Hungry Hogarths - Ships Nostalgia
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  #1  
Old 14th July 2006, 23:46
notnila notnila is offline  
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Hungry Hogarths

Nobody out there prepared to admit signing on a Baron Boat? Ijoined the Baron Pentland 1962 in Bremen( Prescot St Pool ) gave us 1 each and put us on the train to Harwich.8 month trip 7 ports.Wish I was in her now.
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  #2  
Old 15th July 2006, 22:50
lakercapt lakercapt is offline  
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I will admit to signing on a Baron Boat.
Sailed 8 horrible months on Baron Kinnaird and stood by Baron Pentland when the sold it to Greek shipping interests.
Spent 5 months on Baron Cawdor for maiden voyage and were not happy that I went on vacation at that time.
Never went back
Not a masochist.
Scottish Ship Management as they became has a web site.
www.scottishshipmanagement.com.
They don't like adverse comments!!!!!!
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  #3  
Old 16th July 2006, 12:33
ARRANMAN35 ARRANMAN35 is offline  
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Hungary Hogarths

Hi,
Joined the Baron Dunmore in drydock Birkenhead in September 1956,
a natural draught coal burner built in 1933.
One trip to Cuba for sugar, Guantanamo Bay no less, feeding was of the
usual company standard and accomodation was indeed basic.
Learned sufficient, that one trip not to pursue a career with them.
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  #4  
Old 16th July 2006, 12:43
dom dom is offline  
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dom

never sailed on a baron boat,there were to many companys around like them,why should they have all the fun,but i belive there was one baron boat out of glasgow you could not get a job on,i think it was only short trips of about one month, full glasgow crowd home port,good run
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  #5  
Old 16th July 2006, 16:58
ARRANMAN35 ARRANMAN35 is offline  
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Hungary Hogarths

Quote:
Originally Posted by notnila
Nobody out there prepared to admit signing on a Baron Boat? Ijoined the Baron Pentland 1962 in Bremen( Prescot St Pool ) gave us 1 each and put us on the train to Harwich.8 month trip 7 ports.Wish I was in her now.
Baron Dunmore was in Burntisland discharghing alumina ore from Takoradi in
Dec 1956.
Have posted a piccie of her in the Gallery.
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  #6  
Old 24th July 2006, 06:20
Don Sangster Don Sangster is offline  
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Joined the Baron Ramsey in Cardiff in March 1955 biggest mistake I ever made down to the West Coast of Africa to Accra and Takoradi to load Manganese we had to trim coal
from the tween decks for the black gang not very good in that heat arrived in Calais
late June they wouldn't pay us off we had to stay for a week and then take her to
Birkenhead she was Built in 1929 scrapped in 1961 she was as basic as they get
Don Sangster R572077
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  #7  
Old 24th July 2006, 11:46
vangooler vangooler is offline  
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I must be having a SENIOR'S moment. My book says I joined the Baron Ardossan as an EDH in Liverpool 21/10/59 and left her in London 28/01/60. It must have been an uneventful trip. For the life of me I can't remember anything about the trip. Anyone out there who may have been on her that can help get the little grey cells working?
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  #8  
Old 25th July 2006, 11:18
tercar tercar is offline  
 
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Hi Don
I joined the Baron Ramsey in1951 or 2, same run as you. No fridges just the icebpox on the boatdeck.
Did you find the chess set I helped carve out of a broom handle?
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  #9  
Old 8th September 2006, 18:23
James MacDonald James MacDonald is offline  
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Baron Belhaven

I joined the Baron Belhaven in St Johns NB April 67 as AB. Discharging sugar then we were chartered on the famous MANZ run.looking back Im sure I enjoyed these days.although our modern day seamen wouldnt get up the gangway ( or wouldnt go up the gangway ). We arrived at Greenock on Nov 67 only to have her sold to the Greeks.
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  #10  
Old 8th September 2006, 19:28
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Baron Wemyss

Commonly known as the "Baron Wemyss ya F**ker". Seemed to be some sort of a war cry.
Joined for my very first trip as junior sparks at Dagenham wharf in July 1966. I couldn't find it so I went back to the gate and was told that the tide was out so I should go back and look over the edge. Lo & Behold there she was.
My first chief sparks refused to sign on 'cos he'd met the Old Man before (Capt Della Minnards - see my gallery). Couldn't get a full crew so he went up and lined up the miscreants at the pool and took his pick.
London to Tampa, Panama, Lyttelton, Dunedin, Bundaberg and Mackay. Set out for Japan and ended up in St John's NB. Back to Tampa, Bluff, Dunedin (Christmas & New Year), Mourilyan, Singapore, Suez and Liverpool by end of Feb '68.
BOT feeding, hardly ever anything fresh. Just about everybody jumped ship except the officers and some of us were sorely tempted in Kiwi. I dined out for years on that trip. Enjoyed every minute of it

