MSC Opera in Venice - Ships Nostalgia
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MSC Opera in Venice

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  #1  
Old 3rd June 2019, 12:01
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norm.h norm.h is offline  
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MSC Opera in Venice

Notwithstanding the need to wait for the result of any inquiry, are there any views from the Deck or Engine room on what might have happened?
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  #2  
Old 3rd June 2019, 12:15
eddyw eddyw is offline  
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CPP control failure ??
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  #3  
Old 3rd June 2019, 12:27
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norm.h norm.h is offline  
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Could be....

"At 1840 on 20 December 2013, the 93m chemical tanker Key Bora made heavy contact with the western approach jetty at Alexandra Dock, Hull. The vesselís CPP system had a history of responding slowly to demands for astern pitch, and did not respond in time to the pilotís order of full astern to prevent the bow striking the quay. The bulbous bow was holed above the waterline."

Source - https://www.gov.uk/maib-reports/fail...k-hull-england
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  #4  
Old 3rd June 2019, 12:28
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Stephen J. Card Stephen J. Card is offline  
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I would think. The MSC OPERA has podded 'things'. Of course CPP is a small part with the equation. Can't steer either! At least the anchor was dropped. They should have both!
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  #5  
Old 3rd June 2019, 13:42
borderreiver borderreiver is offline  
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would not surprise me to find it was the bridge control system ie changing from center console to wing console and it all broke down during the change.
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  #6  
Old 3rd June 2019, 14:40
callpor callpor is offline   SN Supporter
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Interesting you should discuss the MSC OPERA incident in Venice and yet no one on SN mentioned the far more serious incident at Budapest on the Danube in which 28 people have died?
The solution for Venice is simple and already an Italian government recommendation. they just need to implement it.
The Budapest incident is far more complex but deserves a lot more attention.
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  #7  
Old 3rd June 2019, 16:56
eddyw eddyw is offline  
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Apparently pod 'things' have fixed pitched props. At least no fatalities.
Budapest accident tragic. Master of "Viking Sigyn" arrested and charged with "endangering waterborne traffic resulting in multiple deaths".

Last edited by eddyw; 3rd June 2019 at 17:02..
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  #8  
Old 3rd June 2019, 18:28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by callpor View Post
Interesting you should discuss the MSC OPERA incident in Venice and yet no one on SN mentioned the far more serious incident at Budapest on the Danube in which 28 people have died?
The solution for Venice is simple and already an Italian government recommendation. they just need to implement it.
The Budapest incident is far more complex but deserves a lot more attention.
Agreed, and I too find the lack of mention strange, but my interest in the MSC Opera incident was more to do with understanding the possible technicalities that may have caused the incident, rather than the environmental solution, as I hoped the OP explained.
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  #9  
Old 3rd June 2019, 20:00
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If available...Ö......the bow thruster should have taken it away from the berth ?

David
+
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  #10  
Old 3rd June 2019, 21:28
KEITHMAR KEITHMAR is offline  
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Well done Calpor! Nearly a week, and no comments on here.I was beginning to think that no one cared, perhaps its a Brexit symptom?perhaps We are All asleep? ... but all thoughts to the families of the victims of this horrific accident.A horrid cold ,wet night ,strong currents and the Danube in full flood ..... Ghastly!
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  #11  
Old 4th June 2019, 10:00
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MSC Opera in Venice

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Originally Posted by david.hopcroft View Post
If available...…......the bow thruster should have taken it away from the berth ?

David
+
From the videos available, I guess there was too much headway for the thrusters to have full effect. Most of those vessels have triple thrusters and their power is pretty awesome. Who knows, maybe their control system was also down or partly down as well as the main engine.
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  #12  
Old 4th June 2019, 10:03
Ian Lawson Ian Lawson is offline  
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Port anchor may have helped!
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  #13  
Old 4th June 2019, 11:20
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What puzzles me is the report that the engine was 'locked'
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  #14  
Old 4th June 2019, 12:29
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MSC Opera in Venice

Quote:
Originally Posted by norm.h View Post
What puzzles me is the report that the engine was 'locked'
Media!!! No hope for them. They probably think it was a tanker.
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  #15  
Old 4th June 2019, 13:54
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Stephen J. Card Stephen J. Card is offline  
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LOL You never know what they will say. They think the first word that comes to their mind what will fit the 'event'.


