Aircraft radio on Long Wave - Ships Nostalgia
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Aircraft radio on Long Wave

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  #1  
Old 22nd January 2019, 14:55
Worldspan Worldspan is offline
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Aircraft radio on Long Wave

Our family's first broadcast receiver was a Pye. It was a pre-war model but still working (albeit with some services) in the early 1950s. It covered MW and LW and at the bottom of the LW, below 'Droitwich' and 'Luxembourg', the tuning dial had a part marked 'Aircraft'. I listened long and hard for hours on end but never heard a thing apart from pulses that I suppose was Morse sent by a tape.

So did aircraft really use this section of the LW and, if so, would this have been RT or WT? Does anyone remember this and did anyone ever hear anything?

W
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  #2  
Old 22nd January 2019, 16:02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Worldspan View Post
Our family's first broadcast receiver was a Pye. It was a pre-war model but still working (albeit with some services) in the early 1950s. It covered MW and LW and at the bottom of the LW, below 'Droitwich' and 'Luxembourg', the tuning dial had a part marked 'Aircraft'. I listened long and hard for hours on end but never heard a thing apart from pulses that I suppose was Morse sent by a tape.

So did aircraft really use this section of the LW and, if so, would this have been RT or WT? Does anyone remember this and did anyone ever hear anything?

W
Non directional beacons for aero and marine in that part of the spectrum.
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  #3  
Old 22nd January 2019, 17:49
Bill.B Bill.B is offline  
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Shannon air radio used to make voice broadcasts down that end.
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  #4  
Old 23rd January 2019, 22:28
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Originally Posted by Worldspan View Post
Our family's first broadcast receiver was a Pye. It was a pre-war model but still working (albeit with some services) in the early 1950s. It covered MW and LW and at the bottom of the LW, below 'Droitwich' and 'Luxembourg', the tuning dial had a part marked 'Aircraft'. I listened long and hard for hours on end but never heard a thing apart from pulses that I suppose was Morse sent by a tape.

So did aircraft really use this section of the LW and, if so, would this have been RT or WT? Does anyone remember this and did anyone ever hear anything?

W
There was a similar radio/wireless in our house in the 40s and 50s. It had a 'magic eye' - a green neon of some sort that would close like a cat's eye when the tuning was optimum. It had aircraft band but I don't recall anything from it. Ships entering Hartlepool and the River Tees would often break through with Morse. Years later (2003) I wrote this in honour of Dad's old machine:

The Wireless

It’s my Dad’s birthday today
and he would be a hundred and ten,
but he didn't make it past sixty-five.
He moved slow at the end,
did his pools, read John Bull, shushed us -
then blunt ship-builder’s fingers
tuned with artilleryman’s concentration
through the ether for Luxembourg.

He had a wire outside to get Long Wave -
it ran up the wall with the roses.
Inside, behind the Palladian front,
valves strained for the sounds of Athlone
Paris, Dortmund and Hilversum,
under dust-felted overcoat shoulders -
hunched things, like him and his mates
when grass grew in the yards.
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  #5  
Old 29th January 2019, 16:23
sparks69 sparks69 is offline  
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DAN would be heard in the background of the 6 o'clock news on the Home Service.
Years later I found that the IF was DAN's working frequency.
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  #6  
Old 5th February 2019, 13:31
trotterdotpom trotterdotpom is offline  
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DAN would be heard in the background of the 6 o'clock news on the Home Service.
Years later I found that the IF was DAN's working frequency.
DAN DAN the Funker Mann ... was it 474 kc/s?

John T
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  #7  
Old 5th February 2019, 14:20
jimg0nxx jimg0nxx is offline  
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As I remember it was 444 Kc/s.
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  #8  
Old 6th February 2019, 07:09
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Norddeich/DAN 474 Kcs Kiel/DAO 470 kcs and in the 50's Elbe-Weser/DAC but don't remember the frequency.
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  #9  
Old 6th February 2019, 08:16
duncs duncs is offline  
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I seem to remember, as a youngster. tuning in the radio to get info, re the arrival of the ferry 'RMS Claymore'. You could hear Barra head lighthouse replying and repeating the info. This freq was next to radio Lux. Our old 'Skylord' couldn't tune into the shipping freqs. I presume the same would be for air.
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  #10  
Old 6th February 2019, 12:22
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I seem to remember, as a youngster. tuning in the radio to get info, re the arrival of the ferry 'RMS Claymore'. You could hear Barra head lighthouse replying and repeating the info. This freq was next to radio Lux. Our old 'Skylord' couldn't tune into the shipping freqs. I presume the same would be for air.
I've just remembered the 'Luxemburg Effect' where radio Paris (or was it Hilversum?) intermodulated with Radio Luxembourg. That was explained to us at Radio College. But it was a weird occurance on Dad's valve wireless and would get in the way of his competition results.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxemb...93Gorky_effect
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  #11  
Old 6th February 2019, 13:22
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I've just remembered the 'Luxemburg Effect' where radio Paris (or was it Hilversum?) intermodulated with Radio Luxembourg. That was explained to us at Radio College. But it was a weird occurance on Dad's valve wireless and would get in the way of his competition results.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luxemb...93Gorky_effect

My lecturer, Mr Andrew Bogie of Leith Nautical College, said that Luxemburg effect only appeared when radio receivers started using Intermediate frequencies in their tuning and amplification circuits. He said it did not happen with TRF equipment. This subject has been at the centre of many an argument over years.