PS Attached souvenir
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File Type: jpg Hogarths flag.jpg (111.3 KB, 121 views)

Last edited by K urgess; 8th September 2006 at 19:38..
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  #11  
Old 9th September 2006, 22:19
Roger Turner Roger Turner is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ARRANMAN35
Baron Dunmore was in Burntisland discharghing alumina ore from Takoradi in
Dec 1956.
Have posted a piccie of her in the Gallery.
Was that the one I saw at the ore berth outside Takoradi harbour as we entered - The crew were over the side probably scaling and painting and some body had written "HUNGRY BASTARD" in red lead - somebody said she was a Hogarth ship.
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  #12  
Old 9th September 2006, 23:29
lakercapt lakercapt is offline  
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Fubar
That was the era I sailed on Baron Kinnaird and the exact same route.
What a miserable experiance and I could write a book about all the going on.
Alas the captain had only sailed in Hogarth's and did not know how the other half lived. Thought that everything was as normal. Normal there was not how other ships operated.
After sailing from Liverpool to Tampa and Panama Canal to N.Z. we arrived there to find that there was no mail. Just short of a capital punnishment crime.
It was only the fact that we had two strong apprentices and us three mates that the ship got out of many a port. That included the master who did not understand when the parting should stop. Course when when some of the crew are in his quarters what chance of disipline.
Eventually I had to have a heart to heart with the master and tell him enough was enough and we would not do it again.
Hardly spoke to me for the rest of the trip.
Eight months and it certainly was not one of my most pleasant experiances. It is said that the brain forgets some of the miserable occurances so the ones I rememer must have been only the average. I finally got the letter from my wife confirming that the rabbit had died at the same time she wrote me of the birth of our daughter.
I was told that they improved when they ammalgimated with Lyle Shipping but in my opinion they could only go up as they were worse than any other outfit I worked for.

Felt sorry for the apprentices and they had to complete their indentures with them.
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  #13  
Old 10th September 2006, 02:45
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Lakercapt
I've searched my memory and re-read my diaries and my experience of Hogarth's seems completely removed from your description. This was my first ever trip to sea as a sparkie and I had no idea what to expect. I'd sailed as a steward on a Danish ship while at college but that had been more of a cruise with the Captain making sure I didn't come to any harm.

I'd left home in July '66 expecting to join the Bendoran and was "Shanghaied" on to the Baron Wemyss when I got to Marconi's depot in East Ham. My mother kept my first ever letter and according to that my impression after my first night on board was that she wasn't too bad but a little on the small side. My first chief RO refused to sail but his replacement wasn't much older than me and not one for the usual practical jokes or a hard taskmaster. A very good teacher instilling me with habits I used all through my career as a sparkie.

My letter home suggests that the Mate was promotoed to captain while the regular one went on leave. I can't remember him clearly at all, obviously didn't leave much impression. The regular captain rejoined in Christobal in August. Captain Minnards was a bit of a tyrant in some ways but very fair and appeared to know how to handle a ship. We managed to drop a lifeboat in the Gulf of Carpentaria at lifeboat drill when the falls parted company with the boat because of rotten wood. The move to pick it up again seemed so effortless. We just went around in a circle, stopped with it alongside at number 2 hatch and hoisted it onboard with the derricks. Funny how you remember some things clearly even though they're not written down whereas my diary reminds me of things I just can't remember at all.

He had a policy of no spirits except for senior officers and special celebrations and only 6 beers per man per week. I think this was possibly the cause of some strife. His other annoying habits were that he had to have noon when the sun was overhead so the clocks were advanced or retarted in multiples of 3 minutes (3 watches) which was hell for someone having to start watch on GMT. The other was lecturing us poor sparkies on our morals while sitting on top of the broadcast receiver in the radio room. Woe betide me if I scraped my chair across the deck after he'd gone to bed. Lovely choice of language, wishing to see targets on the radar stand out like "red hot pr**ks"!

