[John Campbell]

According to the "Daily Telegraph"today

Pim de Lange, Stena Line's director for the North Sea, said potential seamen were "not fit for the job".

Union leaders have been in dispute over conditions of pay and service and Stena's use of Filipinos working at Harwich, Essex

Michael Wake: the charity chief, the wasted millions and the women employeesBut Mr de Lange told a local newspaper that the company was struggling to find young, fit people willing to work at sea.

The comments came after he was recently quoted in a Dutch newspaper saying British workers were "quite fat and covered in tattoos" although he claims his words were taken out of context.

He said: "You do not get young, fit people wanting these jobs ~ people need to be fit for these jobs ~ that is the bad thing about it.

"The main thing is that fit people don't want to apply for the jobs.

"Young people do not want to go to sea any more ~ they don't want to be away from home."

Mr de Lange said he had now emailed his British workforce to assure them that he had not been criticising them.

He spoke as the RMT balloted for strike action over the use of Filipino crew on the new superferry, the Stena Britannica.

Former Harwich mayor Les Double, a town, district and county councillor, said he had been outraged by Mr de Lange's comments about fat workers.

Cllr Double said: "I think he needs to apologise. I guess he did not think it would get back to England."

Stena Line is set to launch the Britannica in the next few weeks.

[Pat Kennedy]

"quite fat and covered in tattoos"
No change there then!
Pat

[Thats another Story]

pay peanuts and what do you get?

[Hawkeye]

As you can imagine, the s*** did hit the fan over this. And he has since apologised to us.
The story was also in Lloyd's List (so we were told, I didn't actually see it), but it was on the front page of the local paper for Harwich.
Most of the work force are now looking at tattoo books and thinking about what to have, just as a wind up.
For the record, I only scored half out of three - I'm not lazy, don't have tattoos, but I do have a few extra pounds, but not that much.

[Klaatu83]

I wouldn't comment on the tattoo aspect. however, I believe it's true that young people aren't interested in going to sea anymore, and that the reason has a lot more to do with the fact that the work is too hard than it has with the fact that they're away from home. Hungry young men from third-world countries are more willing to put up with long hours and hard work than well-fed young men from the more developed countries.

[Satanic Mechanic]

Its not a damning comment at all - it is just simply stating the fact that 'no one wants to go to sea anymore'. Its not just the UK its everywhere in the world, the shortage of people is amazing.

Lets be honest why would you want to go to sea now. Long hours in horrible conditions, few ports, no shore leave, few people on board, paperwork that is verging on mountainous, venomous legislation etc etc. Fact is, the life at sea today is completely pants. Its nothing to do with hard work its the fact that it is a totally carp way of life now. I know a lot of you are retired now or have been away for a while but you have to believe me when I say that life on board a standard merchant ship now can make prison look like a pleasant option, no social life, no bar/movies/social nights. Its not like world travel is an enticement - I can get to Oz and back for a reasonable price nowadays.

The age of the British seaman is well and truly over and has been for along time. Let the Filipino's have their day, they are great workers, highly skilled and for the moment willing to put up with the conditions(though believe me -that is changing)

[DURANGO]

Originally Posted by Satanic Mechanic

Its not a damning comment at all - it is just simply stating the fact that 'no one wants to go to sea anymore'. Its not just the UK its everywhere in the world, the shortage of people is amazing.

Lets be honest why would you want to go to sea now. Long hours in horrible conditions, few ports, no shore leave, few people on board, paperwork that is verging on mountainous, venomous legislation etc etc. Fact is, the life at sea today is completely pants. Its nothing to do with hard work its the fact that it is a totally carp way of life now. I know a lot of you are retired now or have been away for a while but you have to believe me when I say that life on board a standard merchant ship now can make prison look like a pleasant option, no social life, no bar/movies/social nights. Its not like world travel is an enticement - I can get to Oz and back for a reasonable price nowadays.

The age of the British seaman is well and truly over and has been for along time. Let the Filipino's have their day, they are great workers, highly skilled and for the moment willing to put up with the conditions(though believe me -that is changing)

I reckon anyone of us who had been to sea as I was in the late 50,s and through the 60,s would wonder if they had landed on another planet ,what I hear is enough for me no thanks .

[wantok]

It is interesting hearing the different perspectives in regards to the lack of young people wanting to go to sea.

The opposite is the case in Australia.

It is almost impossible for a young person to secure a cadetship as a deck or engineering officer in Australia despite, as an island, being highly dependant on sea freight for the export and import of most of our goods.

Virtually all of the vessels trading to and from Australia are foreign owned and crewed with no career opportunities for young Australians wishing to spend a life at sea. Unfortuinately many of these companies are UK and Eurpean owned and managed and offer jobs to their own nationals only.

The boom sector, vessels working in oil & gas only seems to want to "poach" qualified officers with none of them offering any opportunities at cadet level.

My 20 Year old son has just completed his pre sea training at the Australian Maritime College and is finding the lack of cadetship opportunity depressing to say the least.

It was certainly a lot easier in my day.

