The Last Doxford - Ships Nostalgia
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The Last Doxford

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  #1  
Old 31st May 2016, 12:46
alan dd alan dd is offline  
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The Last Doxford

The maasmondmaritime newsletter has pictures a couple of days ago of a Laker named Navi on the way to scrap, this was formerly the Algoma Navigator (originally Demeterton built in 1967 at Readheads, South Shields) and fitted with a Hawthorn Leslie Doxford engine, the last British built Doxford in regular sea service. The end of an era?

There is now apparently only one other ship, the Aban Ice, a drill ship (originally Jean Schneider built in 1959 at Ateliers et Chantiers de France) that has a Doxford engine, albeit this one was built in France by Provence. Apparently the engine is still in good condition although probably doesn’t do many running hours in a drill ship.
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Old 31st May 2016, 16:55
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Isn't there still one of the two Port boats converted to cruise ships still in service and fitted with twin Doxfords?
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Old 31st May 2016, 17:42
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As far as I know, the last one, Port Melbourne/Princess Danae had B&W opposed piston engines and was sold for scrap in March 2015, and scrapped in Aliaga, Turkey about August 2015. The Port Sydney/Princess Daphne was the one with Doxfords and went to scrap in Alang, India, in July 2014.
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Old 9th June 2016, 21:26
george e mitchell george e mitchell is offline  
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hi. this is not about the last Doxford engine. but about an engine. one of a kind .
Back in the 1950s The Aberdeen (Scotland) fishing fleet had over 300 steam trawlers. Whos fate was doomed by the invention of the diesel trawler. The engine works started to build an engine designed by Doxford for installation in trawlers.One engine had been built.tested then installed in one of the first diesel trawlers sailing out of Aberdeen. She was called the BEN LUI. a middle water trawler sometimes Iceland in the summer She was very successful as one of the top trawlers for about 15 or so years. The engine shop could only build one at a time. Steam trawlers were disappearing fast Replaced by the two Aberdeen shipyards They were being powered by Mirrlees, British Polar and Widdop. approx. 1200 bhp also diesel driven winches of 400 bhp. unheard of power for that time. They were all being produced en mass down south. I expect cost was a big concern. for the smallest DOXFORD ever built. A ONE OFF.
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Old 10th June 2016, 00:12
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I remember the weight of the old Doxford fuel valve.
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  #6  
Old 10th July 2016, 13:00
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3 Cyl Doxford

Quote:
Originally Posted by george e mitchell View Post
hi. this is not about the last Doxford engine. but about an engine. one of a kind .
Back in the 1950s The Aberdeen (Scotland) fishing fleet had over 300 steam trawlers. Whos fate was doomed by the invention of the diesel trawler. The engine works started to build an engine designed by Doxford for installation in trawlers.One engine had been built.tested then installed in one of the first diesel trawlers sailing out of Aberdeen. She was called the BEN LUI. a middle water trawler sometimes Iceland in the summer She was very successful as one of the top trawlers for about 15 or so years. The engine shop could only build one at a time. Steam trawlers were disappearing fast Replaced by the two Aberdeen shipyards They were being powered by Mirrlees, British Polar and Widdop. approx. 1200 bhp also diesel driven winches of 400 bhp. unheard of power for that time. They were all being produced en mass down south. I expect cost was a big concern. for the smallest DOXFORD ever built. A ONE OFF.
If you search 3 cyl Doxford or Lammermiur you will see some more info on the trawler engines
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Old 10th July 2016, 14:35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by george e mitchell View Post
hi. this is not about the last Doxford engine. but about an engine. one of a kind .
Back in the 1950s The Aberdeen (Scotland) fishing fleet had over 300 steam trawlers. Whos fate was doomed by the invention of the diesel trawler. The engine works started to build an engine designed by Doxford for installation in trawlers.One engine had been built.tested then installed in one of the first diesel trawlers sailing out of Aberdeen. She was called the BEN LUI. a middle water trawler sometimes Iceland in the summer She was very successful as one of the top trawlers for about 15 or so years. The engine shop could only build one at a time. Steam trawlers were disappearing fast Replaced by the two Aberdeen shipyards They were being powered by Mirrlees, British Polar and Widdop. approx. 1200 bhp also diesel driven winches of 400 bhp. unheard of power for that time. They were all being produced en mass down south. I expect cost was a big concern. for the smallest DOXFORD ever built. A ONE OFF.
The first stern trawler/factory ship FAIRTRY had a Lewis/Doxford 480SB4.
Worth a read "The Fairtry Experiment" by Jack Campbell the story of how the Rusky's stole the idea

