WW2 Tankers North Alantic - Page 15 - Ships Nostalgia
12:36

Welcome
Welcome!Welcome to Ships Nostalgia, the world's greatest online community for people worldwide with an interest in ships and shipping. Whether you are crew, ex-crew, ship enthusiasts or cruisers, this is the forum for you. And what's more, it's completely FREE.

Click here to go to the forums home page and find out more.
Click here to join.
Log in
User Name Password

WW2 Tankers North Alantic

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #351  
Old 9th August 2012, 11:04
stan mayes stan mayes is offline  
Senior Member
Active: 1936 - 1986
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 9,354
Hi Hugh and Ken,
Checking the movements of John R.Park prior to the Normandy invasion I find she left New York on 12th April 1944 in convoy HX 287 for the UK.
Arrived Swansea on 26th April -on 4th May sailed for Glasgow arriving 6th May.
Later to the Solent to take part in the normandy .Operations..
By coincidence I was in same convoy HX 287 from New York.. I was in the tanker Neritina and we had loaded petrol and diesel oil at Curacao then to New York for convoy to UK...We discharged cargo at Dublin then to Liverpool to pay off and I later joined Dolabella for the invasion.
So I had definitely seen John R.Park as we were in same convoy for ten days..
The now preserved Liberty ship Jeremiah O'Brien was also in that convoy.
Regards to you both,
Stan
Reply With Quote
  #352  
Old 9th August 2012, 11:32
Binnacle's Avatar
Binnacle Binnacle is offline  
Senior Member
Department: Deck
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,927
Quote:
Originally Posted by Klaatu83 View Post
American seamen who were captured by the enemy were in the same predicament. Legally, they were not military personnel, so they were not subject to the Geneva Convention rules for the treatment of POWs. If they managed to survive long enough to be released, they were not repatriated home, as military POWs were. They had to find a vacant berth on a merchant ship and work their way home.
Klaatus83
American merchant seamen as you state were not military personnel, however they were covered by the 1929 Geneva Convention. I was interested enough to find out how the the USA treated the German crew of the Columbus that I sent away for a book written by one of the crew, the situation interested me because the ship was scuttled in International waters, crew picked by a neutral man of war and landed as DGS in neutral America. Google "ss Columbus" if you are interested in how the crew were treated. Unfortunately for them Hitler's declaration of war against the US changed their status. .

Last edited by Binnacle; 9th August 2012 at 11:46..
Reply With Quote
  #353  
Old 9th August 2012, 16:27
kkopacki kkopacki is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2
Thanks for the information.

My Granddad crossed from England to France(Utah Beach) on 3 October 44 and was stuck on it until the 10th because of bad weather.


Ken
Reply With Quote
  #354  
Old 9th August 2012, 20:11
stan mayes stan mayes is offline  
Senior Member
Active: 1936 - 1986
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 9,354
From Arnold Hague's Convoyweb - John R.Park made 27 voyages from Southampton to the beachheads from 10th June 44 to 20th March 1945 -
A heroic ship!!
She was returning to the US when she was torpedoed and sunk by U 1195 off Lands End - U 1195 was a new U boat.
On 6th April 1945 the French troopship CUBA was torpedoed and damaged by U 1195 ..... U 1195 Commander Cordes was then sunk by depth charges from HMS Watchman..
Stan
Reply With Quote
  #355  
Old 11th August 2012, 11:20
Split Split is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 940
This is a fascinating thread. I wrote in it in 2007, and then stopped looking at SN for several years before coming back. I have skimmed through to the end of page two because I have to go out but I am going back to the start, again, there is so much information about WWII convoys!
Reply With Quote
  #356  
Old 11th August 2012, 14:33
Hugh Ferguson's Avatar
Hugh Ferguson Hugh Ferguson is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
My location
Posts: 5,535
I sailed in two huge U.S.N. escorted convoys, Hampton Roads to the Meddy, and they, at a rough estimate, would have been 90% Liberty ships.
It's not only incredible how the Americans built so many ships so fast, but also how they trained the crews to man them.

The only Liberty I sailed in was post-war in the Samcree. We got a real dusting in the Bay of Biscay outward and, on completion of discharge in Singapore, it was discovered that the tank tops in No.3 had "rippled" so instead of continueing the voyage eastward she returned U.K. and then back to the U.S.A., for scrapping I guess

See this link:- http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/konvois/ug-45.htm
Reply With Quote
  #357  
Old 11th August 2012, 15:50
Hugh Ferguson's Avatar
Hugh Ferguson Hugh Ferguson is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
My location
Posts: 5,535
Rosie the Riveter a tribute to the women who helped build the Liberties
The first of 4 episodes, click HERE
Reply With Quote
  #358  
Old 12th August 2012, 15:21
charles henry's Avatar
charles henry charles henry is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 1,314
The Americans respected their seamen and took care of them however they could while British sailors were off pay as soon as they were torpedoed.

