WWII HMS Manxman - Ships Nostalgia
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WWII HMS Manxman

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  #1  
Old 27th March 2015, 20:02
david freeman david freeman is offline  
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WWII HMS Manxman

My father in law was at the battle of Matapan, and was a radio operator. While steaming in the med it is alleged that the admiralty sent a message to the Manxman (Fast Mine Layer) to steam at all haste from Med to NW Europe or the otherway around. However a speed may have been quoted which as an engineer astounds me It was in excess of I believe 30 Knots. any takers??? at a guess I have no idea, but those discussing the orders believe it was a closed ship with battern down hatches as the open deck was not a safe place to be? Off course it could be all smoke and mirrors!!!
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Old 27th March 2015, 20:13
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I believe it to be true - Fast destroyers etc. of most nations could achieve well over 30kts. (34-38) and some were even capable of 40!
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Old 27th March 2015, 21:00
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Quote:
Originally Posted by david freeman View Post
My father in law was at the battle of Matapan, and was a radio operator. While steaming in the med it is alleged that the admiralty sent a message to the Manxman (Fast Mine Layer) to steam at all haste from Med to NW Europe or the otherway around. However a speed may have been quoted which as an engineer astounds me It was in excess of I believe 30 Knots. any takers??? at a guess I have no idea, but those discussing the orders believe it was a closed ship with battern down hatches as the open deck was not a safe place to be? Off course it could be all smoke and mirrors!!!
In the sixties Manxman was still going strong although she had one of her three funnels removed - presumably all of her boilers could not be brought on line. I was based with the RFA in Singapore at the time and our replenishment tanker ras'd her a few times. Speaking to one of her engineers he stated that originally, when laying mines and all boilers were brought on line she could top over 40 knots. I can quite believe it as she was a fairly small and narrow vessel (when compared to a Daring class for example) and had over 70,000 shaft horsepower at her disposal.


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Old 27th March 2015, 23:29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LouisB View Post
In the sixties Manxman was still going strong although she had one of her three funnels removed - presumably all of her boilers could not be brought on line. I was based with the RFA in Singapore at the time and our replenishment tanker ras'd her a few times. Speaking to one of her engineers he stated that originally, when laying mines and all boilers were brought on line she could top over 40 knots. I can quite believe it as she was a fairly small and narrow vessel (when compared to a Daring class for example) and had over 70,000 shaft horsepower at her disposal.


LouisB.
Crikey Louis! I seem to remember from way, way back when I built the Airfix kit of Manxman that she was the fastest vessel in the navy. You seem to confirm this.
Rgds.
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Old 28th March 2015, 01:23
IMRCoSparks IMRCoSparks is offline  
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Doing sea trials after a refit in 1958 aboard HMS Apollo, sister ship of Manxman, the bridge announced over the Tannoy that the speed was 34 knots.
Everything was shaking and vibrating and I wondered at the time how much faster it could have gone without falling apart. The ship maintained that speed for about an hour before slowing. I was assured at the time by the stokers that it was quite capable of 40 knots if necessary.
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  #6  
Old 28th March 2015, 03:53
McCloggie McCloggie is offline  
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One storey about Manxman says she was exercising in the Med with the US Navy. The US Admiral ordered a course and speed alteration and as she was an old ship sinalled "Manxman make best speed".

Manxman's CO wound up the speed and as she passed the US carrier signalled back "when would youmlike me to stop?"

True or not I do not know but it was one of my father's favourite yarns.

McC
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  #7  
Old 1st April 2015, 14:51
Brian Smither Brian Smither is offline  
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[QUOTE=LouisB;1338002. I can quite believe it as she was a fairly small and narrow vessel (when compared to a Daring class for example) and had over 70,000 shaft horsepower at her disposal.

I was in Diamond 1953 - 1956. We were ordered back to Chatham from Gibraltar poste haste. I remember we did 30 - 32 knots all the way. We had 54,000hp at our disposal, at the time I was after engine room watchkeeper, the Chadburn registered 300 - 320 rpm all the way. At the time it was rumoured that we still had a few more knots to spare but was probably worried about running out of fuel!
Unfortunately I can't remember now how long we took but it was very exciting stuff for an 18 year old stroker! Needless to say I was kept very busy taking Plummer block temperatures and numerous other readings all having to be written up in the register hourly.
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Old 1st April 2015, 15:47
stewart4866 stewart4866 is offline  
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My father was on the Manxman during the war. One of her missions was to load stores etc on the main mine deck and run the gauntlet to Malta at full speed 40 knots, no other ship could catch her.
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  #9  
Old 1st April 2015, 19:20
Scatari Scatari is offline  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by david freeman View Post
My father in law was at the battle of Matapan, and was a radio operator. While steaming in the med it is alleged that the admiralty sent a message to the Manxman (Fast Mine Layer) to steam at all haste from Med to NW Europe or the otherway around. However a speed may have been quoted which as an engineer astounds me It was in excess of I believe 30 Knots. any takers??? at a guess I have no idea, but those discussing the orders believe it was a closed ship with battern down hatches as the open deck was not a safe place to be? Off course it could be all smoke and mirrors!!!
David:

