Uncommemorated British Merchant Seamen WWII - Ships Nostalgia
07:32

Welcome
Welcome!Welcome to Ships Nostalgia, the world's greatest online community for people worldwide with an interest in ships and shipping. Whether you are crew, ex-crew, ship enthusiasts or cruisers, this is the forum for you. And what's more, it's completely FREE.

Click here to go to the forums home page and find out more.
Click here to join.
Log in
User Name Password

Uncommemorated British Merchant Seamen WWII

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 21st July 2009, 17:59
Billy1963 Billy1963 is offline  
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 301
Uncommemorated British Merchant Seamen WWII

The CWGC have not through any fault of their own omitted the names of many British Merchant Seamen lost on Norwegian ships from their records and is something I am looking into. Information from the Nortraship Archives, which are held at the National Archives of Norway (Riksarkivet) and published by the Maritime Museum in Oslo have been transcribed from 2 books by a well respected Norwegian contact of mine Siri Lawson, naming all casualties of different nationalities lost from these ships. The list contains a large number of British Merchant Seamen lost from the Notraships (ships placed in allied service during WWII) many commemorated on Tower Hill, but after cross referencing all the names from files I have from the CWGC, I find that 62 individual Merchant Seamen named below have no official commemoration who were killed in action between 1940-1944, the majority being recorded as "Boy" ratings. I have emailed the National Archives of Norway asking if they can send me any copies of official documentation to back these findings so as to be able to submit to the relevant authorities in the UK. They replied saying they will deal with my request but this could take 6-8 weeks.

Hopefully enough documentation can be compiled to satisfy the Commission to add these Seamen to Tower Hill, but previous work undertaken over the years has taught me how difficult it is to persuade the CWGC as their hands are tied by strict rules governing the recording of official war dead. I feel this project maybe a bit to big for my undertaking alone and am asking for any support from the MNA and as many local branches as well as Merchant Navy websites as possible. Support mainly by highlighting these facts at hand and bringing it to the attention of the media and public alike. Cost for some documents may come into it, but I'll take that in my stride if and when the time comes.

Lest We Forget

1940

RYAN, Deck Boy, FRANK EDWARD, D/S Bravore (Norway) 20th April 1940. Sunk by mine.

TORRES, Messroom Boy, DANEILSEN, D/S Bravore (Norway) 20th April 1940. Sunk by mine.

CAMERON, Galley Boy, ROBERT, D/S Keret (Norway) 22nd August 1940. Sunk by U-37.

LARKIN, Messroom Boy, JAMES, D/S. Diana (Norway) September/October 1940. Joint Arbitration Committee state sunk by mine.

BUTLER, Deck Boy, NORMAN, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

HASLAM, Oiler, HENRY, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

RICHARDSON, Deck Boy, JAMES, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

SELF, Cook, GEORGE, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

TAYLOR, Deck Boy, HORACE, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

WILSON, Deck Boy, GEORGE, M/T Nina Borthen (Norway) 6th October 1940. Sunk by U-103.

CREMIN, Trimmer, TIMOTHY, D/S Dokka (Norway) 17th October 1940. Sunk by U-93.

GANNAWAY, Galley Boy, LIONAL, D/S Samnanger (Norway 2nd December 1940. Sunk by U-99.

CAESER, Able Seaman, JOCK? (Canadian) D/S Nyland (Norway) 5th December 1940. Disappeared.

1941

DAVIES, Galley Boy, LESLIE, D/S Brask (Norway) 15th January 1941. Sunk by Italian submarine Luigi Torelli

DONNAVON, Oiler, MICHAEL, M/S Benjamin Franklin (Norway) 19th February 1941. Sunk by U-103

GOULDEN, Messroom Boy, MICHAEL, D/S Augvald (Norway) 2nd March 1941. Sunk by U-47.

SCARGILL, Messroom Boy, STANLEY, D/S Augvald (Norway) 2nd March 1941. Sunk by U-47.