Looking at the video I would suggest the thrusters ARE working to bring the ship away from the dock. If not there would have a loud crunch. The minimal damage on the starboard side at waterline seems 'cosmetic'. The ship was moved away from the dock with the cruise boat and the anchor cable embedded.

The two tugs that are supposed to guide the vessels through the canal are obviously a waste of time. Perhaps bigger tugs and slower speed through the canal.
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  #16  
Old 4th June 2019, 14:17
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MSC Opera in Venice

Quote:- "slower speed ". Indeed and would have given the thrusters a bit more bite. They clearly were working.
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  #17  
Old 4th June 2019, 16:29
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Varley Varley is offline   SN Supporter
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A tanker with a locked engine. By golly they were lucky.
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  #18  
Old 4th June 2019, 18:07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duquesa View Post
Quote:- "slower speed ". Indeed and would have given the thrusters a bit more bite. They clearly were working.
Looking at the video on a few more 'points of interest'. The port anchor was not dropped. That indicates the master was trying to slew the bow. Also probably indicates the thrusters were working. Also the tug was made fast. Not sure how the cruise boat managed to get under the wire!

Over the years we have heard of mishaps when changing over from centre control to bridge wing position. When the vessel is approaching the pilot, you would assume that all control position are tested. That is fine. Then the wing controls probably back to standby. Then making the change back to the wing is probably when the 'engines get locked'. For best safety ALL control systems should be activated at end of voyage until the vessel is alongside
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  #19  
Old 7th June 2019, 01:16
mrcruisine mrcruisine is offline  
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It will be interesting to see what comes of an inquiry.

This link is interesting https://www.maritime-executive.com/e...engine-control

However having been involved with electric propulsion systems for many years, why didnt they hit the emergency stop on the bridge as these pod systems are AC drive electric controlled and this shuts down the drive immediately, the Opera has 2 x Alstom POD's and 4 Wartsila gensets. I would suggest an element of operational error involved notwithstanding the failure as well. The Opera had an ER fire back around 2011 or so I think.
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  #20  
Old 7th June 2019, 02:06
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Stephen J. Card Stephen J. Card is offline  
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The author of the 'maritime-executive' piece has no idea what he is talking about. Obviously he does not what 'azipods' actually do.
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  #21  
Old 7th June 2019, 02:12
mrcruisine mrcruisine is offline  
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Totally agree and the link was merely to show what the "informed" press was saying. I have been involved with these type of systems and still am unable to understand why they didnt hit the emergency stop as all systems have these on bridge console, instant shut down, but locked engines was a bit amusing I have to say. Also the two pods an operate independently so why they didnt shut down the "faulty" unit and azimuth the other and go astern, who knows and will be a very interesting report, I have done many FMEA of electric propulsion systems and commissioning quite a few more and so unable to figure out how they came to be in this situation.
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  #22  
Old 7th June 2019, 07:40
Engine Serang Engine Serang is online now  
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Any "British Tickets" on board?
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  #23  
Old 7th June 2019, 10:17
seaman38 seaman38 is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Engine Serang View Post
Any "British Tickets" on board?
Over 50,000 merchant vessels currently plying the world's oceans, employing over 1.5 million seafarers, doubt many British certificates among that lot, but, alas, on the whole they seem to be doing okay without us
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  #24  
Old 17th June 2019, 21:01
harry t. harry t. is online now
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MSC Opera - Venice

https://youtu.be/HefM2KcSdJ8

https://youtu.be/2gxCM_F5QXI

https://youtu.be/cUInKNgZdDA

https://youtu.be/Ex57oHXPISg

https://youtu.be/gnPhEXXyGG0
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Last edited by harry t.; 17th June 2019 at 21:25.. Reason: additional info
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  #25  
Old 17th June 2019, 22:29
Barrie Youde Barrie Youde is offline  
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Ouch!

There, but for the Grace of God............
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