[Thats another Story]

turn around for box boats is less than 24 hours the crew has hardly or no shore leave so its just a job now the excitement of seeing new places and people has been taken out of being a seaman. IMHO john

[sidsal]

Wantok: Sorry to hear of your son's frustrations. My opinion is that a creer in shipping these days must be very boring indeed except in cruise ships where you, at least get to see some interesting places. Has he tried P&O etc.
If I were setting out again I would get qualified and go into the big private yacht business. There are lots of megabuck people who have these big boats and who pay big wages . My nephew went as a deckhand and worked his way up until he commanded superyachts owned by rich Italians like Berlusconi and had a great life sailing to exotic places and lying for weeksa in great places. There are firms which recruit crews. I was in NZ in the 80's refitting a 250 ton ketch and we hired 3 NZ people - 2 lads and a girl. Worth investigating I would say !

[gordy]

In my paper it was reported that the Philipino crew were to be paid £2.80/hr.
Anybody else heard this?

[Klaatu83]

Originally Posted by JOHN PRUDEN

turn around for box boats is less than 24 hours the crew has hardly or no shore leave so its just a job now the excitement of seeing new places and people has been taken out of being a seaman. IMHO john

The container ships I was on usually spent no more than 8-12 hours in port, generally in places so remote that there was no possibility of going ashore anyway. Modern container terminals require a great deal of real estate, which means they're usually constructed far from urban areas. The result is that one container terminal is pretty much the same as another, so it scarcely makes any difference whether you're in Felixstowe, Salalah, Singapore, or Jacksonville.

Tankers aren't any better. Nobody wants a tanker terminal in their backyard, so they're remote from downtown areas. More often than not they consist of no more than a chiksan in the middle of nowhere. Many are situated in offshore terminals, some of which are so remote that Immigration doesn't even bother clearing the ships' crews. I have personally experienced both those types.

[taxi-man]

Gentlemen, on a lighter note, in Holyhead the rumour is, that Pim was talking about the women ! ! ! !

[Charlie Stitt]

If there was to be another Falklands war, would the foreign crews be happy to go there on a British ship, like British crews did on the Europic Ferry etc? I think it absurd, ferries operating between two british ports, like Larne/Cairnryan, Larne/Fleetwood etc etc be foreign crewed, the local lads who once worked these ships had no choice, paid off and replaced with foreigners.

[Burned Toast]

Originally Posted by gordy

In my paper it was reported that the Philipino crew were to be paid £2.80/hr.
Anybody else heard this?

A little less and not just Filipino crews

[Thats another Story]

British merchant seamen. it shows you not only had a discharge number but you were just a number loyalty meant nothing whatever rank you were? all down to greed by the company.

[J.Dowd]

Originally Posted by Satanic Mechanic

Its not a damning comment at all - it is just simply stating the fact that 'no one wants to go to sea anymore'. Its not just the UK its everywhere in the world, the shortage of people is amazing.

Lets be honest why would you want to go to sea now. Long hours in horrible conditions, few ports, no shore leave, few people on board, paperwork that is verging on mountainous, venomous legislation etc etc. Fact is, the life at sea today is completely pants. Its nothing to do with hard work its the fact that it is a totally carp way of life now. I know a lot of you are retired now or have been away for a while but you have to believe me when I say that life on board a standard merchant ship now can make prison look like a pleasant option, no social life, no bar/movies/social nights. Its not like world travel is an enticement - I can get to Oz and back for a reasonable price nowadays.

The age of the British seaman is well and truly over and has been for along time. Let the Filipino's have their day, they are great workers, highly skilled and for the moment willing to put up with the conditions(though believe me -that is changing)

I think this is a worhwhile post and sits well alongside my previous on the Red Ensign.

[muldonaich]

Originally Posted by JOHN PRUDEN

British merchant seamen. it shows you not only had a discharge number but you were just a number loyalty meant nothing whatever rank you were? all down to greed by the company.

could not agree with you more john

[J.Dowd]

Originally Posted by JOHN PRUDEN

British merchant seamen. it shows you not only had a discharge number but you were just a number loyalty meant nothing whatever rank you were? all down to greed by the company.

Survival is the word.

[oldman 80]

Why would any informed young person want to go to sea in this day and age ?
The situation is tragic to say the least.
When I was at sea in the UK fleets - the young people involved at sea could only be described without any doubt, and virtually without exception, the cream of the nation.
They were badly let down - unforgiveably so.
Thanks Margaret T.

[MARINEJOCKY]

Blame Maggie as usual, nothing to do with the unions and their high wage demands.

Here we go again, same old nonsense

[trotterdotpom]

Why not blame her? She started the rot.

John T

[Satanic Mechanic]

British Officers - plenty jobs. Crew - forget it

and as much as I would hand Maggie T to satan personally, this time it was completely self inflicted, they priced themselves out of the market.

Filipinos remain my favourite crew by a very very long way. They dont get paid peanuts and you dont get monkeys

[Shipbuilder]

I remember in the mid 70s, the B & C sea staff took a voluntary pay cut in order to ensure that the company would go on. In less than a year, they began selling the ships off!

I certainly would not want to go to sea if I was leaving school today. Don't even like the look of the present generation "ships!"

For those clever enough to qualify with the modern day degrees and diplomas, especially in electronics, why go to sea anyway in 2012?

Bob

[Satanic Mechanic]

well my young cousin just started his cadetship - with cruise ships - for a young lad I can think of few better places

I suppose though that there is a bit of unfair comparison that goes on, you lot could compare to my day and shake your heads , I can look at today and shake my head, but the truth is that it is their day and if they can still get a kick out of it then all power to them. But the attractions for me are no more and in time this generation will hand over to the next shaking their heads at what has become of the job - plus ca change plus c'est la meme chose