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Discussion Starter #1
ON SECOND THOUGHTS

In all the realms of human thought,
The wish to do things as they ought
To be done might not coincide,
With how they are done, far and wide.
And so, the fault to remedy,
Man thus concocts democracy.

The greatest good of greatest number
Requires the exercise of slumber
By all and sundry, notwithstanding
Warfare, politics, grandstanding.
The greatest wisdom of the gods
Confirms that even Homer nods.

And don’t we all? We all, we sundry
People end up in a quandary,
When, sometimes, even democrats
Would much prefer to eat their hats
Than carry out those things decided:
And wonder, have they been misguided?

It happens. What then should be done?
Resort to force and point of gun?
Of course not. Heaven yet forfend.
It’s time to further comprehend
The binding democrat decision;
And might it yet need some revision?

Two certainties are death and taxes.
No twitter, email, text or faxes
Can yet avoid the simple fact
That honest humans, when they act,
Will get it wrong from time to time.
To get it right? That is sublime.

BY
10th December 2018
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you, David.

While there's life, there's hope.

A lesson learned even earlier in life was that in navigation there is no such thing as democracy. In navigation, democracy matters not a row of beans. Another well-known failing of democracy became evident world-wide in the 1930s. It is infinitely more important to get things right, whatever any baying mob might have to say.
 

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That is because navigation is based on mathematics, astronomy and observational skill (of both hydrographers and their customers).

It is regrettable that we now take it for granted that we can have what we want and not what is practicable. We do not (I hope) go to the Borough Medical committee to ask them to vote on whether there must be cutting, and if so what is to be cut. We go to an expert.

It would be even more useful if E=mc^3 but voting for it would not make it so ('useful' providing we warned the nuclear industry a little ahead of the referendum, otherwise 'Brexit'! I suppose it would also remove any doubt about global warning too).
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Quite so. Amen to all of that.

The observation which seems to apply now is that democracy got us into the present mess and it seems to be quite wrong for anybody to suggest (or protest, as some do) that it should not be used further (and even that it would be undemocratic to use it further) to try to get us out of the mess. It seems to me to be entirely logical and democratically proper to have a second referendum if no satisfactory deal can be agreed.

Better, far, to correct an error than to perpetuate it.
 

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I agree Barrie. It is not that the first part of that same trick is not done every five years with the next stage often being different from the previous exercise.

As for the third stage, whether the jury would often consider its decisions faultless I think we must take as moot.
 

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May I suggest that we are in this mess, not because of democracy, but because of ineffective negotiators, administrators, advisors and politicians. Nothing wrong with democracy, but there is plenty wrong with those who deem themselves to be the arbiters. One only has to look at Nation States within the EU to see how poorly administered democracy can lead to unrest and protest.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Is the Prime Minister's decision to go back to Brussels a step in the right direction or merely the postponement of the inevitable?

Answers on a postcard, please.
 

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All

Here we go again. Political debate in the Pig & Whistle. Our rules under the Pig & Whistle heading clearly states: General Chit-Chat. Lightweight Off-topic Discussion, nothing political or heavy.

Stormy Weather was created for Off-topic Political & other touchy subjects. Members who wish to discuss these are free to join Stormy Weather. If members do not want to join Stormy Weather please understand that threads could be moved there.

As I have stated before, our job as moderators is to ensure the smooth running of the site, and that site rules/guidelines are adhered to.

Our site guidelines are here: https://www.shipsnostalgia.com/showthread.php?t=17182
 

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Dear Super Moderator,

I plead guilty to being a bad boy on many occasions and deserve a stiff talking to.
In my defence I wish to state that when I log on to SN.com a page opens with the 10 "Recent Threads", often a posting catches my eye and I feel animated to post a comment. I am, at that stage, not aware of which "Heading" the Thread belongs to and this has caused me to type "Shyte" in a family oriented Thread. Mea Maxima Culpa.
 

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David! Not a harsh word has so far been put. Not really even as far as the PM is concerned, just wishing her a pleasant weekend break in Belgium.
 
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