British Crusader 1954 + Fleetlist 1954

ruud
29th December 2006, 10:51
Ahoy,
Found this lovely looking tanker, the British Crusader 1954, as postcard, unfortunately with some spots on her,reverse side shows the Fleetlist at August 1954[160 vessels!].
Btw, also noticed that I haven't seen a lot that sailed on her, here on SN.

John_F
29th December 2006, 14:37
Ahoy,
Found this lovely looking tanker, the British Crusader 1954, as postcard, unfortunately with some spots on her,reverse side shows the Fleetlist at August 1954[160 vessels!].
Btw, also noticed that I haven't seen a lot that sailed on her, here on SN.
Lovely photo of her on her trials, Ruud.
She was launched on September 23rd, 1953 & completed on February 12th 1954 by Cammell Laird & Co of Birkenhead for BP. On December 4th 1957, she was transferred to the BP Clyde Tanker Co & renamed Clyde Crusader. On March 6th 1964 she was moved back to the main BP fleet & assumed her original name. She lasted till June 21st 1972 when she was sold for scrap, arriving at Kaohsiung on August 15th 1972. She was of 16,529 dwt & had a Burmeister & Waine engine.
I sailed on her sister, the Guardian as 3/0 in 1962/63.
Thanks for posting Ruud - have a very happy New Year.
Kind regards,
John.

ruud
29th December 2006, 17:06
Ahoy John,
Will post some more BP's in the next coming days, still have "some" left in the shoebox (Thumb) , here your Guardian.
Have a Very Happy New Year, and most of all Healthy!

Hamish Mackintosh
29th December 2006, 17:29
Question for you learned gentlemen, The list shows the "Splendour" being smaller than the "Reliance" however the numbers in my discharge book(I was on them both in that era)shows the "Splendour" as being a much larger ship, both in "net"tonnage and also in nhp, am I missing something?

Nigel Wing
29th December 2006, 17:34
ruud.
Found the fleet list extremely interesting,brings back many memories of ships I have worked on during drydockings, I particularly appreciate this BP era as most of these vessels were around during my time at Falmouth Docks, also good to see the T2's listed. I remember working on REDBANK, & FORT FREDERICA. in the late 1950's.
Best wishes.
Nigel

ruud
29th December 2006, 17:44
Question for you learned gentlemen, The list shows the "Splendour" being smaller than the "Reliance" however the numbers in my discharge book(I was on them both in that era)shows the "Splendour" as being a much larger ship, both in "net"tonnage and also in nhp, am I missing something?

Ahoy Hamish,
No you're not missing anything, well pointed, but as the offical card description of BTC we should believe them, isn't it?, I'm afraid that something is mixed up.

John_F
29th December 2006, 20:19
Ruud,
Thanks for the photo of the Guardian - equally impressive!
By the time I left BP in 1964 the fleet was down to about 120 vessels. The age of the VLCC had started.....
Many thanks once again Ruud.
Kind regards,
John.
P.S. I left BP to join a Dutch Company - C&A Brenninkmeijer & spent the rest of my (proper) working life with them. Fantastic company to work for & I saw more of the world with them than with BP.

John_F
29th December 2006, 20:35
Question for you learned gentlemen, The list shows the "Splendour" being smaller than the "Reliance" however the numbers in my discharge book(I was on them both in that era)shows the "Splendour" as being a much larger ship, both in "net"tonnage and also in nhp, am I missing something?
Hamish,


Have got the following statistics from 3 sources: Ruud's card, Norman Middlemiss (The British Tankers) & Harvey & Solly (BPTankers: A Group Fleet History.
British Spendour: Ruud 16,145 dwt - Middlemiss 16,823 dwt - Harvey & Solly 6500 nt.
British Reliance: Ruud 16,188 dwt - Middlemiss 16,687 dwt - Harvey & Solly 6490 nt.
Regret that I have no figures for nhp. Would be interested to see the figure in your Dis A book.
Kind regards,John F.

Hamish Mackintosh
30th December 2006, 17:13
Hamish,


Have got the following statistics from 3 sources: Ruud's card, Norman Middlemiss (The British Tankers) & Harvey & Solly (BPTankers: A Group Fleet History.
British Spendour: Ruud 16,145 dwt - Middlemiss 16,823 dwt - Harvey & Solly 6500 nt.
British Reliance: Ruud 16,188 dwt - Middlemiss 16,687 dwt - Harvey & Solly 6490 nt.
Regret that I have no figures for nhp. Would be interested to see the figure in your Dis A book.
Kind regards,John F.