Regards

KR
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  #12  
Old 6th February 2019, 16:11
sparks69 sparks69 is offline  
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TRF's ---- Marconi A-Lert ----- as much use as a chocolate fire guard !
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  #13  
Old 6th February 2019, 16:54
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Varley Varley is offline   SN Supporter
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I heard that during the war radio silence involved also switching off heterodyning receivers as the LO could be detected at distance.
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  #14  
Old 6th February 2019, 22:07
duncs duncs is offline  
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I heard that during the war radio silence involved also switching off heterodyning receivers as the LO could be detected at distance.
I remember an elderly lecturer, 'Old Mac', at GCNS, telling us how a receiver could quite easily be converted into a transmitter.

Mind you, this same gent also explained, how zinc buckets, lots of urine and bayonets could make a usable battery. I don't know if this was through personal experience in the army, in the desert.
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  #15  
Old 6th February 2019, 22:12
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TRF's ---- Marconi A-Lert ----- as much use as a chocolate fire guard !
Exactly!
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  #16  
Old 6th February 2019, 23:55
duncs duncs is offline  
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Exactly!
It still served a purpose! If only for the logbook.

Last edited by duncs; 7th February 2019 at 00:04.. Reason: forgot logbook
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  #17  
Old 7th February 2019, 09:25
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Sam class Liberties MF/LF stand-by receiver was TRF powered by the old fashioned 100V HT battery 9V grid bias and LT from ship's emerg battery and the most sensitiv MF/LF receivers I sailed with.
#11 ..Andrew Bogie LNC in my time radar instructor was an absolute "Mekon" on radio theory but did he get it right on his Superhet/TRF Luxembourg effect answer.
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  #18  
Old 7th February 2019, 12:53
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Sam class Liberties MF/LF stand-by receiver was TRF powered by the old fashioned 100V HT battery 9V grid bias and LT from ship's emerg battery and the most sensitiv MF/LF receivers I sailed with.
#11 ..Andrew Bogie LNC in my time radar instructor was an absolute "Mekon" on radio theory but did he get it right on his Superhet/TRF Luxembourg effect answer.

Fred Boettcher also talked about the Effect and that it was only experienced with superhet receivers. I attended LNC late 1960 - 1963, listened to Luxemburg on my Perdio transistor radio (superhet) however I never heard the said Lux effect. All history nowadays.

73 de KR
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  #19  
Old 7th February 2019, 18:22
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208 metres Radio Luxemburg was notorious for its QSB that always seemed to coincide when they reached number one on the late Sunday Top Twenty but am sure this had nothing to do with the "effect."
All water under the bridge especially now with internet radio TV et al.
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Old 8th February 2019, 09:26
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208 metres Radio Luxemburg was notorious for its QSB that always seemed to coincide when they reached number one on the late Sunday Top Twenty but am sure this had nothing to do with the "effect."
All water under the bridge especially now with internet radio TV et al.
Perhaps the QSB was due to the fact that you were listening on your small transistor radio under the bed covers. It was in my case ……………
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  #21  
Old 9th February 2019, 15:57
Alan Couchman Alan Couchman is offline  
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In. the '40's and early '50's, long wave was certainly used for aircraft communications. This used morse, with the calling and distress frequency being 333KHz. See https://www.flightglobal.com/FlightP...20-%201088.PDF
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  #22  
Old 11th February 2019, 03:59
duncs duncs is offline  
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Perhaps the QSB was due to the fact that you were listening on your small transistor radio under the bed covers. It was in my case ……………
I seem to remember you telling me, when you on the KSC Al? with Russian gear, var tx tuning, butting in on one of the pirate radio stations. Or, perhaps, that was only an intention.

Best regards,


Duncan, ex Dwarka
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  #23  
Old 11th February 2019, 04:14
duncs duncs is offline  
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208 metres Radio Luxemburg was notorious for its QSB that always seemed to coincide when they reached number one on the late Sunday Top Twenty but am sure this had nothing to do with the "effect."
All water under the bridge especially now with internet radio TV et al.
One lecturer at GCNS, explained this as 'skywave' and 'groundwave', heterodyning. Some plus + plus, then plus + minus, minus - minus. I,m confusing myself.
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  #24  
Old 11th February 2019, 09:20
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I seem to remember you telling me, when you on the KSC Al? with Russian gear, var tx tuning, butting in on one of the pirate radio stations. Or, perhaps, that was only an intention.

Best regards,


Duncan, ex Dwarka
Al Shamiah - you've a good memory Duncs. Had a lot of fun with those transmitters.

73s
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  #25  
Old 13th February 2019, 16:03
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I worked with a guy who had previously been employed at a ground station communicating with aircraft, presumably with NATCS. Apparently he sat in a cubicle with a loudspeaker, headphones and a morse key. Receiver controlled by another department...
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