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Old 10th July 2016, 16:58
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Upper Lakes Shipping had a converted tanker Evan Thomas Radcliffes Llanishen retro fitted with a KaMeWa driven by an 6 Cylinder LB Doxford.
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Old 10th July 2016, 18:25
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Originally Posted by funnelstays View Post
Upper Lakes Shipping had a converted tanker Evan Thomas Radcliffes Llanishen retro fitted with a KaMeWa driven by an 6 Cylinder LB Doxford.
LL.JPG
WK.JPG
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Old 10th July 2016, 19:29
Bill Morrison Bill Morrison is offline  
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Hi George. Post # 13. This one from a 1953 City of Aberdeen Official Handbook.
Bill
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  #11  
Old 12th July 2016, 23:17
george e mitchell george e mitchell is offline  
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hi Bill Morrison. as you suggested I read this site like a newspaper every day. I seen your posting about the Torquay Used to see her all the time when I was younger many years ago. Thank you for the picture of the 3 cyl doxford, built by John Lewis and sons. The First and last time I saw that engine was in 1956 when I was an apprentice. I thought it was huge at the time,compared to the steam engines I was used to. She was built in 1953 It was fitted to the Ben Lui.
She was built in 1953 length 166 ft. gross tonnage 473 bhp 1000 Doxford I always thought she had been scrapped in 1967. but seemingly she was converted into a research ship and fitted with a new engine same bhp.Then iin 2003 was converted into a luxury motor yacht
The other Lewis Doxford was the Fairtry. She was built in 1954. I never really thought of this one as a normal trawler Always knew it as a factory ship.
She was 280 feet long Gross Tons 2605 ..4 cyl doxford 1900 bhp.
Looking at the Doxford advert reminded me. on the last year of my apprentice ship was spent in the engine drawing office. I was teamed up with my journeyman draughtsman and our job was to get a new venture under weigh
That was John Lewis was going to build engines again. We were responsible for all the depts. got the correct drawings at the correct time etc. One new drawing I had to make for casting a new name plate. That was LEWIS A.K. DIESELS.The name lewis had to be scrolled like the Doxford ad. After several attempts it was finally accepted by the chief draughtsman. I Seen two of these engines being built and tested before I left to join Shaw Savill so I don't know how many they actually built. I see A,K DIESELS OF LOWSTOFT (the original builders ) closed down in 2015. A,K.(Alexander King}
The last Doxford I ever seen was the DORIC in Shaw Savill.Ionly did a UK coastal and a month or so in the shipyard. Extensive work was done. I Left the ship in London. I was told the ship only got as far as Capetown. Inspection showed both engines. had been destroyed. In the shipyard the engine cooling system had been cleaned with chemicals. in Capetown it was found the the swinging arms inside the crankcase must have started leaking bad.and ground away as the coolng water was like grinding paste mixing with the oil. damaging all the bearings. I don't know what happened after that but it was her last trip.
so I can say that this was MY LAST DOXFORD.
George Mitchell
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Old 3rd December 2016, 01:13
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The last doxford engine

Hello
The last Doxford engine ever built was a 760J4CR, engine number 477 for Canadian Pioneer, a laker built at Port Weller Drydock, Canada in 1980. The engine was built at Doxford Engine Works Sunderland. There were 94 Doxford J engines built after Demeterton. The last Doxford engine for a British built ship was that of the Badagry Plam, Jl Thompsons yard number 741 in 1979.
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  #13  
Old 3rd December 2016, 05:09
lewisholgerjorgensen lewisholgerjorgensen is offline  
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what about the 3 cylinder engines built for Ellerman's in the late 70's early 80's.
they had the trihedral flywheel with pneumatic piston arrangement to haul it into a start position, Ted Ranson's "brain wave" as he refused to have anything to with CPP after the Dilkara disaster.
they were an engine ahead of their time in many ways, CP fuel rail and mechanical injectors and the basic design would have adapted so well to modern needs for super long stroke, giving improved scavenging and camshaft-less engines.
old heads at design stage with daft ideas, the tri-part liner was a costly failure which a Junior eng. first trip could have told them it would not seal after dismantling and the course of higher rpm on the ill fated seahorse giving unacceptable liner wear.
I spent a lot of time with LB's and J types, the on-off overspeed trip on the J was scary in heavy weather, run like hell to re-set it before we broached.
was on the City of Newcastle in 73 when the sump turned to sludge, we had no idea why, but turned out to be microbial degregation.
opposed piston trunk engines, chieftan tank engine? the Deltic, and one I have fond memories of the Fairbanks-Morse 38D-8 1/8th which just kept going, this engine seemed to consider maintenenace was for cissies which was good I suppose as it was designed for USN Submarines, ***** changing a liner though trying to get the two cranks and two camshafts and all the timing gears in the right places.
the worst arrangement ever, the Dilkara, Allunga and Paralla, V18 Pielsticks.