There's a thread going on about favourite watering holes at the moment and I can never remember the names. I have a note in this diary about the "Plains" in Lyttleton. Also the "Broadway" and "Gresham" in Dunedin. If anybody reads this far and remembers these places I'd love some memory jogging. The only thing I remember is "Knock three times and ask for Mary". Because of the Kiwi licensing hours most drinking was done after hours by special invitation. It was also pre-decimal. I'd fallen in love in Dunedin so I was happy as a lark.
So far I don't remember anything untoward. She shook like mad when empty so that it was almost impossible to write or drink from a glass. The food was nondescript but edible. We had a pair of Maltese cooks who could work wonders. It's the first time I'd seen an omelette made from dried eggs. They seemed to make the meagre rations go a long way.

We appear to have sunk two beacons and gone aground while leaving Bundaberg. So much for ship handling although that was probably the pilot's fault. I don't think I was very impressed with Queensland having walked to somewhere called Burnett Heads and found even less. Mackay appears to have been a lot better with swimming and lots of "birds" on the beach.
We seem to have broken down a few times crossing back across the Pacific judging by the number of sharks caught. We'd set out for Japan, which I was looking forward to, and ended up in St.John, NB. There's another one "The Centennial" in St John which I vaguely remember because of a certain waitress.

This appears to be where the trouble has started. I got on well with most of the crew and they seemed OK but they must have taken extreme exception to the beer quota. The first jumpers were the 2nd/Stwd "Bootsie" and a donkey greaser, in St John. We'd also had a change of 3rd mate in the same place. An AB had been signed off in Mackay but I think he was an Aussie working his passage home. There had been some empty beer bottles thrown at a tug as we passed through Panama on the way to Canada which had caused a visit by the Canal police.

An EDH was paid off in Tampa and the crew left the ship refusing to sail. I remember that we officers singled up and were ready to cast off when they decided to rejoin us as the accomodation ladder was about to be raised. I think this may have been caused by us either running out of beer altogether or the rationing having been introduced.

While bunkering in Christobal we were tied up in front of the Huntsfield who were only too happy to sell our crew all the beer they could carry. During transit one of the helmsman didn't turn up for his trick so the Mate was sent to get him. He got thumped for his trouble so they persuaded the current helmsman to continue. The relief helmsman then turned up on the bridge just a little worse for wear and thumped the mate again. Before he could be restrained he then thumped the Old Man. That was too much for even his drunken mates so they removed him forcibly. It couldn't go unpunished so the Canal police were called and he was taken off in handcuffs at Miguel lock. I got a chewing from the Old Man because I'd shaken the bloke's hand as he left. He thought I'd agreed with what the bloke had done but the fact was he was from Hull like me and it was just a courtesy.

We appeared to have relieved Kiwi of a few jumpers because all the missing crew was replaced when we arrived at Bluff just before Christmas. Although we also lost an AB who jumped here. We had problems with a derrick when the gooseneck collapsed under load and it punched a hole in the deck. Nobody was hurt but it was close.

Luckily we managed to get back to Dunedin and true love on Christmas Eve. There's yet another one "The Ravensbourne Harbour View Hotel" I do remember this and gallon jugs of beer and "schooner" glasses. I've still got a seven ounce HANZ beer glass.
On New Year's Day the sport seems to have been throw sparklette over the side according to my scribblings. All in fun of course! What happened later wasn't in fun. An example of British seaman's justice. One of the new crew members that had joined in Bluff had an appetite for very young girls from what I remember. Something to do with the Harbour View Hotel which didn't go down well so he was shown the error of his ways by his shipmates and then paid off.
This was one of the few places I thought of jumping. We were both offered jobs TV servicing but decided we'd rather come back home and go out legally than live expecting the "knock".
The bosun was paid off in Dunedin after suffering a nervous breakdown and a DBS was taken on board and locked up in a spare cadet's cabin. We finally left Dunedin on January 5th 1967 and went to load sugar at Mourilyan.
We only had one apprentice and he was an Aussie from Melbourne. He was paid off in Mourilyan and flown home. We signed on a new bosun, an AB and a DHU before sailing for Singapore.

Nothing much more seems to have happened. Probably because we were on our way home relieved that we weren't going to have to complete the full two years of our articles. We docked in Huskisson, Liverpool on February 26th.

Because I was an extra sparkie my cabin was on the boat deck in the cadet's accomodation just aft of the funnel. We only had one cadet and there were about 4 cabins. I think the arrangement was peculiar to Baron boats although I seem to remember reading in a thread that Blue Flue or someone had something similar.

