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White Fleet - Santa Maria Manuela

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  #51  
Old 8th May 2010, 18:55
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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I totally agree with Werner
The pix are excellent
Wonder when they will start stripping Argus for her overhaul
jay
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  #52  
Old 2nd June 2010, 17:03
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TNeves TNeves is offline  
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Hi Guys!

I would like to show to you some pictures of Santa Maria Manuela and Argus:

http://www.roda-do-leme.com/2010/05/...o-publico.html

Also, you can see some of my photos from the last visit I made to the ship last weekend:

http://www.roda-do-leme.com/2010/06/...a-manuela.html

Hope you like it!
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  #53  
Old 11th June 2010, 23:17
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Excellent photos
You're very lucky to have been able to go aboard
Any idea when the restoration work will start on Argus?
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  #54  
Old 12th June 2010, 00:13
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Thanks Jay!

About the Argus, unfortunately I don't know the date, not even where she is going to be repaired.
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  #55  
Old 12th June 2010, 10:12
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Am guessing the work may start late summer/early autumn, once Pascoal can see cash flow coming in from SMM when she starts work again, giving people experience and pleasure

Was cruising around Creoula's website this morning and came across the association data-sheets for Argus, SMM and Creoula
For those not familiar with the White Fleet, all the vessels had datasheets, at least post-1945. I have copies of many
Duon't know why I didn't see them earlier as I have visitied that site so often
Think those should be posted on this site as they are now a matter of public record anyway. Interesting to see the minor differences between Argus (b in Netherlands) and her sisters (b side-by-side in Portugal)
Argus is very slighly shorter, a teeny bit narrower and a little bit deeper

It would be fantastic if, say in two or three years time, once Argus is reconditioned, if the three raced across the Atlantic to St John's

If that idea is not already being put about, I believe it should. That would be a fantastic re-enactment of the White Fleet ... say 2013 or 2014 to mark the 40th anniversary since the last campaign under sail

Cheers

Jay
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  #56  
Old 2nd August 2010, 23:11
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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SMM is en-route for the UK and this year's Tall Ship Race!
Due into Hartlepool at the end of this week/over the weekend
That's fantastic
Wonder if she ever put into a UK port during her years as a Grand Banker
Cheers to all
Jay
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  #57  
Old 3rd August 2010, 15:01
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As usual I was there to see this lovely ship leaving Aveiro's Port:

http://www.roda-do-leme.com/2010/08/...nglaterra.html

Here you can see some more photos:

http://marintimidades.blogspot.com/2...aredao-da.html

Regards!
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  #58  
Old 3rd August 2010, 17:10
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Fine pictures

A question: Has anybody noticed that SMM's sails are not equipped with reefing points? Compare this with Creoula which has two rows.

SMM had two rows as a Banker

So what happens if she gets caught out in Biscay/Western Approaches on this first cruise? Proceed under power only, one supposes

I don't even see eyelets let into the sails so that ties can easily be fitted

I guess she will be sorted out in due course!

Anyone any opinions?
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  #59  
Old 5th August 2010, 14:24
Tony Souza Tony Souza is offline  
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Name swap?

Gazela Primeiro visited New Bedford, MA the during July 29 through August 2, 2010. This was the first time in five years that Gazela sailed from her home in Philadelphia, PA out into Atlantic waters. You can read an account of the voyage by going to www.gazela.org.
While in New Bedford I met a former crewmember of Creoula. He served as third engineer in 1950-1952. Our discussion was in Portuguese which I have spoken very seldom since the age of 5. What I am certain of is that he told me the names of Creoula and Santa Maria Manuela were swapped before launching. That is to say the hull that was to be Creoula became SMM and the hull that was to be SMM became Creoula. The reason for this was that something didn't fit the one hull but fit the other. I was at a loss to understand what he was telling me and there was no one else available to translate. Does anyone know more of this interesting story?
Tony
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  #60  
Old 7th March 2011, 12:27
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Hi Guys!

New website lauched:

http://www.santamariamanuela.pt/
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  #61  
Old 24th April 2011, 15:07
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Brilliant news
The Argus is dry-docked at Ilhavo ... the big overhaul aimed at restoring the old lady to her former glory has started
Meanwhile SMM is now en-route to Canada ... destination Toronto and calling at St John's on the way back
Perhaps in a couple of years all three sisters including Creoula could do a Grand Banks re-enactment together and maybe even rendezvous with the former Gazela Primeiro in St John's
Now that would raise ghosts!!!
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  #62  
Old 26th April 2011, 17:56
crossjack crossjack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jay cresswell View Post
Brilliant news
The Argus is dry-docked at Ilhavo ... the big overhaul aimed at restoring the old lady to her former glory has started
Meanwhile SMM is now en-route to Canada ... destination Toronto and calling at St John's on the way back
Perhaps in a couple of years all three sisters including Creoula could do a Grand Banks re-enactment together and maybe even rendezvous with the former Gazela Primeiro in St John's
Now that would raise ghosts!!!

that's good news, I saw SMM at Sail Amsterdam, she does look very impressive.
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  #63  
Old 5th May 2011, 22:47
werner_ju werner_ju is offline  
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Hi Jay,

I think we still have to wait for some years until restoration work on POLYNESIA / ARGUS will commence. To me it looks like she was in drydock for necessary maintenance:
http://lmcshipsandthesea.blogspot.com/

Scroll down past the SANTA MARIA MANUELA.

