Death and burial overseas - Ships Nostalgia
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Death and burial overseas

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  #1  
Old 12th May 2016, 11:52
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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Death and burial overseas

Where can I find details of the death of a friend, who died in Curacao after accident aboard a Shell oil tanker in 1965
Thanks
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  #2  
Old 12th May 2016, 19:08
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Hugh MacLean Hugh MacLean is offline
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Diane,
I think we have corresponded on another site but you can check for an entry in the ship's official logbook - 90% of logbooks for years ending 5 are held at the National Maritime Museum, Greenwich.

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Hugh
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  #3  
Old 12th May 2016, 19:58
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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Yes we have Hugh.
Many thanks,

Diane
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  #4  
Old 12th May 2016, 20:24
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Diane

Was the body brought back to the UK?.
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  #5  
Old 12th May 2016, 20:44
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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No it wasn't David. Vaughan was buried in Curacao.

Diane
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  #6  
Old 12th May 2016, 21:08
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DianeE View Post
No it wasn't David. Vaughan was buried in Curacao.

Diane

Diane

In that case, the British Consular staff in Curacao may have information on record. And if Vaughn died after an accident, there would almost certainly have been a post-mortem, where again records would have been kept. I have no idea of the law in Curacao, but in this country death caused by an accident would be an automatic PM and inquest. Have you also contacted Shell?
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  #7  
Old 12th May 2016, 21:20
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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Yes I've contacted Shell but as yet have had no reply. I thought of contact the consulate but haven't done so yet. I'm not sure about a pm as it seems Vaughan died on the Monday and was buried on the Tuesday! No time for one.
Thanks for the suggestion.
Diane
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  #8  
Old 12th May 2016, 21:30
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Originally Posted by DianeE View Post
Yes I've contacted Shell but as yet have had no reply. I thought of contact the consulate but haven't done so yet. I'm not sure about a pm as it seems Vaughan died on the Monday and was buried on the Tuesday! No time for one.
Thanks for the suggestion.
Diane

Diane

Very odd, but of course different countries have different rules. Yet even with different rules, to be buried so quickly is something I have never come across during all my years in the profession from any country. I would certainly be asking questions in such circumstances, and would start with the consulate, locate the death certificate, where registered, and so on.
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  #9  
Old 13th May 2016, 08:41
Cutsplice Cutsplice is offline  
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I was in Rhodes two years ago a Greek friend of mine, his mother died at 4 am the funeral and burial took place the same day at 5pm. So quite rapid funerals and burials seem to be the norm in some countries, giving little time for death registrations pm,s etc, I often wonder how they manage to achieve and complete the necessary formalities in such a short period of time.
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  #10  
Old 13th May 2016, 10:02
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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I have his death certificate but it doesn't say how or the exact place he died., just details of his profession and date and home address. The details I do have are from the article in the local paper from that week.
I do find it strange that there were no details, but presumably his parents were told something.
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  #11  
Old 13th May 2016, 11:08
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Diane

The death certificate should give the cause of death, which is usually part (a) and (b), sometimes more depending on cause and underlying cause's etc.

In this country, a doctor would be unable to issue a death certificate if death accidental. It would have to be reported to the coroner under very complex coroners rules. Indeed, a doctor who do not know the person can't write a death certificate again having to report to the coroner.

It is worrying that countries have rules that can bury a body within a day. Sorry I can't be of further help other than that a similar situation could not happen here.
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  #12  
Old 13th May 2016, 11:17
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If the vessel was British Registered the master is required under the Merchant Shipping Acts, in the event of on board death, to record all relevant details in the ship's log, he is also required to complete form B & D 1 (birth & deaths). On the vessels return to the UK these will be examined and then deposited with the superintendent of the local Mercantile Marine Office, eventually being sent to the Registrar General of Shipping and Seamen. If the vessel does not return to the UK the documents will be deposited with a British consular officer for transmission to Registrar General of Shipping & seamen UK. If the death did indeed occur aboard all these documents should certainly be on file in UK archives. I would suggest you be guided by Hugh Maclean who has experience locating the appropriate documents. Good luck.
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  #13  
Old 13th May 2016, 15:27
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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Thanks.