Greetings John."Reliance" 752NHP and6489.66NET Tonnage."Splendour"1143NHPand 6500.27NET Tonnage

John_F
30th December 2006, 18:37
Greetings John."Reliance" 752NHP and6489.66NET Tonnage."Splendour"1143NHPand 6500.27NET Tonnage
Hamish,
Not much difference in tonnage but a huge difference in NHP. I'm not sure what NHP stands for - can you enlighten me? Is it something to do with engine power? Both vessels had Doxford engines with an output of 6400 BHP.
Kind regards,
John.

alastairjs
4th January 2007, 01:21
John, NHP = Nominal, sometimes Notional, horse power; the actual is always lower as the Nominal is a rather theoretical figure based on designed engine output and is calculated rather than measured under load. The tanker register quotes the Reliance's 6 cyl 2 S.C.S.A Doxford as producing 6,400 HP at 115 rpm and the Splendour's similar Doxford designed engine, (6cyl 2 S.C.S.A.) as producing the same HP, 6,400, also at 115 rpm. The only difference is that the Splendour's engine was built by the Wallsend Slipway and engineering Co. Ltd. I cannnot see how the NHP of the 2 engines could differ to such a degree but, in any event, the use of NHP was common to the late 19th and very early 20th centuary rather than in the 1950's. I assume this was because there was not the means readily available in those days to test the actual output of the engines but I'm sure one of our engineering collegues will provide a much more lucid/accurate explanation. The Tanker Register also quotes the DWTs of the two vessels as Reliance 16,188 and the Splendour as 16,145. I always go with the Tanker Register's figures in cases of doubt as their research is based pretty much upon the Lloyds or other Classification Societies data supplimented by additional information from the ships owners.
Regards,
Alastair

YORKYSPARX
4th January 2007, 08:48
Regarding the British Crusader, I have read that she had an explosion in the Adriatic in the seventies, does anyone have any details of this? Have not neen able to find any information on this, other than the remaining cargo was transferred to the Border Terrier.
Yorkysparx

John_F
4th January 2007, 10:20
Alastair,
Thanks very much for your comprehensive explanation. I don't understand why there should be such a large difference in NHP either. Maybe a mistake somewhere?
Heading back to London today from what has been a very wet Devon.
Kind regards,
John.

Hamish Mackintosh
8th January 2007, 21:36
I see I was pipped at the post on "Nominal"hp, but shall get in touch with a couple of old colleagues with regards to discharge book #s John Harvey who was third mate of the" Reliance" a couple of trips after me, and Ron Shaw who was second mate in the"splendour" around the funnel change era, just to see what their "blue book"ships stamps say

Geoff_E
8th January 2007, 23:03
Dredge the memory guys?

Was the "Crusader" the BP vessel that suffered an underwater explosion off Bangladesh/E. Pakistan in the early '70's?

If not, which BP Tanker was it, memories eludes me at the moment?

Happy New Year to one and All!

Graham Wallace
26th January 2007, 04:52
I have a list of 11 guys who sailed on the Crusader 1956/70, 2 R/O, 2 N/Apps , 1 Lecky and the rest Engineers. Not too sure if any are here on SN

Graham W

Gordon L Smeaton
26th January 2007, 10:53
Geoff E
Think the tanker in question was the Chancellor, she ended up with a bent crankshaft don't think she got repaired.

Regards

Gordon

HENNEGANOL
31st January 2007, 08:56
I was on the Reliance on two separate occasions and I notice that in my discharge book there are different figures given for NRT and HP.

1961 NRT = 6489.66, NHP = 752

1970 NRT = 6234.73, BHP (brake horse power) = 6400

Also I've noticed that at some time in the 1950's there was a change from NHP to BHP.

I have also found a postcard, similar to the one of the Crusader, showing the British Victory dated 1956. On the reverse is a list of Company owned ships totalling 153 with another 32 on order.

Once I suss out how to upload the details I will post them on this site.

Gerry Taylor

John Hunter
12th February 2007, 20:14
Gerry,
when were you on the Reliance...........I joined her at Mena 18/8/70 and left at Kharg 11/1/71..........I was 3/0.........maybe our paths crossed

John Hunter

HENNEGANOL
12th February 2007, 22:20
John,

Your post has acted as a catalyst and stirred my grey cells into action and suddenly the details and events of that trip are flooding back.

We joined together, I think that we met up in Victoria, you had just flown in from somewhere on being transferred. We both flew out to Mena and spent at least a day there before joining the ship.

Captain Bell, who was later relieved by Gerry Cornock, Ray Longhorn was Mate. My records show that we were at Kharg from the 6th to the 11th of January, which is when you paid off. We then went to Karachi and returned to Mena to load for Monte Video, where I paid off with Sparkie on 27th February.

We were not supposed to stop en route, but fate took a hand and we called off Mombassa to land one J/E with suspected appendicitis, I met him sometime later so he survived. Then on the way to the Cape the bottom literally fell out of the main engine oil cooler, so we had to call in at Capetown where the Old Man was paid off.