More pictures of her at:
http://lmc-creoula.blogspot.com/

Anyhow, an importand step for diong the job one day.

Does anybody know if she is already renamed to her old name ARGUS ?

Best regards,
Werner
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  #64  
Old 10th May 2011, 23:33
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Werner
You are probably right ... just a decent clean below and checking of anodes for now, I guess

The Argus/Polynesia website has been moribund for many months, which doesn't help

I saw the photos you refer to ... that's what sparked my last post

Best
Jay
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  #65  
Old 8th February 2012, 19:20
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Folks
The SMM website has been silent since early December
I find that rather odd
Does anyone know whether owner/operator Pascoal is still in business?
Given the state of Portugal's economy, I'm becoming concerned
If Pascoal is in difficulties, then this would have an impact on SMM and the long-awaited refurbishment of Argus
Perhaps one of our Portuguese members can check things out?
Best
Jay
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  #66  
Old 8th February 2012, 20:21
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The economy is not very good, but its not the end of world, also

Pascoal is still in operation, and the ship as made some voyages, scientific ones for example, in cooperation with local universities. The website has the new calendar for 2012, so it's not that silent too.

Well, I don't know for sure, but maybe it's not the best time to repair Argus, the investment is very big. However, Argus was in drydock and had the hull painted.
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  #67  
Old 9th February 2012, 15:49
Tony Souza Tony Souza is offline  
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One of my Gazela shipmates has signed on for the SMM July trip from Lisboa to Cadiz as a trainee. She's a specialist in antique ship preservation.
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  #68  
Old 11th February 2012, 08:55
jay cresswell jay cresswell is offline  
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Guys
Thanks for the replies
I tracked last year's adventures including the late summer cetacean research voyage
Am glad to learn that Pascoal continues in business and that bookings are being taken for SMM's 2012 voyaging season, even though the website is dormant in terms of news
I have been wondering about signing up for a voyage in SMM, preferably the next time she heads for Newfoundland, though that may not be for some time, in which case I'll choose a different option
As for Argus, I saw the dry-docking pix on the Navios site at the time they were posted. At least her bottom is well coated and the fresh anodes fitted. As you say, reconditioning Argus will be expensive and the old girl will have to be patient, perhaps for another three years or so
Oh well!
Best wishes
Jay
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  #69  
Old 12th December 2012, 16:15
Reinaldo Delgado Reinaldo Delgado is offline
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Hi Jay Cresswell and other members interested in the history of the white fleet.

I am reporting again today regarding the barkentine "Gazela" which is surely by
now the oldiest sailing ship in the world, because in the meantime I have got evidencies that she was initially built as a schooner at Southampton on 1832, for Mr. William Mack Anthony who named her "Dolphin".
During a long process which placed her under the propriety of several owners, and different ports of registry (in Portugal she has been registed first at Ponta Delgada, Horta - both in the Azores and later at Lisbon).
Yes no doubt she is completing this year 180 years old!

The schooner "Dolphin" of 1832 had the following dimensions:
Lenght perpendiculars 26,70 mtrs and beam 6,60 mtrs
The schooner "Gaselle" of 1883 had the following dimensions:
Lenght perpendiculars 27,20 mtrs and beam 6,70 mtrs

The last document that I have got from her is a copy of the certificate of registry issued by the harbour master of the port of Lisbon, dated 15th April, 1939. In fact the certificate shows that the Gazela Primeiro was built in Portugal (place not disclosed) on 1883 and that she was rebuilt at Setubal on 1900.

However as I have written recently in my blog, I have also the register of the entrances of the "Gaselle" in the port of Horta, showing a different history. The ship had been there on the 17th March 1883 coming from Lisbon after a 11 days passage, loaded with general cargo. The ship had 7 crewmembers on board and was also transporting 180 passengers (!). Previous dimensions and
tonnages unchanged.
The ship has returned to the port of Horta on the 11th September 1883, coming from the island of Flores and the fishing, with 95 barrels of whale oil. At the occasion the ship sailed with 23 crewmembers and 2 passangers, during a voyage that lasted 94 days. Previous dimensions and tonnages were then altered to the values of 1883.
If we can imagine that the repair at Cacilhas (Lisbon) commenced on the 11th April 1883 and that the ship arrived at Horta on the 11th September that same year the time elapsed correspond exactly to 153 days less 94 days used during the trip until Horta remain exactly 2 months therefore not enough time to built a ship like her those days.
At last I would like to point out that the very first campaign the Gaselle has done to the banks was in 1897.

Very best regards to you all and a very merry x-mas,
Reinaldo Delgado
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