HICKEY, Stoker, DENNIS, D/S Samlanes (Norway) 13th March 1941. Sunk by mine.

ALLEN, Messroom Boy, FRANK, D/S Hørda (Norway) 24th March 1941. Sunk by U-97.

OAKLEY, Cabin Boy, DEREK, D/S Hørda (Norway) 24th March 1941. Sunk by U-97.

ROBERTS, Junior Ordinary Seaman, HARRY D/S Hørda (Norway) 24th March 1941. Sunk by U-97.

BEENEY, Sailor, ARTHUR, D/S Profit (Norway) 17th April 1941. Sunk by mine

GUTHERLESS, Deck Boy, HENRY, D/S Polyana (Norway) 25th April 1941. Sunk by U-103.

KING, Trimmer, JOSEPH DONALD,(Canadian) D/S Christian Krohg (Norway) 10th June 1941. Sunk by U-108.

O' REGAN, Stoker, WILLIAM, D/S Christian Krohg (Norway) 10th June 1941. Sunk by U-108.

LYNCH, Mechanic, WILLIAM, M/S Vigrid (Norway) 24th June 1941. Sunk by U-371.

SHIPLEY, Engineroom Boy, JAMES, M/S Vigrid (Norway) 24th June 1941. Sunk by U-371.

HILL, Galley Boy, WILLIAM, M/S Vigrid (Norway) 24th June 1941. Sunk by U-371.

SWEETMAN, Deck Boy, LESLIE, D/S Eikhaug (Norway) 7th September 1941. Sunk by E-boat S-52.

TURNER, Trimmer, CHARLES, D/S Eikhaug (Norway) 7th September 1941. Sunk by E-boat S-52.

BOTHA, Ordinary Seaman, E.P. M/T Barbro (Norway) 19th September 1941. Sunk by U-552.

DAVIES, Engineroom Boy, KENNETH, M/T Barbro (Norway) 19th September 1941. Sunk by U-552.

HUGHES, Galley Boy, WILLIAM, M/T Barbro (Norway) 19th September 1941. Sunk by U-552.

KRUAJER, Messroom Boy, SIMON, M/T Barbro (Norway) 19th September 1941. Sunk by U-552.

RICE, Messroom Boy, BERHARD, D/S Varangberg (Norway) 25th September 1941. Sunk by U-203.

WAUDBY, Trimmer, JACK, D/S Roy (Norway) 12th October 1941. Sunk by E-boat S-53

HANNAM, Messroom Boy, FONWICK, D/S Erviken (Norway) 16th October 1941. Sunk by U-558.

SULLIVAN, Messroom Boy, EDWARD, D/S Erviken (Norway) 16th October 1941. Sunk by U-558.

CHADWICK, Ordinary Seaman, JOHN, D/S Rask (Norway) 19th October 1941. Sunk by German aircraft.

HOWARD, Messroom Boy, LEWIS, M/T Fjord (Norway) 2nd December 1941. Sunk by U-557.

GOODWIN, Galley Boy, REGINALD, D/S Annavore (Norway) 21st December 1941. Sunk by U-567.

1942

DUFFY, Oiler, MICHAEL, M/T Nyholt, (Norway) 17th January 1942. Sunk by U-87.

HOPLAND, Galley Boy, HARRY, M/T Nyholt (Norway) 18th January 1942. Sunk by U-87.

BROMFIELD, Messroom Boy, THEODORE E. D/S Belize (Norway) 21st January 1942. Sunk by U-754.

HUGHES, Oiler, JOHN NORMAN, D/S Ringstad (Norway) 24th January 1942. Sunk by U-333.

DONACE/DONNASCHIE, Trimmer, JOHN. D/S Blink (Norway) 11th February 1942. Sunk by U-108.

GRAVES, Ordinary Seaman, REGINALD. D/S Blink (Norway) 11th February 1942. Sunk by U-108.

PAPPACENA, Galley Boy, A. NOEL? D/S Blink (Norway) 11th February 1942. Sunk by U-108.