I just seem to have accepted that the crew were a rough lot, that the food wasn't much good, that the lifeboats were rotten, that ships broke down a lot, that water rationing was normal, that my sink would regurgitate the contents of the waste pipes in rough weather and that if you played poker with your shipmates for long enough you would end up all evens again no matter how many beans you got up to.

And very lastly the Old Man asked me to come back! I have not recorded my reply!
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  #14  
Old 10th September 2006, 20:30
ARRANMAN35 ARRANMAN35 is offline  
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Hungry Hogarths

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger Turner
Was that the one I saw at the ore berth outside Takoradi harbour as we entered - The crew were over the side probably scaling and painting and some body had written "HUNGRY BASTARD" in red lead - somebody said she was a Hogarth ship.

Hi Roger,
This would have to have been late Nov, early Dec 1956,
fortunately I was not on board then.
Must say that the " ships side graffiti " reflected the
on board circumstances.
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  #15  
Old 12th September 2006, 12:45
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eldersuk eldersuk is offline  
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Has anyone got a pic of Baron Inchcape (II)? It would be much appreciated for forwarding to an ex Baron boat man in New Zealand.

Derek
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  #16  
Old 12th September 2006, 16:23
lakercapt lakercapt is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eldersuk View Post
Has anyone got a pic of Baron Inchcape (II)? It would be much appreciated for forwarding to an ex Baron boat man in New Zealand.

Derek
Derek
if you go to WWW.scottishshipmanagement.com
they have photos of their last ships and a guest book yu can ask if its not posted
regards
Bill
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  #17  
Old 12th September 2006, 21:16
Tony Breach Tony Breach is offline
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Sir William Reardon Smith was master in Hogarth's barque DRUMADOON in 1881 at age 25. He did OK for himself!

Hogarths got caught with 8 Ruston AO engines in 4 bulkies. (Reardon Smiths also got caught & RFA) Anyone know who paid for that fiasco & the re-engining of the ships?
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  #18  
Old 13th September 2006, 14:00
robertblack36 robertblack36 is offline  
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Baron Boats

I was on the island of Masirah just of the coast of Oman 1966 to 1967.
there is, or was, a "Cairn" commerating the demise of the crew of the Baron Inverdale or Baron Inverclyde (i am not sure if the names are correct) that had run aground on the island.The natives of the killed the crew when they came ashore. An RN gunboat was sent to the area and the Sultan? of Oman was told that the islanders had to be punished. The Sultan, (if these events are correct) had all the males over the age of twelve killed and the islanders were not allowed to have any brick built homes. They were still using old oil drums from the power station when i was there.The date as to when this happened, as most dates now, seem to have been in the grey-matter that has now gone into limbo.
On the Western end of the island there was an old counter-stern cargo vessel
named "Electra". The story of her, is that they miss-judged the tide (flooding
not ebbing). After getting safely off, the vessel re-floated, some of the crew went back onboard and made sure she was hard and fast aground.
On the Eastern end there was a tanker name World Glory. The tale on her was, that she was on her maiden voyage. I have posted this in here, in the hope that some of the Hogarth Co. stalwarts can expand/correct my memories.
The odd BP tanker (the three twelve type) would call in and pump ashore fuel
to the tank farm.
And to finish (my memory is having flashbacks) there is a stop-over landing stage for British Imperial Airways flying seaplanes to the eastern routes. They winched the seaplane out of the water up a ramp. The date when built was written in the cement, again i cannot remember, my memory has stopped flashing.

I seem to have written much more than i intented to this thread, sorry to have waffled on, "having one of my senior moments".
regards
Robert.
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  #19  
Old 13th September 2006, 14:34
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Baron Innerdale was built in 1896 and lost in 1914 in a collison in the Red Sea with the African Monarch whilst on passage from Port Said to Calcutta with salt. The name doesn't appear to have been used again.

The only Baron Inverclyde was scrapped at Bilbao in 1972.

Hope this stirs the grey cells Robert

Cheers
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  #20  
Old 13th September 2006, 15:20
trotterdotpom trotterdotpom is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony Breach View Post
Sir William Reardon Smith was master in Hogarth's barque DRUMADOON in 1881 at age 25. He did OK for himself!