As built, the six ships of the Abdiel Class (of which Manxman was a member) were rated as having a top speed of 39.75 knots ... and all apparently achieved speeds in excess of 35 knots on initial sea trials.
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  #10  
Old 7th April 2015, 08:17
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My Dad was on the Apollo from 43 - 44, and he was very proud of the fact that she could make in excess of 41 knots (possibly builders trials) she took Churchill, Eisenhower & others over to Normandy just after D-Day, sadly she ran aground, and had to limp home.
But his tales of minelaying at speed off the French ports were fascinating.
Janes 1952 quotes 72,000SHP on 4,000 tons full load, (2,650 tons light) speed 40 knots maximum.
Of the 6 built I think Latona was the shortest lived, about 8 months from memory, before being bombed in Malta. .
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  #11  
Old 6th June 2020, 20:21
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Fast minelayers

When I was serving onboard EAGLE in 1956 we were carrying out full power trials in the Bay of Biscay enroute to the Med and achieved the incredible speed of 30.5 knots, which was remarkable for a ship of our size. While we were thundering along with everything vibrating, a broadcast was made advising, "those who could be spared to go up on deck and watch APOLLO passing us - doing over 40 knots"!

There has always been controversy among armchair sailors about APOLLO's ability to steam at that speed but I can vouch for it, having watched her plough past and overtake us. She was one of a class of fast minelayers, the like of which we shall never see again.
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  #12  
Old 7th June 2020, 16:29
postyman postyman is offline
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Manxman was broken up at cashmores NEWPORT 1973. SHIPS BELL in WAR MUSEUM.MALTA.
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  #13  
Old 7th June 2020, 18:42
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Manxman was in Singapore Naval Base when I first arrived in 1964 in an RFA. She was there for a good few years in the sixties. My ships refuelled her at sea on several occasions. The story of her fast voyage was being told back then.
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  #14  
Old 15th June 2020, 04:24
blueprint2002 blueprint2002 is offline  
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Manxman

It was sometimes said that the WW2 Abdiel-class were equipped with cruiser machinery in a destroyer hull, so as to give them the necessary speed. Though not literally true, this is borne out, in essence, by official records, some of which are still to be found on the excellent websites dedicated to Clyde-built and Tyne-built ships. Here they for Apollo and Welshman, both incomplete, perhaps due to the exigencies of war.
By way of comparison, the records of the typical contemporary destroyer Kelly, and cruiser Manchester, are also attached. Some interesting figures (rounded off):
K-class destroyer: 2x20,000hp, LOA 360ft, Std Disp 2000tons, Speed 34.5kts.
Abdiel-class minelayer: 2x36,000hp, LOA 420ft, Std Disp 2650tons.
Town-class cruiser: 4x20,625hp, LOA 590ft, Trial Disp 9700tons, Speed 32.6kts.
So the Abdiels certainly had cruiser-type power, crammed into slightly stretched, destroyer-type hulls.
Some other figures that are also revealing, if you were to compare:
Propeller diameter, pitch and RPM
Boiler heating surface together with boiler pressure
Total length of the machinery spaces.
Clearly, around forty knots was no exaggeration.
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File Type: jpg HMS Apollo 1944.jpg (209.7 KB, 9 views)
File Type: jpg HMS Welshman 1941.jpg (240.4 KB, 5 views)
File Type: jpg HMS Kelly 1939.jpg (256.7 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg HMS Manchester 1938.jpg (253.9 KB, 6 views)
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  #15  
Old 15th June 2020, 04:56
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As a young man talking of max ship speed and other things the skipper told me about the time he served in destroyers during the war, he was in one of the escorts for a fast convoy, 20 Knots+, connected to the Balikpapan landings. When it came time to leave the convoy to its own devices, the destroyer leader decided to show the so called fast convoy a demo of an ocean greyhound departure. When he had reached 32 knots, he was shocked; the entire convoy overtook him and disappeared over the horizon at a radar plotted 42 knots.
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Old 18th June 2020, 13:24
blueprint2002 blueprint2002 is offline  
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The passenger ships known as the "Atlantic Greyhounds" were generally regarded as the fastest commercial ships of their time, the SS United States being one of the last, and certainly the fastest of all. From a 1977 SNAME paper on the subject, here is a table showing some details of a few examples, and for comparison the Sealand SL7 container ship as well.
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  #17  
Old 18th June 2020, 14:39
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Wwii hms manxman

Thanks for that but I fail to see any relevance to this thread.

Best wishes
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  #18  
Old 18th June 2020, 14:42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blueprint2002 View Post
The passenger ships known as the "Atlantic Greyhounds" were generally regarded as the fastest commercial ships of their time, the SS United States being one of the last, and certainly the fastest of all. From a 1977 SNAME paper on the subject, here is a table showing some details of a few examples, and for comparison the Sealand SL7 container ship as well.
Very interesting comparison. However, considering the years of build and DWT's, the Queen Mary is definitely the winner and was the most successful commercially. Interesting also that she registered 200,000 SHP on trials yet sailed at 158,000 SHP. She is also the only one still "in service" - A grand old lady indeed!
Rgds.
Dave
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