DAVIDSON, Messroom Boy, W. N. D/S Ingerto (Norway) 12th February 1942. Sunk by U-578.

EAGLELSHAM, Galley Boy, CRAMFORD, D/S Ingerto (Norway) 12th February 1942. Sunk by U-578.

SHERIDAN, Saloon Boy, FRANCIS, M/T Finnager (Norway) 1st March 1942. Sunk by U-158.

PATTERSON, Messroom Boy, DENNIS, D/S Tolosa (Norway) 9th March 1942. Sunk by U-108.

ABBE, Saloon Boy, STANLEY, M/S Tyr (Norway) 9th March 1942. Sunk by U-96.

MOORE, Messroom Boy, RICHARD, M/S Tyr (Norway) 9th March 1942. Sunk by U-96.

DENNIE, Radiao Officer, JOHN, MT/ Svenør (Norway) 27th March 1942. Sunk by U-105

PORTER, Galley Boy, RONALD R. M/T Kollskegg (Norway) 6th April 1942. Sunk by U-754.

McLEAN, Messroom Boy, PATRICK, D/S Fanefjeld (Norway) 9th April 1942. Sunk by U-252.

HOOD, Able Seaman WILLIAM A. D/S Taborfjell (Norway) 30th April 1942. Sunk by U-576.

HODDER, Trimmer, FRED, D/S Douro (Norway) 9th May 1942. Sunk by German aircraft

EBANKS, Messroom Boy, CLYDE, M/S Gundersen (Norway) 1st July 1942. Sunk by U-129.

DOLAND, Stoker, ANTONIO, D/S Fidelio (Norway) 9th November 1942. Sunk by E-boat.

TYNAN, Saloon Boy, JOHN (Australian), M/S Herstein (Norway) 1st July 1942. Died as prisoner on the Japanese Montevideo Maru when that ship was torpedoed and sunk by the American submarine Sturgeon (SS-187), about 65 miles west off Cape Bojeador, Luzon in position18' 37N 119' 29E. About 1050 allied POW's en route to Hainan Island lost their lives.

1944

PHILLIPS, Messroom Boy, LEON, D/S Isbjørn (Norway) 17th December 1944. Age 18, of 108 Ninian Park Road, Cardiff. Isbjørn capsized in a storm.

Last edited by Billy1963; 21st July 2009 at 20:28.. Reason: Correction on casualty
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 21st July 2009, 23:11
benjidog benjidog is offline
member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
My location
Posts: 17
They shall be remembered Billy, and you are doing a great job in seeking official recognition.

I am sure that the membership would like to help however they can and I hope you will keep us updated with the responses you get.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 22nd July 2009, 00:48
scorcher scorcher is offline  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,028
Would it help to publicise this very worthy cause if members listed any photos of those ships listed? I have a neg of one which I would like to list with a link to this thread. Give me the green light and I will go ahead.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 24th February 2015, 23:05
hiawatha hiawatha is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Crew of Polyana

Billy1963,
I have recently come across your post whilst researching the death of my uncle Maurizo Zammit a Fireman on the Polyana sunk by U103 .
I have also contacted the CWGC re Henry Gutherless .
I have some information that might be of interest if you care to contact me .
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 25th February 2015, 01:32
Sister Eleff's Avatar
Sister Eleff Sister Eleff is offline  
Nursie
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
My location
Posts: 5,820
Hello and welcome to the site Hiawatha. Billy1963 hasn't visited the site since December 2010. You may have to send him a Private Message or email through Ships Nostalgia to gain his attention.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 25th February 2015, 07:30
hiawatha hiawatha is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Thank you , I will do this directly .
Dr. Charles Zammit
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 25th February 2015, 12:42
ninabaker's Avatar
ninabaker ninabaker is offline  
Senior Member
Organisation: Merchant Navy
Department: Deck
Active: 1972 - 1979
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 916
Very interesting. If there was any information about the home addresses of these brave souls, I could certainly arrange to get any Glaswegians written into the city's MN roll of honour book, which is part of the city's MN memorial in the city chambers.

