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  #26  
Old 8th August 2006, 20:05
ccwmariner ccwmariner is offline  
 
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Captain Edward Fegen VC

Captain Fegen was actually a naval officer, nothing RNR about him. The AMC Jervis Bay was actually under the white ensign when she met her end in the Atlantic. There were a large number of MN personnel on board at the time but they were under T124 Articles. The Chief Engineer was one such officer.

Fegen was the son and grandson of naval officers. He served at sea throughout the First World War, after attending Dartmouth. He also served as commanding officer of the Royal Australian Navy's College at, Jervis Bay. He took command of Jervis Bay in March 1940.

Another Victoria Cross was awarded to an Orient Line officer serving as the commanding officer of the trawler 'Arab'. Richard Been Stannard survived the war and rejoined the Orient Line, eventually finishing his career as Marine Superintendent of P&O Orient Lines in Australia. He died in Sydney in July 1977. Richard Stannard was the first RNR officer to be awarded the VC during the 2nd World War.
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  #27  
Old 21st August 2006, 20:57
Dave Anderson Dave Anderson is offline  
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Jervis Bay

Can anyone tell me where I can purchase a copy of the painting of the Jarvis Bay in action. I beleive the original painting used to hang in the merchant navy hotel in Liverpool
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  #28  
Old 21st August 2006, 21:25
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Merchant Navy VCs

Captain Bisset Smith, who went down with his ship, the Otaki after being attacked by the Moewe was a civilian and therefore not strictly entitled to receive the VC, so he was posthumously gazetted a lieutenant in the Royal Naval Reserve as a workaround solution.

On the 22nd. of May in 1920, a Royal Warrant changed the rules as to the award of the VC, and added the Mercantile Marine, as shown below -

Sixthly: It is ordained that:-

1) Officers, Warrant Officers and subordinate Officers hereinafter referred to as Officers, Chief Petty Officers and Petty Officers, hereinafter referred to as Petty Officer, men and boys hereinafter referred to as Seamen serving in - (a) Our Navy or in ships of any description for the time being under Naval Command; (b) Our Indian Marine Service; (c) Navies or Marine Services of Our Dominions, Colonies, Dependencies or Protectorates; and (d) Our Mercantile Marine whilst serving under Naval or Military Authority, or who in the course of their duties may become subject to enemy action.

2) Officers, Warrant Officers, Non-commissioned Officers, men and boys hereinafter referred to as Marines, serving in Our Marines.

3) Officers, Warrant Officers (Classes I and II), Non-commissioned Officers, men and boys hereinafter referred to as Privates, of all ranks serving in Our Army, Our Army Reserve, Our Territorial or other forces, and the forces of Our Dominions, Colonies, Dependencies or Protectorates.

4) Officers, Warrant Officers, Non-commissioned Officers, and Airmen in the ranks of Our Air Force, or the Air Forces of Our Dominions, Colonies, Dependencies or Protectorates.

5) British and Indian Officers and men of all ranks of Our Indian Army, the Imperial Service Troops of Native States of India or any other Forces there serving under the Command, guidance, or direction of any British or Indian Officer, or of a Political Officer attached to such Forces on Our behalf.

6) Matrons, Sisters, Nurses of the staff of the Nursing Services and other Services pertaining to Hospitals and Nursing, and Civilians of either sex serving regularly or temporarily under the Orders, direction or supervision of any of the above mentioned Forces shall be eligible for the decoration of the Cross.

Not a lot of people know that
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  #29  
Old 22nd August 2006, 02:07
John B. John B. is offline
 
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Jervis Bay Painting

Many years ago as a Reserve officer I attended the RAN Staff college,HMAS PENGUIN, a painting of the JERVIS BAY action was displayed in the College, it looked like an original, presume it is still there.

brgds John B.
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  #30  
Old 10th May 2007, 09:53
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Jervis Bay

There have been mentions recently of the present Jervis Bay retaining the name following the welcome decision by Maersk Line.
Also there will be a ceremony at Kirkill, Wick, to unveil a plaque honouring the nine Caithness sailors who sailed on her.
I can remember someone reciting the Ballad of Jervis Bay when I was not long at sea and was glad to see part of it in this thread.
My interest was aroused fairly recently when I learnt that a neighbour was the daughter of Horace Nicholls, an AB who survived the sinking of the Jervis Bay. My neighbour, Grace, can remember her father returning as a very traumatised man and that November 5th was never celebrated in her house.
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  #31  
Old 10th May 2007, 13:14
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Jervis Bay was prefixed HMS, hence Captain Fegan, being RNR & probably a Leuitenant Commander, not strictly being 'civilian' in time of war & getting the VC. The R.A.N. has kept the name going for a lot longer than any 'British' company & rightly so. I would imagine the VC & other artifacts on display on present day JB are most likely copies due to the originals commercial worth?