Split[/QUOTE]

You are certainly correct with your statement. However although ones pay stopped if you managed to end up alive and ashore in a foreign country you were paid a small weekly stipend and placed in a relatively decent inexpensive hotel.

Chas
Reply With Quote
  #359  
Old 12th August 2012, 18:39
stan mayes stan mayes is offline  
Senior Member
Active: 1936 - 1986
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 9,354
By 1942 it had changed a liitle..
Pay stopped on day of sinking but if one was fortunate in surviving your pay was backdated and paid to the day of arrival in UK when you reported yourself alive at your local shipping office..
This was the pay from the shipowners...The War Bonus paid by the Government was not repaid it ended on day of the sinking.
The next of kin of those who were lost received no payments.
That is my experience after the sinking of Viking Star in the South Atlantic.
Of us survivors we were accomodated in a native school in Freetown with a cot and mosquito netting.It was August 1942.
Stan
Reply With Quote
  #360  
Old 14th August 2012, 17:00
Binnacle's Avatar
Binnacle Binnacle is offline  
Senior Member
Department: Deck
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,927
Andy Johnson - G.M. Lloyd's War Medal for Bravery at Sea

The tanker W.B. Walker, 10,468 grt, Oriental Tankers Ltd HK ( Standard Oil NJ ) having loaded 13,338 tons of aviation and pool spirit in Aruba for Avonmouth via Halifax, was torpedoed while in convoy on 29th. January 41 by U93 150 miles SW of Rockal, 4 crew died and 43 survived. Her back was broken in the explosion. The crew were rescued by HMS Antelope and Anthony, later transferred to armed trawler HMS Arab. The chief engineer Andrew Hunter Johnson was awarded the George Medal “for his presence of mind, courage and prompt action which saved his ship’s cargo of benzine from catching alight when his ship was torpedoed”. He was also awarded Lloyd’s War Medal, July 10 1941. This sinking is recounted in The Red Duster at War. Andy Johnson knocked a flare out of the hand of a rating who was on the point of igniting it despite the heavy presence of spirit vapour. I have mislaid details of his other actions. Andy was born in Scalloway, survived the war, emigrated to Australia. A brave and modest man.
Reply With Quote
  #361  
Old 23rd January 2014, 16:33
LucyKnight LucyKnight is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 209
Does anyone know the location of combined convoy control in Plymouth fm 1939 to Feb 41 before it moved from Plymouth to Derby House Liverpool? I thought it was at Mount Wise (where they started building underground bunkers under the Admiralty House lawn in 42 and finished in 44 which communicated with convoy control ). However an ex RN man told me he thought it was Mountbatten which was known as Cattewater in those days. Re Derby House Liverpool,which has the wartime bunker apparently restored and open as a museum (not during the Winter months). There is a rumour that it is going to be turned into Squash courts. Apparently the building is privately owned. Anyone know anything about it?
Reply With Quote
  #362  
Old 23rd January 2014, 17:30
chadburn chadburn is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 10,573
There could be some confusion between NCSO PHQ (Naval Control of Shipping Port Headquarters) and Royal Navy H/Q, sometimes they were in the same building/bunker or in separate locations, both dealt with the Convoy system.
__________________
Geordie Chief

From Grey Funnel to any Funnel, just show him/ me the money Mabel

Last edited by chadburn; 23rd January 2014 at 17:33..
Reply With Quote
  #363  
Old 18th April 2016, 23:49
wendy taylor wendy taylor is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 2
Wink

Hi, found your site by accident, while looking up my Grandfathers war records, he did in fact serve on the Darina which was sunk in 1942, he
also received the Kings award for bravery during the sinking, if you still have the ladys details I would love to pass on what I have found out so far, many thanks Wendy Taylor

