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Manchester Ship Canal

37K views 81 replies 46 participants last post by  Ron Stringer 
#1 ·
Recently took my grandson to the Lowry gallery in Salford Quays. Among other exhibitions was one relating to the MSC.

It reminded me that as an apprentice with BP Tanker Co in 1959 (British Strength) I had traversed the canal to the Cadishead fuel depot to discharged heavy fuel oil loaded at Old Kilpatrick. I had never stepped and dropped masts before and it was a good lesson learned but true to life...never a single question at ticket exams and never repeated.
Question asked was how did we get out again?
I don't remember going through the Barton Locks so those of you in the know please enlighten me

Ron
 
#34 ·
I joined the s.s. Pacific Northwest as a deck apprentice in Salford one dark and rainy night in 1956. I believe she was built to just transit the canal. In some lock chambers, we had about 3" clearance each side so used 4 x 4 lumber on bridles to span the frames of the ship, all along each side. As we went into the chamber the 4" wood would be compressed to 3". Some of these fenders would break apart, some smoke from the heat generated by the friction, and some even catch fire. Needless to say, no steering needed, just dead slow ahead. Then the rush was on to re-rig serviceable fenders for the next lock. Was down and up the canal for the next 2 years or so. Only one overnight at Runcorn, close to the transporter bridge. Hot nightclub there, but can't remember the name. Never did see Mr. & Mrs. Ramsbotham with Albert their son trying to negotiate on the ferry fare of tuppence per person per trip, or part of per trip. I still remember watching the canal in Salford on a hot summer's day glubbing big fould smelling bubbles from the deep.
 
#36 ·
Thanks, everyone. Over on another thread I've just found the statement that ARMAGH and her sister ship NORTHUMBERLAND shared the honour of being the largest vessels ever to transit the entire length of the Manchester Ship Canal.
http://www.shipsnostalgia.com/showthread.php?t=13136
Elsewhere I've found that NORTHUMBERLAND's figures were: length 550' overall, 63' beam, 11,559 tons weight.
I'm wondering how this compares with the ships mentioned above: CARCHESTER, PACIFIC NORTHWEST and the Bowater ships.
Bart
 
#40 ·
Can't tell you the numbers on the beam of the Pacific Northwest, but memory recalls 60+ feet. She was only about 515 - 520 feet in length though, so it seems the "Northumberland" fits the bill for biggest. The "Pacific No-rest" was just a little under 10,000 GRT if I remember rightly. Needless to say we were in a very light loading condition for both up and down the canal. She drew somewhere around 30 ft when down to he marks. (When leaving Glasgow with 120,000 cases of whisky aboard plus a whole bunch of other stuff like Rolls Royces, steel plate, nails, cotton waste, etc.)
 
#37 ·
Sailed up and down the M.S.C. a few times on the Ardetta and the Dotrell unforunatley it was in summer months .oh my God I never got over the stink ,one time the whole canal lit up it was like watching methylated spirits being ignited,the only good thing was at Salford docks the famous Clewes Hotel one end and the beautifull River Mersey at the other,the last time I ventured onto it was on my narrow boat Chemainus named after a realy lovely port on Vancouver Island,on another ship I was on the Novelist we loaded drums of waste from Octel that we dumped over the side around Las Palmas later I worked at Octel as a rigger a truly awful place toxic as hell never saw a rat or even a seagull that was daft enough to go there.
 
#38 ·
Tom,
I was tied up at Octel once on a Blue Funnel ship, the Theseus, discharging lead ingots. We used to walk through the plant to go for a pint in Ellesmere Port every evening and what an eerie, strange place that was. They used to take your tobacco and matches off you before you could go ashore, or re-enter the plant, and warn you to stay well clear of certain reactors which contained a substance which could apparently kill an elephant at 200 yards.
A friend of mine worked in there and every few months was given a few weeks sick leave to get the lead out of his system, his gums used to turn blue!
He died in his fifties of lead poisoning.
Regards,
Pat
 
#39 ·
As I've mentioned earlier in this thread, the smell of the canal in mid-summer was like Chanel No.5 to me, but imagine what it was like if you were on the sludge vessel "Mancunium" loading sewage (industrial waste !!) at Davyhulme. Two aromas for the price of one. Did this for a year. Classic !!
 
#41 ·
Lloyd's Register of Ships has Pacific Northwest as :-
Length Overall 501 ft - 2 in. Breadth Extreme (beam) 63 ft - 5 in.
The same dimensions are given for Pacific Reliance, Envoy and Stronghold.
The same dimension for beam at 63 ft - 5 inches is also listed for Pacific Fortune and Unity with a slightly less Length Overall of 498 ft - 6 in.
Ted Gray's book "A Hundred Years of the Manchester Ship Canal" gives the width of the canal locks as 65 feet and Furness Withy's Pacific Class were the widest vessels to negotiate the locks beyond the 80 feet Eastham Lock.
In 1954 Ropner's Swiftpool at 63 ft - 7 in. became the widest to transit the canal until surpassed in 1966 by Strick's Serbistan at 63 ft - 10 in. - I guess all give or take a coat of paint or three !
 