recently was doing an delivery on a new eth tanker and was explaining opposed piston engines and others of strange arrangement, the Cammell Laird Fullagar, double acting engines with OP to a couple of engine trainees and they gave me a slight smile as if to say "aye alright Grandad whose p.ss.r who are you pulling".
festive greetings to all our readers.
Jorgie
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Old 3rd December 2016, 09:21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewisholgerjorgensen View Post
what about the 3 cylinder engines built for Ellerman's in the late 70's early 80's.
they had the trihedral flywheel with pneumatic piston arrangement to haul it into a start position, Ted Ranson's "brain wave" as he refused to have anything to with CPP after the Dilkara disaster.
they were an engine ahead of their time in many ways, CP fuel rail and mechanical injectors and the basic design would have adapted so well to modern needs for super long stroke, giving improved scavenging and camshaft-less engines.
old heads at design stage with daft ideas, the tri-part liner was a costly failure which a Junior eng. first trip could have told them it would not seal after dismantling and the course of higher rpm on the ill fated seahorse giving unacceptable liner wear.
I spent a lot of time with LB's and J types, the on-off overspeed trip on the J was scary in heavy weather, run like hell to re-set it before we broached.
was on the City of Newcastle in 73 when the sump turned to sludge, we had no idea why, but turned out to be microbial degregation.
opposed piston trunk engines, chieftan tank engine? the Deltic, and one I have fond memories of the Fairbanks-Morse 38D-8 1/8th which just kept going, this engine seemed to consider maintenenace was for cissies which was good I suppose as it was designed for USN Submarines, ***** changing a liner though trying to get the two cranks and two camshafts and all the timing gears in the right places.
the worst arrangement ever, the Dilkara, Allunga and Paralla, V18 Pielsticks.

recently was doing an delivery on a new eth tanker and was explaining opposed piston engines and others of strange arrangement, the Cammell Laird Fullagar, double acting engines with OP to a couple of engine trainees and they gave me a slight smile as if to say "aye alright Grandad whose p.ss.r who are you pulling".
festive greetings to all our readers.
Jorgie
'Fullagar' was not a "Double Banger"
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Old 3rd December 2016, 20:31
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Last Doxford engine?

The last Doxford ever built was engine number 477, a 760J4 for the Canadian Pioneer, a Laker built by Port Weller drydocks in 1980. The last British ship fitted withna Doxford engine was Badagry Palm built at J L Thompsons, North Sand yard in 1980. There were 94 doxford engines built after the Demerterton. The last I heard, the Canadian Pioneer was still in service as Pioneer, but I am uncertain if it is still in service.
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Old 3rd December 2016, 20:44
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Here is a picture of the 580JS3 engines fitted to the Ellerman ships One of these engines is preserved at The Beamish Open Air Museum in County Durham
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File Type: jpg JS 580 JS3 ISO.jpg (295.5 KB, 84 views)
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Old 3rd December 2016, 20:58
chadburn chadburn is online now  
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Having served on a Doxford I was curious about the Doxford held at Beamish Museum and went there to see if it was possible to have a look at the engine whilst the rest of the family had a look around the other exhibits. The engine is I believe held in the large sheds on the left hand side as you approach the 'Town' after numerous enquiries there appeared to be no one around who could give permission that day.
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Old 3rd December 2016, 21:19
lewisholgerjorgensen lewisholgerjorgensen is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A.D.FROST View Post
'Fullagar' was not a "Double Banger"
never said it was, read carefully.
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Old 3rd December 2016, 22:40
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Have a look at You Tube for:

1. Doxford Engine Room For footage of Princess Danae

2. Princess Daphne Final Voyage Sea Trials


Excellent. Note, the Doxfords in these two ships had different types. You would not think sistership would have different engines. One is Cross Head type and the other one Opposed type.

Good footage of both and sounds too!