Hogarths got caught with 8 Ruston AO engines in 4 bulkies. (Reardon Smiths also got caught & RFA) Anyone know who paid for that fiasco & the re-engining of the ships?
Tony, Scottish Ship Management (Hogarths, Lyles and Lamberts of London) had ships with Ruston AO engines. As far as I know the companies each paid the price themselves. No doubt a couple of heads rolled.

On Baron Ardrossan (the new one), my three month trip took eleven months and finished in Amsterdam where the engines were replaced with Werkspoors - not a huge improvement by all accounts. We had a Ruston Engineer permanently on board, all the way from sunny Lincoln. He was a hero.

John T.
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  #21  
Old 13th September 2006, 16:17
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Robert,

Thanks for your waffle and flashbacks! You have cleared up a mystery for me and a friend. My friend was in the RAF as an airframe fitter for 22 years. He told me that he was posted to Oman and that they were not allowed any buildings! They lived in the crates used to transport spares or tents in the desert. There were always locals hanging around for the empty oil drums or any scraps of wood. He only went because it fast tracked him to sergeant rank! On his return to Blighty, because he had spent no money basically in 15 months, he went straight out and bought a big colour television! Remember this was around 1970.

Thanks again Robert!

Dave "Birthday Boy" R.
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  #22  
Old 14th September 2006, 12:53
robertblack36 robertblack36 is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marconi Sahib View Post
Baron Innerdale was built in 1896 and lost in 1914 in a collison in the Red Sea with the African Monarch whilst on passage from Port Said to Calcutta with salt. The name doesn't appear to have been used again.

The only Baron Inverclyde was scrapped at Bilbao in 1972.

Hope this stirs the grey cells Robert

Cheers
Hi Fumar. Many thanks for your info, I assume that the name Innerdale was a typing error. I have decided to name the ship Baron Sumthin.
One thing for sure is the Cairn, some RAF gents repaired it when I was there.
I did try to reply yesterday And failed. My memory requires a good shaking, not stirred!!! thanks again, Robert.
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  #23  
Old 14th September 2006, 13:22
robertblack36 robertblack36 is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by makko View Post
Robert,

Thanks for your waffle and flashbacks! You have cleared up a mystery for me and a friend. My friend was in the RAF as an airframe fitter for 22 years. He told me that he was posted to Oman and that they were not allowed any buildings! They lived in the crates used to transport spares or tents in the desert. There were always locals hanging around for the empty oil drums or any scraps of wood. He only went because it fast tracked him to sergeant rank! On his return to Blighty, because he had spent no money basically in 15 months, he went straight out and bought a big colour television! Remember this was around 1970.

Thanks again Robert!

Dave "Birthday Boy" R.
Hello Dave. Many thanks for your reply. I think that your friend may have been at Salalah which is on the mainland of the Oman to the west of Masirah.
A dangerous place to be at that time. The service men and civies (not locals) on Masirah were living in brick built accommodation. Your friend will most likely have been on Masirah, the only way to get to Salahah was by air from there in a rather bumpy flight on a small aircraft. Your friend may have heard of my Baron Sumthin. regards Robert.

Last edited by robertblack36; 14th September 2006 at 16:24..
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  #24  
Old 14th September 2006, 16:43
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Robert

Sorry, no it wasn't a typo. If it was then it's the world ship society's fault.
She's listed in the index and on the right page as the "Innerdale". There were only ever two "Invers" as Barons and they were the "Inverclyde" and "Inverforth".

The "Inverforth" was built in 1965, sold in 1969 and is still in service as the "Margio".

I suppose "Baron Dunmore" might also be appropriate.

Cheers
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  #25  
Old 4th November 2006, 18:52
Tom Logan Tom Logan is offline  
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnila View Post
Nobody out there prepared to admit signing on a Baron Boat? Ijoined the Baron Pentland 1962 in Bremen( Prescot St Pool ) gave us 1 each and put us on the train to Harwich.8 month trip 7 ports.Wish I was in her now.
I did NOT sign on a Baron boat. But I did join the Bellhaven in Hull as 3rd.Mate,must have been early 1954, worked by for a couple of weeks without signing on, decided I didn't like it mainly as she was bound for Takaridi and not Tampico as I had been told by the Pool in Glasgow, so left her after a stand-up row with the Super, who claimed I couln't 'desert'. Pointed out I had never signed on in the first place. A pity. really, as the super, who shall remain nameless, had been a family friend, and I had been at school with his son. Ah well.
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