220. Earles 328.
To Norway 04. r.n. Jansen. To Holland 10 r.n. Marie Guisel.
STROMO. 99679. 1892/142. GY546. Cochrane.
To Norway 04. To GY 06. FT 15/18. Sunk 24/4/32, 1 mile West Coningberg L.H.
VERBENA. 108457. 1897/152. GY269. Cochrane 176.
To Norway 04. To GY176/06. A/P 15/18. Scrapped February 1925.
VERONICA. 106691. 1896/150. GY175. Cochrane 165.
To Norway 04. r.n. Oburst.
ZENOBIA. 99712. 1893/161. GY544. Earles 378.
To Norway 04. r.n. Piscera. To GY277/07. Sk 25/8/14 German Torpedo Boat, North Sea, crew taken prisoners.
29th December 2006, 23:39
Built 1894 / Edwards Bros / Yard No 492 / Launched 12.11.94 / L 101.0 / B 20.5 / Depth 10.8 / 49 Hp / 149 G / 52 N / Engined - N E Marine Engineering Co Ltd Sld.
LUCANIA H332 - HULL Owned 1897 by E J Williams / 1901 Henry West
Sold Renamed 1904 SOLOVON - Norway
renamed 1911 JULIE STREIFF Holland / N.V Sheepsoxpl. Mij,"DeMarezaton" ( J,Polderman & F . C Breitenstein managers ) YMuiden Holland
30th December 2006, 11:57
Thank you to WLH and Chris.
31st December 2006, 16:53
I am afraid that I can only offer general comments.
A) There were a number of British trawlers who had their registry transferred abroad in order to fish in Scotlands Moray Firth, which was closed to British registered ships.
B), most of the trawlers registered in Stavanger come from Grimsby. However, what I have been able to see about their first owners, indicates that they were not owned by a single company in Britain. That is however not conclusive, as many british trawler owners maintained many registered companies. (E.g. Alec Black, who flagged a number of his trawlers out to Thorshavn the Faroe Islands, nominal property of a certain Christian Evensen)
C) Was there one, or many owners in Stavanger. Whether this was a genuine attempt by norwegians to start a trawler company, or just pro-forma out-flagging, can be deduced from the local owner.
In comparison, when a certain clerk in Esbjerg, Denmark (G.E. Forum) suddently became a large scale trawler owner, it is easy to deduce that he was fronting for British armateurs.
If many owners, some trawlers could be genuine purchases,and others example of fronting. Similarly, penniless clerks becoming large scale shipowerns = fronting. Well established money men = genuine purchases.
1st January 2007, 01:26
Good morning Birgir, and HAPPY NEW YEAR !!!
All the nine trawlers were registered on single ship companies managed by Christian & Nicolay Lindtner in Stavanger.
In those days the largest trawler owners in Stavanger were Ths. S. Falck and Chr. Bjelland & CO.
I got a feeling that your point of view in (C) could be the case.
1st January 2007, 16:28
Happy new year to you to Feistein.
I presume that your answer implies that the Lindners were fronting? Rather than money men moving into a new sector.
1st January 2007, 19:24
Good afternoon Birgir,