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim MacIntyre View Post
Hello Ventry
I'm curious as to why you raise this question.. Some time ago I had a brief e-mail exchange with a lady named Darina Rowe. She was looking for anyone who had sailed on a Shell tanker 'Darina'. Her father had been on the ship and as she put it - 'yes she was named after the ship'.
If I recall she had originally posed the question in the British Merchant Navy web site and I suggested she also check through shipsnostalgia and helderline. I do not recall if there were any replies.
The correspondence has fallen off my e-mail records but her e-mail is still in my address book.
Jim Macintyre
Reply With Quote
  #364  
Old 19th April 2016, 19:10
Dartskipper Dartskipper is offline  
Senior Member
Organisation: Maritime Enthusiast
Active: 1970 - 1987
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 4,770
I have only just found this fascinating thread, after recognising the name Darina, because my Dad sailed as an apprentice in her in 1941. I shall add some of Dad's experiences that he wrote about a few years ago, because they confirm and illuminate some of the previous remarks and postings.
He joined the Anglo Saxon Petroleum Company in 1938, his first ship being Cardium until 1940. His second ship was Horn Shell until 1941. While in Cardium, they were in Hamburg in the summer of 1939, and while the political situation in Europe was deteriorating, Dad told me that everybody was worried about War being declared while they were there. Especially as the Agent came aboard one day to tell the Ship's Master that he had arranged for bicycles to be left outside the docks, and if War was declared, the crew were to use them to cycle to Holland so that they could be sent home to the UK. Fortunately, they left before the hare-brained scheme needed to be put into action.
Dad's notes confirm Stan Mayes' remarks about War Risk money, except in Dad's case, he and his fellow apprentices only got half of it until Shell were instructed to pay the full amount!
Dad was sent ashore to take his exam for his Second Mate's ticket in 1941, and after passing it he was sent to the MOWT Pool, where he was given a 4th Mate's position in the P&O trooper, Strathnaver. He absolutely hated what he called the P&O B***s**t, although he did say the feeding was so good, he forgot there was a War on at the time. Having a thoroughly miserable time, he paid off and was sent to join another P&O trooper, Narkunda. Here, he was quite happy. The Master, Capt. Louis Parfitt is one of the very few Captains that Dad ever spoke about. He kept a happy ship, as apparently all the officers had blotted their copy books at one time or another. Narkunda was involved with the exchange of Japanese and British Diplomats, as well as trooping on Operation Torch. Dad survived the sinking of Narkunda off Bougie in 1942, and when he got home again,(being repatriated in Stratheden) the Pool sent him back to tankers, as there was a shortage of experienced tanker crews.
Dad's next ship was Empire Norseman of the Eagle Oil. She was almost new, and on 23rd Feb 1943, one day after Dad turned 21, U558 sent him a torpedo for his birthday. He was picked up by the Lend-Lease convoy escort, HMS Totland. As she had a full sick bay with injured seamen, Dad and others were transferred to Athel Regent for the rest of the voyage to Curacao. (They were in Convoy UC1, and Empire Traveller had been empty apart from a small parcel of very high octane blending spirit destined for the refinery producing aviation fuel.)
Dad must have left his discharge book at home after this, probably thinking it might be unlucky to have it with him. He continued with Eagle Oil after returning to the UK in San Ambrosio, and joined San Roberto. In 1943 she sailed mostly on East Coast convoys, and then Dad joined San Cipriano. Because of the War, promotion was fairly rapid, and Dad had now made 3rd Mate. In 1944 he was again transferred to Empire Traveller, and was 2nd Mate when she became the first Allied Merchant ship to enter Cherbourg after it had been liberated by American Troops. Empire Traveller was attached to American Forces during the Normandy Invasion, and had been in one of the Mulberries during a big storm that caused her to drag anchor, as well as much damage to the temporary installations.
In 1945, Dad joined his last Wartime tanker, San Veronico, but signed off in New York where he had to enter hospital for an operation to his stomach. He never said much about it, except he could never hide the big horizontal scar across his belly when he was sunbathing. I think it was something to do with repairing damage done by the fuel oil he swallowed after Empire Norseman was sunk. He came home to the UK in Aquitania, and the Pool sent him back to sea in Fort Spokane of Watts Watts. Dad endured runs to Poland as long as he could, and gave up the sea in 1945 as he had married and my older brother was in the offing by then.
Dad later took a job on the London River with the PLA, until he thought he wasn't seeing enough of his young family, and put himself through night school to learn accountancy.
In 1968, he became friendly with the operators of the ex Fairmile ML, Pride of Paignton, and through them was offered the job of taking command of another Fairmile in Torquay, Kiloran II. Dad was back in his element, and he admitted to me afterwards, that he left the sea originally because he felt he had lost his confidence, as well as other health issues caused by his wartime experiences.
A few names would always crop up when he was reminiscing, these being one of his fellow apprentices, John Camkin, another was John W Balchin who was 2nd Mate in the Cardium, and another was Capt. Tom Finch in the Eagle Oil.
One of Dad's cousins sailed in Reardon Smith, but I can't recall which ship he was in that was sunk. I remember family history of "Uncle Desmond" having a bad time with flashbacks and nightmares afterwards, as the lifeboat he was in had been machine gunned by the Ju88 that sunk them. (I don't know all the exact facts of the event, but that is what I was told by Dad, and Dad's Mum.)

Roy.
__________________
Roy Kennedy

Last edited by Dartskipper; 19th April 2016 at 19:14..
Reply With Quote
  #365  
Old 19th April 2016, 19:39
Hugh Ferguson's Avatar
Hugh Ferguson Hugh Ferguson is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
My location
Posts: 5,535
Quote:
Originally Posted by raybnz View Post
I watched part of a programme on the History channel here in NZ this evening. Have I missed something but during the programme the American announcer stated that if it was not for the the US tankers and escorts coming in to the war effort in 1942 Britain would have lost the war.