I only sailed in one ship with a Doxford. SSS&A 's ICENIC. Once in a while I went below to enjoy the views!
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Old 3rd December 2016, 22:59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lewisholgerjorgensen View Post
what about the 3 cylinder engines built for Ellerman's in the late 70's early 80's.
they had the trihedral flywheel with pneumatic piston arrangement to haul it into a start position, Ted Ranson's "brain wave" as he refused to have anything to with CPP after the Dilkara disaster.
they were an engine ahead of their time in many ways, CP fuel rail and mechanical injectors and the basic design would have adapted so well to modern needs for super long stroke, giving improved scavenging and camshaft-less engines.
old heads at design stage with daft ideas, the tri-part liner was a costly failure which a Junior eng. first trip could have told them it would not seal after dismantling and the course of higher rpm on the ill fated seahorse giving unacceptable liner wear.
I spent a lot of time with LB's and J types, the on-off overspeed trip on the J was scary in heavy weather, run like hell to re-set it before we broached.
was on the City of Newcastle in 73 when the sump turned to sludge, we had no idea why, but turned out to be microbial degregation.
opposed piston trunk engines, chieftan tank engine? the Deltic, and one I have fond memories of the Fairbanks-Morse 38D-8 1/8th which just kept going, this engine seemed to consider maintenenace was for cissies which was good I suppose as it was designed for USN Submarines, ***** changing a liner though trying to get the two cranks and two camshafts and all the timing gears in the right places.
the worst arrangement ever, the Dilkara, Allunga and Paralla, V18 Pielsticks.

recently was doing an delivery on a new eth tanker and was explaining opposed piston engines and others of strange arrangement, the Cammell Laird Fullagar, double acting engines with OP to a couple of engine trainees and they gave me a slight smile as if to say "aye alright Grandad whose p.ss.r who are you pulling".
festive greetings to all our readers.
Jorgie
The engine in the Chieftain Tank was the Leyland L60, a multi fuel opposed piston, turbo charged, 6 cylinder motor. Multi fuel technology was first used in the Rover Meteor engine used in the Centurion, the predecessor to the Chieftain. The Meteor was a de-tuned Rolls Royce Merlin V12 engine developed by the Rover car company.
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Old 4th December 2016, 03:10
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I only sailed on a Doxford once ; a P type on the mv Lucigen . A nightmare .
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Old 4th December 2016, 03:29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dartskipper View Post
The engine in the Chieftain Tank was the Leyland L60, a multi fuel opposed piston, turbo charged, 6 cylinder motor. Multi fuel technology was first used in the Rover Meteor engine used in the Centurion, the predecessor to the Chieftain. The Meteor was a de-tuned Rolls Royce Merlin V12 engine developed by the Rover car company.
Not exactly Roy, the innards were not the same and as with the tests on MTB's with R.R. V12 they were found to be a bit weak to take severe punishment.
On the MTB/MGB they were replaced by the Packard V12 which is sometimes known as a Merlin but is a different engine, the only similarity is that it was also a V12.
Hubert Scott Paine the owner of British Power Boats managed to negotiate himself a commission from Packard on each engine sold.
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Old 4th December 2016, 10:13
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Thanks Chad for the details.

I agree that there has been lots of confusion over the V12 Packard marine engine used in MTB,s and the RR Merlin. Packard built Merlins under licence for aviation, which is where the confusion began. Also, there is a superficial similarity between the engines, although the marine engine is larger. According to some old RAF fitters I knew, the Packard Merlins had a more decorative finish and a really nice toolkit. One snag was that not all their parts were interchangeable with the Rolls Royce built engines.

If the memory is accurate, the Packard Marine V12 was developed for the United States Coastguard, around the time that the Hall Scott V12 had gone into production for the same service.

Not exactly Doxfords, I know, but engines are engines!
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Old 4th December 2016, 10:21
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Having served on a Doxford I was curious about the Doxford held at Beamish Museum and went there to see if it was possible to have a look at the engine whilst the rest of the family had a look around the other exhibits. The engine is I believe held in the large sheds on the left hand side as you approach the 'Town' after numerous enquiries there appeared to be no one around who could give permission that day.
There is some kind of a childish spate between Tyne and Wear Museums and Beamish about funding that has apparently meant people can't go into see it. it is in the Regional Museums Store where large exhibits are kept, the large sheds you referred to, adjacent to the model engineering shed. There is a really backward mindset in Museums hierarchy, where the public interest is the sacrificed on the altar of their own self interest. Take the working model of the Doxford 760J9 engine. It was built in Doxfords Engine works, by the tool room staff there. It is of a Sunderland designed and built engine, by a Sunderland Company whose origins can allegedly be traced back to the Knights of Willliam the conqueror who settled at Doxfordham in Northumberland. The model was in Sunderland Museum and loaned to what is now the Discovery Museum, then part of Tyne and Wear museums. When the museums were reorganized, the model mysteriously became the property of the discovery museum and will remain there. It belongs to and in Sunderland and is part of our local history and it should be back where it belongs. As for the 3 cylinder engine, I think it can be viewed by arrangement with the Doxford Engine Friends Association (DEFA). I will find out and post the details here when I do.
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Old 4th December 2016, 10:31
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I never had the pleasure of sailing with a Doxford but worked with many who had. Indeed they did talk of their derring-do as ones who had survived battle with William the Bastard.
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