We will see how long Maersk keep this name...........When is the next dry dock due?
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  #32  
Old 10th May 2007, 20:33
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There was one other V.C. awarded to a ship's master in the 14-18 war, the ship was the Anglo? ( I can't remember but it might be Anglo Canadian)
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  #33  
Old 11th May 2007, 06:33
vic pitcher vic pitcher is offline  
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Quote:
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There was one other V.C. awarded to a ship's master in the 14-18 war, the ship was the Anglo? ( I can't remember but it might be Anglo Canadian)
London Gazette 24th May 1919: VCs awarded to Captain Frederick Parslow of Lawther Latta's "Anglo-Californian and Captain Archibald Smith of NZS's "Otaki"
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  #34  
Old 11th May 2007, 09:05
Cap'n Pete Cap'n Pete is offline  
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SN members will be pleased to learn to that Maersk Line (A.P.Moller) have now decided to retain the name of m.v. Jervis Bay.

As master of the Jervis Bay, it gives me great pleasure to thank Maersk Line as charterers, and Reederei Blue Star as owners, for their consideration of the views of the families of those who gave their lives on HMAMS Jervis Bay, and those of us who have proudly served on ships since honoured with the name.

For information, a number of family members of those who served on the HMAMS Jervis Bay have sailed on the present Jervis Bay, including our first chief engineer who was the son of one those who gave their lives.

The present Jervis Bay is now 15 years old. However, I hope that Maersk Line will transfer the name to a new build when my ship is finally sent to the recycling yard. I feel it is very important that we remember the contribution made by the Jervis Bay and her mixed crew of naval and merchant seamen and the great sacrifice they made for their country.
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  #35  
Old 11th May 2007, 14:40
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Hip Hip Hooray ! So some tradition is still alive and kicking - Congrats Capt. and may she sail to many many more horizons with such an auspicious and honorable name. Cheers , Alex
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  #36  
Old 11th May 2007, 17:58
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Originally Posted by AlexBooth View Post
Hip Hip Hooray ! So some tradition is still alive and kicking - Congrats Capt. and may she sail to many many more horizons with such an auspicious and honorable name. Cheers , Alex

Hear, Hear to that.
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  #37  
Old 12th May 2007, 07:01
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Originally Posted by Cap'n Pete View Post
SN members will be pleased to learn to that Maersk Line (A.P.Moller) have now decided to retain the name of m.v. Jervis Bay.

I feel it is very important that we remember the contribution made by the Jervis Bay and her mixed crew of naval and merchant seamen and the great sacrifice they made for their country.
Congratulations Cap'n Pete on having the name retained and as you state, it is very important that we all remember.

As an aside, I sailed on the present (your) Jervis Bay on one of her first voyages. At that time she was on the Europe - Far East trade. Just had a look at the old book and it was the 9/2/93 that I joined her in Southampton. Unfortunately I am unable to decipher the Master's signature and I have a memory like a sieve.

G.
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  #38  
Old 12th May 2007, 15:33
trotterdotpom trotterdotpom is offline  
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What does 'Maersk Dalton' mean? Can't they call her 'Maersk Jervis Bay'?

Jervis Bay is in Australia, if Moller's decide to pull a number and change the ship's name, why not enlist the aid of Princess Mary, the Australian wife of Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark?

Just a thought.

John T.
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  #39  
Old 12th May 2007, 16:46
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[QUOTE=trotterdotpom;126808]What does 'Maersk Dalton' mean? Can't they call her 'Maersk Jervis Bay'?

Jervis Bay is in Australia, if Moller's decide to pull a number and change the ship's name, why not enlist the aid of Princess Mary, the Australian wife of Crown Prince Frederick of Denmark?

Just a thought.

That name sounds like the right idea John but will A.P.Moller do it? I think not
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  #40  
Old 13th September 2007, 22:26
graymay graymay is offline
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I sailed on the last Jervis in 81-82, i had a wonderful time on the Kiwi coast and the memories are special.

Mr Moller is a ruthless buissness man who has no compassion whatsoever and the word 'respect' is certainly not in his vocabulary. Not many people prosperred during the war, however Mr Moller was one of them, shame on him!
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  #41  
Old 14th September 2007, 09:57
Shipbuilder Shipbuilder is offline
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Was ever tale more splendid told of gold & green & geen & gold?
Was ever gallant maid more gay & debonair than JERVIS BAY?
Half sister she to many a queen & fair princess from Aberdeen,
Bedecked in gold, begowned in green -

http://img70.imageshack.us/img70/4263/jervisbay0em.jpg
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  #42  
Old 14th September 2007, 11:45
Brian Dobbie Brian Dobbie is offline  
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Lets not forget that the present Jervis Bay has only four British Officers in the compliment, the rest of the Officers are Ukrainian and the ratings are Filipinos.
Other ships in this class have no British left onboard all the Officers are Ukrainian and ratings Filipino.
The Jervis Bay is owned and managed by a German Ship ManagementCompany and all onboard have German labour Contracts and are paid by the German Ship Management Company.
The British still sail under the old T&C's, even although they have German Labour Contracts, but for how long???
Even the two Cadets are Filipino.