nina
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 27th February 2015, 23:48
hiawatha hiawatha is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Thank you for the replies Sister Eleff and Ninabaker, it is difficult to navigate through the bureaucracy involved in this when based in Australia . Unfortunately I haven't been able to contact Billy1963 , but I am grateful for his post that led me here .
'' Polyana had left Sunderland with a cargo of coal on March 22-1941. Via Methil Roads and Loch Ewe, she arrived Oban on Apr. 3, leaving again on Apr. 7 for Freetown in the Gibraltar ''
Ninabaker , it is a real possibility that Henry Gutherless may have joined the crew at any of these ports , from what I have been able to find out the name seems to originate in Yorkshire or at least there are some found there and noted in memorials to the fallen of WW1.
The staff at the Commonwealth War Graves Commission UK were helpful but they stated that,
''Our duties are confined to the commemoration of members of the Commonwealth forces who lost their lives during the two world wars. If Henry Gutherless was not a member of the forces, he would not fall within the Commission’s jurisdiction.''


I found this confusing as there is clearly a memorial to Merchant Seamen at Tower Hill in London .

I managed to find two references to the Polyana and the crew that perished in her ,

http://www.warsailors.com/singleships/polyana.html

http://uboat.net/allies/merchants/883.html

Both sites refer to Henry as British , the Norwegian references to the Polyana only list Norwegian Nationals . Presumably the compilers of the list knew the nationalities of the crew involved and so did not include the foreign crew on their records ,
http://minnehallen.no/skip_2/polyana-ds

At the time Malta was of course under British rule and rightly so my uncle Maurizo was commemorated at Tower hill and in his home villiage of Gozo in Malta ,

It is a source of disquiet to me that of those three crew listed as British or British subjects, only Henry Gutherless is uncommemorated , perhaps he had no family to note his loss , as a 'deck boy' he was most likely of a young age and it is certainly unfair that his obviously short life should go unnoticed . He was a shipmate of my Uncle's , a young boy at sea at the start of his life , I would really like to see him have some mark in the world that shows he existed .

The officer at the CWGC did suggest I ask this organisation for help ,

The Registry of Shipping and Seaman

PO Box 420

Cardiff CF24 5JW

I suppose this is a starting point but would certainly welcome any suggestions from members of this forum .
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Maurizo Zammit.jpg (78.2 KB, 10 views)
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 28th February 2015, 01:01
Hugh MacLean's Avatar
Hugh MacLean Hugh MacLean is offline
Senior Member
Organisation: Royal Navy
Active: 1976 - 1988
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,441
Hello Hiawatha,
The information you have been given by the CWGC, if I understand it correctly, is wrong.
Billy is the best person to advise here as he is currently dealing with all non commemorated British Merchant Seamen.
Billy is currently offline at the moment but i have contact with him and will pass on this thread to him.
Regards
Hugh
__________________
"If Blood was the price
We had to pay for our freedom
Then the Merchant Ship Sailors
Paid it in full”
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 28th February 2015, 09:47
Sister Eleff's Avatar
Sister Eleff Sister Eleff is offline  
Nursie
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
My location
Posts: 5,820
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh MacLean View Post
Hello Hiawatha,
The information you have been given by the CWGC, if I understand it correctly, is wrong.
Billy is the best person to advise here as he is currently dealing with all non commemorated British Merchant Seamen.
Billy is currently offline at the moment but i have contact with him and will pass on this thread to him.
Regards
Hugh
Hugh you are the best
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 28th February 2015, 22:29
hiawatha hiawatha is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Thanks Hugh , hopefully something can be done for at least one of these men .
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 28th February 2015, 23:16
Hugh MacLean's Avatar
Hugh MacLean Hugh MacLean is offline
Senior Member
Organisation: Royal Navy
Active: 1976 - 1988
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,441
It is a difficult task that requires a lot of hard work and dedication as the CWGC will need proof from official sources before they will change the status of an uncommemorated merchant seaman. There is nobody better at doing that than Billy, he has a proven track record. Just bear with him for a while until he can get himself back online and I am sure he will be in touch.