Which was rather ironic because he had joined the ship on her maiden voyage as 3rd Mate and paid off on the day of her 21st birthday as Master!

Then we stopped once more so that some leaking rivets in way of the cargo tanks could be caulked. All together quite an eventful seven month trip for me.

Best regards.

Gerry Taylor

John Hunter
14th February 2007, 19:23
(Thumb) Hi Gerry,
we must have met just before joing the ship at Mena...........I had flown in from Tokyo after transferring from the Architect.........I seem to remember going to an outdoor cinema the day before joing the ship. I remember it was a happy ship despite the bad conditions. Running from Jebbal Dhana to Karachi was no joke but at least we got to Sydney and thanks to breakdowns spending a couple of days in Newcastle NSW. I left the ship to get married.............at the tender age of 21! still married. Good to hear from you.

John Hunter

Indie Boy
10th May 2007, 15:18
ruud.
Found the fleet list extremely interesting,brings back many memories of ships I have worked on during drydockings, I particularly appreciate this BP era as most of these vessels were around during my time at Falmouth Docks, also good to see the T2's listed. I remember working on REDBANK, & FORT FREDERICA. in the late 1950's.
Best wishes.
Nigel

Hello Nigel,
I was on the RED BANK in 1957, and my brother in law was on the FORT FREDERICA.

bilbur
17th May 2007, 09:36
has anyone out there got a photo of the MV British Empress,1952-3-4, cant find a one on any sight.
thanks Bilbur

Pemcol
17th May 2007, 10:58
Reading the Fleet List, I saw the British Might listed, I was on her on what I believe was her last trip with an all white crew, as we were paying off the dock yard maties were already converting the toilets etc. It's strange but the Fleet List is the only mention of her anywhere, I was begining to think my memory was playing tricks on me. Frank.

freddythefrog
1st April 2008, 00:17
hello yorkiesparx
very little info around re the accident in adriatic, but i sailed as R/O on both the Crusader and Terrier but not during this time of the incident.

Graham Wallace, hello graham, yes i am one of the R/O's on yer list for crusader in about 1969/70. regards john(ftf)

captkenn
1st April 2008, 00:49
I have a list of 11 guys who sailed on the Crusader 1956/70, 2 R/O, 2 N/Apps , 1 Lecky and the rest Engineers. Not too sure if any are here on SNGraham W
I was 3rd Mate on both the Guardian and the Crusader on the Tyne at the time of their transfer to BP Clyde.

peter.r
1st April 2008, 16:18
When I started my first trip I heard that when BP were making a safty film the tanker they used caught fire and was damaged so badly that see was
declared a CTL, and broken up. True or is it a myth.
peter.

JamesM
2nd April 2008, 12:37
Guys, reference the Crusader incident, I'm sure when I was on the Maple(71ish) I sailed with the C/E(Jim Ferguson) and the 4/E(Bob Peart).The story they told was that they had just left Vishakapatnam, India when there was a violent explosion in the vicinity of the vessel.Nobody knew what had caused it.There was no damage to the hull,as far as they could tell, but in the engineroom the floor plates had been thrown all over which made it difficult to move around until they had been put back in place.
The main engine had been stopped, and once they could move around a general check of all machinery was carried out which revealed that most of the equipment that had cast-iron castings had cracked.They were obviously not going anywhere for a while so I think they were able to drop the pick and wait for further instructions from H.O.Fortunately nobody was hurt apart from being shaken up(to say the least)
A day or so later the company advised that an "expert" was being sent out to inspect the damage.
The expert duly arrived and turned out to be a specialist in Underwater Ordinance from the Admiralty.He made his inspections and then informed them that the damage was caused by a Type ??? Acoustic Mine which had detonated 200yds off their port quarter and the resulting shock-wave had done the damage to the various castings.
He also explained how the mine came to be there.
The story goes that a couple of years earlier the Pakistan Navy had asked the US if they could borrow a couple of their patrol craft and a submarine,for training purposes.The US duly obliged.
Sometime later Pakistan and India started kicking lumps out of each other.
The US then asked for the return of the vessels as they did not want their gear involved in any nastiness.The patrol craft were returned, but not the submarine.
A few months later an Indian ASW patrol detected the sub laying mines outside Vishak. I don't know what the outcome of that encounter was, but thats how the mine came to be there.
When hostilities had ceased India supposedly swept and cleared the area and announced the fact to all Navigational authorities.(You can just imagine the scene can't you, some Indian Naval flunkey, head wobbling from side-to-side, stating " Oh dear me yes, everything is clear").
I don't know how long it took to put things right but I think they were there for some time.Regards James.