We must never forget the sacrifice of the men in WW2 but things have changed, we have to live in this world as it is in 2007.

Brian
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  #43  
Old 5th November 2007, 12:37
Cap'n Pete Cap'n Pete is offline  
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The other ships in the Jervis Bay class are returning to top-4 British manning.

Those of us at sea do live in the real world and we continue to fight for what we consider to be right for us. The Jervis Bay is German-owned, etc. as Brian quite rightly says, but it is still called the Jervis Bay because our voices were heard by Maersk.

I firmly believe that British seafarers have an important part to play in world shipping and that we still retain an influence and strength which goes way beyond the numbers of us who remain at sea.

It will be a sad day when the last British seafarer goes down the gangway, but that day is still a long way off. In the meantime, and in collaboration with other European officers trade unions, we will continue to strive for fairness, and an end to exploitation of seafarers no matter where they come from.
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  #44  
Old 5th November 2007, 13:39
Chouan Chouan is offline  
 
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Interesting that again, with no disrespect to the Jervis Bay or her Officers and Crew, the Royal Navy get all the credit and the recognition whilst the true heroes of the day are ignored or forgotten.
The Admiralty Made Coffin HMS Jervis Bay bravely held off the Scheer for about 20 minutes before going down, losing 190 of her 255 crew, giving convoy HX 84 time to scatter, but not time to escape.
However, the CP general cargo ship "Beaverford", defensively armed with a 4" gun aft managed, through skilful manoevring, to maintain the Scheer's attention for 4 1/2 hours until nightfall, essentially allowing most of the rest of the convoy to escape before being sunk with all hands. Part of her cargo was munitions!
Despite this, we all know about the Jervis Bay, a warship doing its duty, admittedly, an auxiliary warship with obsolete guns, but we are ignorant of the role played by a truly heroic Merchant Ship.
Is this simple ignorance? or symptomatic of an obsession with the armed forces at the expense of the Merch, despite the fact that most of the contributors to this thread, and this forum are ex Merch?
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  #45  
Old 5th November 2007, 14:46
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I read about the 'Beaverford' in Richard Woodmans excellent book and I too had never heard of her before.
As I recall witnesses said she simply disappeared in a cloud of fire and smoke - obviously a shell from the Admiral Scheer had detonated her cargo of ammunition.
To go up against a Pocket Battleship with 11inch guns with nothing more than a poop mounted 4 inch almost defies belief - brave men indeed.
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  #46  
Old 5th November 2007, 15:08
K urgess K urgess is offline
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Partly the force of the media again.
The Master of one of the Polish vessels wrote to the Times (I think that was the one, can't blame the Daily Mirror for everything) and Jervis Bay became a Cause Celebre.
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  #47  
Old 5th November 2007, 16:32
whiskey johnny whiskey johnny is offline  
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sir
glad that theyretained the name for the jervis bay but as they say in denmark the seven pointed star in the funnel of the maersk schipsindicate that for the company there are seven working days in a week
do not expect sentiment from such a company yours jan
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  #48  
Old 5th November 2007, 17:46
Steve Woodward Steve Woodward is offline  
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Today being the 67th anniversary of her loss perhaps a look at the circumstances of that night are in order.
Jervis Bay was a Vickers built 1922 Aberdeen & Commonwealth Line steamer armed with seven Mk7 6" guns built and designed ironically by Vickers, they were originally removed from scrapped warships, not of WW2 nor WW1 in fact they dated from an 1895 design and would have been carried in ships of the 1900-05 years, they fired a shell weighing 100 lbs and used bagged propellant with a range of almost 18,000 yards when new. Against them the Scheer was using six guns of 11" calibre designed in 1928 firing a 661 lbs shell of considerable more range almost 40,000 yards. plus of course eight 5.9".

Ships sunk that night were, with lives lost:
Jervis Bay 187
Beaverford 77
Kenbane head 24
Maidean 91 ( all hands)
Trewelland 16
Vigaland 12

It has been suggested that the Jervis bay was singled out for medals, praise etc at the benefit of the other ships who sank and lost men that day, however Captain E.S.F.Fegen whilst giving the order for the convoy to scatter attacked a far large adversary with only one possible outcome, when he gave the order to scatter Fegen's ship was one of the fastest in the convoy, even though 15 knots was not all that fast she would still have had a chance to escape had fegen chosen to scatter as well.
Because of Fegens bravery others got that chance thats wy he deserves the VC

Last edited by Steve Woodward; 5th November 2007 at 18:00..
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  #49  
Old 5th November 2007, 18:16
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Originally Posted by Marconi Sahib View Post
Partly the force of the media again.
The Master of one of the Polish vessels wrote to the Times (I think that was the one, can't blame the Daily Mirror for everything) and Jervis Bay became a Cause Celebre.
Captain Piekarski of the small Polish ship Puck

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  #50  
Old 5th November 2007, 18:28
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Steve,
In a similar vein you could say the Master of the Beaverford was also worthy of a VC.
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