Sister: thank you - very kind.

Regards
Hugh
__________________
"If Blood was the price
We had to pay for our freedom
Then the Merchant Ship Sailors
Paid it in full”
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 7th January 2016, 16:03
WillyJamesMc WillyJamesMc is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 30
By the end of the war, according to Lloyd’s 351 ships of the Nortraship fleet had been lost by direct enemy action, resulting in the deaths of over 3,500 Merchant Seamen. These casualties were meticulously recorded by The National Archives of Norway and published in two volumes of Sjøforklaringer fra 2. Verdenskrig Vol. I & II. (Maritime Inquiries from WWII), which consists of direct copies of official reports from ship losses recorded at the Norwegian National Archives. The publications, which I donated to the CWGC last year, included the names of hundreds of serving British survivors and over 900 Merchant Seamen of foreign nationalities recorded as dead/missing, which includes the names of 271 British Merchant Seamen killed. 218 British Seamen named in the publications as being killed are recorded with the Commonwealth War Graves Commission and commemorated on the Tower Hill Memorial in London, while a further 13 are buried ashore in official war graves. Started in 2009 and finally in 2013 a successful application using extracts from the Norwegian publications were made to the CWGC in regard to three British casualties from the Norwegian ship D/S Blink (PAPPACENA, N. GRAVES, R. & DONNASCHIE, J.) who had been overlooked and after consultation with the Registrar of Shipping & Seamen, all three were officially accepted as war dead and are due to be commemorated on Tower Hill in due course, while two other cases are at present under review. The remaining casualties for some reason have also been overlooked by the Registrar of Shipping & Seamen of the day and at present are forgotten. In November 2015 a further ten of these cases were reviewed by the CWGC and finally accepted as war dead, while the others remain under review. Over 70 years since the end of WWII and still we battle for recognition for our war dead.

The details of those named below bar one are now registered on the official CWGC website.

ALLEN, Messroom Boy, FRANK, D/S Hørda (Norway) 24th March 1941.
GOODWIN, Galley Boy, REGINALD, D/S Annavore (Norway) 21st December 1941.
HANNAM, Messroom Boy, FONWICK, D/S Erviken (Norway) 16th October 1941.
HODDER, Trimmer, FRED, D/S Douro (Norway) 9th May 1942.
LEHANE, Stoker, MICHAEL, D/S Brant County (Norway) 10th March 1943
OAKLEY, Cabin Boy, DEREK, D/S Hørda (Norway) 24th March 1941.
O' REGAN, Stoker, WILLIAM, D/S Christian Krohg (Norway) 10th June 1941.
McGRORY, Messroom Boy, WILLIAM, D/S Christian Krohg (Norway) 10th June 1941.
McLEAN, Messroom Boy, PATRICK, D/S Fanefjeld (Norway) 9th April 1942.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 7th January 2016, 17:07
WillyJamesMc WillyJamesMc is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 30
RE: #8

The case of Henry Gutherless is at present under review by the CWGC after details sent to me from The National Archives of Norway was forwarded to the comission's commemoration team.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Gutherless.jpg (210.8 KB, 25 views)
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 1st December 2019, 08:36
hiawatha hiawatha is offline  
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 5
Have you heard anything further WillyJamesMc ?
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Court Line ships Stuart Smith Ship Research 39 19th December 2017 11:28
Athel Tankers treeve Tankers 178 6th March 2017 15:36
British Resource 1942 (sunk) b.robinson460 BP Shipping 19 27th January 2017 22:08
US WWII Merchant Seamen Want Recognition shamrock News and Views from the Shipping World 2 10th July 2009 01:06



Support SN


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.1.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.