#42 · (Edited)
A lot of folk mention the smell.

Early 70's HMS Dundas or was it the Hardy? (Having a Craft Moment) We sailed from Portland with a Sargent Rowe and 6 Manchester Police cadets for a over night passage to you guessed Manchester. We had commenced our transist some time during the night. I awoke to Call the Hands and after morning ablutions stated to make my way to the galley to collect my breakfast. This required going to the upper deck where Sargent Rowe was stood. "Sorry about the smell boys, not the best approach to Manchester." said he.

"Can't smell a thing Sarge" said I, "I've just come out of the stokers mess mayhap I should be apologising to you"

Berthed in Trafford Wharf for four days and my introduction to Yattes Wine Lodge.

I nearly forgot we had to take the top part of the mast off prior to leaving Portland so that we could get under the Barton Bridge. Well she was a light weight single engined war canoe.
 
#46 ·
There were thousands of names painted on that crane berth Tom, not just on the quay wall, but all over the buildings and the crasne and the rear wall. I added mine when on the Tactician.
regards,
Pat
 
#45 ·
Yes, Tom, I remember it well, but not with affection !! I was down aft as second mate on the Harrison vessel "Dalesman", preparing to leave the crane berth after having used the crane, The after tug was pulling the stern off the quay, but, unfortunately, we still had a stern rope made fast. As quick aswe were trying to slack it off, it was getting tight again. The result was a parted stern rope and a broken femur for me landing me in hospital for 4 months and off work for eleven months. This happened on Dec.22nd !!!
 
#47 ·
The ferry accident was at Thelwall,I lived nearby at Grappenhall,locally it was known as the Penny Ferry.The explosion killed the ferryman amongst others,it often smelt odd down there,mind you it was also a notorious courting spot so we must have been determined to use it!
 
#48 ·
This site revives so many forotten memories.Durin one of those romanticall related spells ashore I was working at Fords in Halewood and my lift from home used to pick me up at Latchford.It was dark,cold and miserable as I stood waiting,then like a vision a Manchester Liner cruised by,her saloon brightly lit and being laid up by white jacketed stewards.It looked so warm and cosy I thought of all the lads getting ready to go home on leave and I said to myself`I`m going back`and I did.
 
#50 ·
In the 80's my sister lived on the Hill in Frodsham and when I used to visit her I would often wonder what it would be like to go up the MSC. Forward to the 90's and the MSC becomes almost my 2nd home, trotting up as far as Cadishead with Stolt's.
I found the whole canal an experience not to be forgotten and every trip found out more about what a fantastic piece of engineering it was. I had Latvian Officers under me and a number of them too became quite interested in the Canal and its history.
Sure, it was a long drag from the Bar all the way up to Cadishead, especially as the Liverpool pilots seemed to insist on boarding far too early at the Bar so you would have to creep up the Mersey and dodge around off the Bar at Eastham channel, etc. But the MSC pilots with their knowledge and friendliness made up for it and the passage from Eastham onwards was invariably a pleasure.
rgds
Capt. John Arton (ret'd)
 
#51 ·
I occasionally travelled up the ship canal on my summer holidays with my father on the Denholms ore carriers.

We berthed at Irlam, if I remember correctly - and at the age of 8, had never seen rows and rows of red brick terraced houses before. The biggest surprise was getting fish and chips locally........

fish with skin attached! Mushy peas! - couldn't understand that one, especially... :(

I remember kids used to drop bricks down the funnel though - from the bridges :(

Al :)
 
#52 ·
Many moons ago I paid off in Liverpool. Had a good bevy with my old shipmates in a bar in Lime St station. I then caught a train for Matlock Bath to visit my brother. With all the beer in me I fell asleep on the train. Some time later I woke up and there was a ship in the the middle of a field behind a hedge!!!!!!!! I thought I had the D.T.s.
 
#53 ·
Hi,
The skipper of the Tacoma then was John Fairclough of Liverpool and his son - also John Fairclough, was mate. I'd left about 6 months or so before the explosion and tragic fatalities. Both John's were nice fellas and had been good old hands to me (13yr old deck boy) but they argued a lot (as families do!) and would put me between them. I'd be wearing out the haliard with hoisting the house flag up and down like a *****s drawers; "Who told you to hoist that flag?" says the Mate, "The skipper" says I. "Take it down" says the Mate. "Why's that flag not up?" says the skipper..and on..and on.....