Diane
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  #14  
Old 13th May 2016, 15:46
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Originally Posted by Binnacle View Post
If the vessel was British Registered the master is required under the Merchant Shipping Acts, in the event of on board death, to record all relevant details in the ship's log, he is also required to complete form B & D 1 (birth & deaths). On the vessels return to the UK these will be examined and then deposited with the superintendent of the local Mercantile Marine Office, eventually being sent to the Registrar General of Shipping and Seamen. If the vessel does not return to the UK the documents will be deposited with a British consular officer for transmission to Registrar General of Shipping & seamen UK. If the death did indeed occur aboard all these documents should certainly be on file in UK archives. I would suggest you be guided by Hugh Maclean who has experience locating the appropriate documents. Good luck.

Diane

Binnacle makes a good point, so worth pursuing. However, once a person has been landed, they come under the laws of that country. I had personal experience of this when working at sea in the medical department when we landed passengers or crew. I was the person with the task of handing over to local authorities so well aware of documentation aboard etc. When leaving the sea, I was on the other end so as to speak working for the coroner involved in the entire process from clinical matters to documentation. That is why I am surprised more details from Curacao are not available whether there are details in the ships log or not. Another mystery if the death certificate. I would be interested in seeing it. If you send me a PM, I will give you my e-mail address so that you can scan and send it.

We will get to the bottom of this whether via myself, or Hugh as Binnacle has suggested.
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  #15  
Old 14th May 2016, 03:40
backsplice backsplice is offline  
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Hi Diane............ this may be another direction !!
If you have the name of the Shell Tanker and the date of the incident you could email the
Maritime History Archive
Memorial university of Newfoundland
Website .... http:// www.mun.ca/mha

ask if they have the logbooks and crew list for that vessel you will need the official No .......... if they have them ... for a small fee (depending on how much you need copied) then they will send them to you if they are available .....believe me they have a lot of stuff

I hope this helps
Backsplice
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  #16  
Old 14th May 2016, 10:01
DianeE DianeE is offline  
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Thanks

Quote:
Originally Posted by R651400 View Post
Also Diane if you haven't already noticed British consular affairs for Curacao Netherland Antilles are run from the British Consulate General in Amsterdam.
I see there is a British Consulate mentioned on one unofficial website for Willemstad Curacao but I think you'll possibly get a better result for any of your enquiries from Amsterdam.
Thanks for that I'll give it a go.
Diane
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  #17  
Old 14th May 2016, 10:44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backsplice View Post
If you have the name of the Shell Tanker and the date of the incident you could email the
Maritime History Archive
Memorial university of Newfoundland
Website .... http:// www.mun.ca/mha
As the incident happened in 1965 the logbooks for that year will not be held by the MHA in Canada. 10% will be held at Kew the remainding 90% are held at the Maritime Museum Greenwich.

Regards
Hugh
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  #18  
Old 15th May 2016, 00:47
backsplice backsplice is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh MacLean View Post
As the incident happened in 1965 the logbooks for that year will not be held by the MHA in Canada. 10% will be held at Kew the remainding 90% are held at the Maritime Museum Greenwich.

Regards
Hugh
Hi Hugh ........... I only suggested that because I have obtained copies of logs from 1957 /59 / 70 /72 and one of these was home trade but it would,nt hurt for Diane to try its only an email .......... also there is the "Shell tankers UK" facebook group there is a wealth of Shell related information available there
keep up the good work
yours aye
backsplice
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  #19  
Old 15th May 2016, 09:54
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Hugh MacLean Hugh MacLean is offline
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No worries backsplice. I understand your wish to help.

MHA do have logs including crews agreements for the later years albeit they are not indexed yet on their site. You will not find the years ending in 5 there although Diane is certainly welcome to try.

Regards
Hugh
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