It took three years for the US to make up its mind and no doubt only did it when they could see the dollars they would make. There is little doubt with their help and bases etc the convoys were given more protection.

60 years after the end of the war and we are still getting propaganda from the US.
The anti-American sentiment expressed in this post makes me sick.
It is absolutely and totally unjustified.
Even the war in Burma,which the Americans played NO active role in, was deeply affected by their non-participatory role.
The Kohima battle in Northen Burma was the turning point for the eventual 14th Army victory.
(1) The U.S. Navy's submarines had sunk most of the Japanese merchant ships carrying war supplies to their army.

(2) Air drop supplies to our 14th Army,near defeat at Kohima, enabled us halt the Japanese 3rd division last desperate efforts before their final realisation that they would now have no other option than retreat.
I once saw, what can only be described as an ARMADA of D.C.3's (Douglas Dakotas),take off from Chittagong for just such a "drop".
Without those aircraft and the Liberty ship,you could forget any Normandy landing and the liberation of Europe ever to have taken place.

God bless America and Americans: no wonder the 3rd Reich declared war on the U.S.A.. for the latter had broken every Geneva Convention there was left to break!!
Reply With Quote
  #366  
Old 19th April 2016, 20:14
IAN M's Avatar
IAN M IAN M is offline
Senior Member
Organisation: Merchant Navy
Department: Radio Officer
Active: 1943 - 1951
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 661
Extracted from my book, SHIPPING COMPANY LOSSES OF THE SECOND WORLD WAR.

"DARINA (Captain J.M. Cuthill). Bound for Galveston, Texas, sailed in Convoy ON.93 which left Liverpool on 8 May, 1942 and dispersed on reaching position 38º55´N 42º43´W on the 17th. Torpedoed by U.158 (Kptlt. Erwin Rostin) at 10pm on the 20th, in position 29º17´N 54º25´W. Three boats got away and the u-boat shelled the ship while the 1st Mate’s boat returned to collect the Master, Chief Engineer and a seaman who had been left on board. Six died at the time, but others, of the 50 rescued, later died on their wounds. Those in the Master’s boat were picked up by the tanker British Ardour and landed at Charleston, South Carolina, on the 27th. Those in the 3rd Mate’s boat were picked up by the Exanthia (US) on the 26th and landed at Norfolk, Virginia. Those in the 1st Mate’s boat were picked up by the Dagrun (Nor.) on the 26th and landed at Cape Town on 23 June."

See TIME TO GO SPARKY by V.J. Hickey, her 1st R/O.
__________________
IAN M MALCOLM
Reply With Quote
  #367  
Old 20th April 2016, 12:15
Hugh Ferguson's Avatar
Hugh Ferguson Hugh Ferguson is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
My location
Posts: 5,535
To view the extraordinary outcome of one U.S. Navy sinking of a Japanese merchant ship returning to Japan see HERE

There are 5 episodes, click on tiny red arrow top right to open next.
Reply With Quote
  #368  
Old 20th April 2016, 16:36
Robin Craythorn Robin Craythorn is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 108
Hi Roy
Your Dads wartime service makes very interesting reading, I am glad to have met him and sailed with him when the three of us sailed together in 1972 on ,Western Lady, Brixham - Torquay Ferry service.

Regards Robin
Reply With Quote
  #369  
Old 20th April 2016, 17:55
Dartskipper Dartskipper is offline  
Senior Member
Organisation: Maritime Enthusiast
Active: 1970 - 1987
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 4,770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin Craythorn View Post
Hi Roy
Your Dads wartime service makes very interesting reading, I am glad to have met him and sailed with him when the three of us sailed together in 1972 on ,Western Lady, Brixham - Torquay Ferry service.

Regards Robin
Many thanks Robin. We were very happy to have worked with you too in those days. Dad always had happy memories of his time with the Fairmiles to look back on in his later years. It was too bad that we lost contact until I found this site, but I'm sure he's around somewhere watching the ships go by.

Best regards,
Roy.
__________________
Roy Kennedy
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
BP Tankers Lose Anchors HENNEGANOL BP Shipping 26 14th November 2013 11:52
MAERSK TANKERS 1945-1959 [mostly] Rory Tankers 25 1st April 2009 01:56
"Suspect" North Korean ship on the move rushie News and Views from the Shipping World 0 27th October 2006 16:40
Hong Kong detains North Korean ship rushie News and Views from the Shipping World 0 24th October 2006 09:45
9 new tankers on order rushie News and Views from the Shipping World 0 8th August 2006 10:28



Support SN


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.