Robert Setz
 
#54 ·
#50

Hi, John,

Getting under way early for Eastham was as much an irritation for Liverpool pilots as for anybody else. The need arose from the limited time available for the docking of largish ships at Eastham (i.e. from high-water until the ebb had fallen to a point where there was insufficient UKC in Eastham Channel). Obviously this was variable on draught, but it was rarely more than about two and a half hours. If several draught-restricted ships were due to dock within that period it was essential not only that the deepest went first, but also that the lesser-draughted ships, in strict turn, were queuing ship-to-ship for the lock, stemming the ebb-tide as closely as possible, in order that no time was then lost.

At less busy times, of course, the problem was less acute; but nobody wasted time in Eastham Channel by choice. And nobody would dare delay the man behind him. Timing was the key to the whole thing.

Hope this might explain it a bit.
 
#55 ·
Barry,

Having just finished and enjoyed reading Nick Robin's recent book "The Ships that came to Manchester", I needed to pick up on a few points, so not only searched the Forum for this thread, but also looked back in my own records. Between 1972 and 1979 I made 35 return transits of the canal, generally all the way to Esso at ModeWheel, as 2/0 up to Master, so this book brought back a lot of memories.

Your post #54 brought back one of these in sharp focus: It was on the Esso Purfleet fully loaded inward and fourth ship on the tide inside the bar on the Eastham Channel with our UKC disappearing at an alarming rate. The Mersey Pilot (If I recall correctly it was John Tebay) and I, as Master, got so concerned when it reduced to 1 foot that we steamed the vessel into QEII lock and waited for the next tide! Caused quite a kurfuffle afterwards and a change in the regulations about vessels crossing Eastham bar into the Channel.

Nick Robin's book quotes the Strick vessel "Serbistan" as the largest to transit the whole canal on a regular basis, she had a beam of 63' 10". I had been led to believe it was the "Carchester", which had the largest DWT at 14625. But apparently these were all beaten by the 'Northumberland' at LOA 550' Beam 63' although her DWT was only 11559. Whichever was really the largest, it was always a grind if one of these monsters was on the tide for Manchester as we would then be stuck with a 12 hour transit to ModeWheel.

Only disappointing thing about Nick Robin's book was his failure to include a chapter about the Pilots and Helmsmen. They could have added a lot more colour to what really is a chronology of facts, clearly elicited from company and MSC records.

Happy days..... Chris
 
#59 ·
In the immediate post war era we used to got to Stanlow to discharge (T2 tankers mainly)> we would normally have called at Avonmouth ( from Aruba usually) to lighten the draft. We used to play tricks in order to satay overnight as no tankers traversed at night. Typical was when pilot cme aboard and master urged us to hurry up and finish the disharge. By craftily cracking open a few vales we would send the oil round and round the ship with little going ashore. A compliant shore chap would loose the disc showing rate of discharge.
In the 60's or 70's I had gone to Trafford wharf to view som timber baulks from some silos which were being demolished and saw a Clan boat depart.. I believe I saw the very last ship depart Manchester docks.
Years ago a little vessel started 2 day cruises up the Weaver from Runcorn and it amused me. I pictured being asked if we were going on a cruise this year and replying in the affirmative. On being asked we were going from Southampton I would say - No- Runcorn. And on being asked if we would call at some exotic ports I would say - Yes - Northwich !!
In ww2 I sailed with a chap who knew loads of sea ditties and one long one was about a young lad going to sea on his first voyage with his mother dead worried. It turned out he was going up the ship canal to Manchester. I can only remember snippets -
"And we set sail from Walton Jail
Along the ship canal
When we got up to Runcorn Bridge
The rain began to snow
The wind blew out the candle light
And the engines wouldn't go
I have tried unsuccessfully to get the whole words as it was a corker
 
#60 ·
#59

There is another brilliant ditty somewhere about putting out to sea from Manchester, the words of which sadly escape me - The Manchester Mariner/Navigator or something similar, largely invoking the perils of the sea between Mode Wheel and Latchford, as Stanley Holloway might have expressed them. Another corker!
 
#61 ·
Pat Kennedy said:
Its the bean counters at work again Tom, and no doubt they will get their way eventually.
I wasn't in the MN long enough to grow old and rail at beancounters in the Merch but we certainly did in civil aviation.
The reality is that if the £ numbers don't add up you're out of business so the beancounters do have a point.
I'm just in from pub where I was chatting to an Easy Jet pilot and we were discussing the business models of Ryan Air and Easy Jet. It's a dog eat dog jungle BUT, esp in this internet world of rapid communication, if you piss off your customers enough you are history. At the moment my money would be on Easy but their pilots work hard.
If you have a job which buys you a house and, more or less, keeps 'er happy then you are well ahead of the game.
Bit under the affluence of incohol so usual caveats apply (POP)
 
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